2011 NBA Trade Deadline Thread

Discussion in 'Golden State Warriors' started by jason bourne, Feb 5, 2011.

  1. jason bourne

    jason bourne JBB JustBBall Member

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    I haven't heard much trade rumors recently for the Warriors, but we need to upgrade the C position. Biedrins isn't even on the court much for the 4Q and we need help rebounding and blocking people out. How about dealing AB for Chris Kaman? I think it would be a straight across trade using our trade exception and Kaman's contract has only two years left versus Biedrins' four years.

    Chris Kaman is quick and runs the court well enough and is a legit 7-footer. He's quicker than DeAndre Jordan. Kaman had 3.37 3/4 court sprint and 11.33 lane agility in pre-draft measurements. DeAndre Jordan was 3.27 3/4 court sprint and 12.3 lane agility. He could be another potential all-star as he was a former one.
     
  2. Clif10

    Clif10 Member

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    I'm not big on Kaman. Besides his all-star season his stats look worse than Biedrins'. Plus he hasn't played since early December.

    Personnel wise I think this team is actually fine up front. I think Andris and Udoh sharing minutes at the five and Lee with Lou and B.Wright at four is good.

    The defense and rebounding is bad but I think a lot of it goes on the perimeter players. The bigs are always switching to help the perimeter players and the perimeter players stand in no-man's land while the open guy gets the ball back for an easy bucket or he is just open to get the offensive glass that has been killing us. I actually think the defense and especially rebounding can improve most by getting more effort from the smaller players. They need more hands on deck for the rebounding. I would really hate being the center for this team. There's not enough help. Even Wright is a bit too weak here. I've seen many free throw misses go to the other team's player who out powered Wright.

    I would love to see the Warriors add a Bobby Jackson, Earl Boykins or even a Brian Cardinal type of player to bring energy and scoring off the bench. Of course these players are all retired now. Maybe a Nate Robinson, though I am not sure if we can part with what it may take to get him.
     
  3. AlleyOop

    AlleyOop JBB JustBBall Member

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    As far as AB/Kaman, the only time a 1-for-1 swap of the same position makes sense--like trading a C for a C--is if one wants out, or is an expiring contract, or is chased out by the coach, etc. Otherwise, if it's purely talent for talent, a C for a C, then one of the two teams is getting the better end of the trade, so whichever team is not getting the better end should not make the trade! Although in this case I can't tell who would be getting the better end.

    As far as offense, I think GS offense is just fine. A post-playing C would be nice, a guy to finish, dunk, put-back, ala DeAndre Jordan, or even an option down low like Al Jefferson at this point... but that's the only position where we could use a boost offensively, and frankly there aren't a lot of centers out there. So maybe the Kaman thing does make sense...

    I think this team has one glaring weakness: toughness. Defensive toughness, rebounding toughness, ball control toughness. Like Utah, or the Bulls, or the Bucks.

    Our defensive perimeter is paper thin. Monta/Curry cannot contain penetration at all. Dorell Wright is touted as a good defender, and I like him... but he's nothing special defensively. Our power forward is a nice building piece for the future but he's a liability in there defensively. With a big 7-foot power center, then he'd be okay, I guess. But right now, not okay. And Beans is hit or miss with blocks/stupid fouls. There's a reason why GS is dead last in assists against... it's because our defensive awareness, and toughness, suck.

    Our guards and wings are also pretty careless with the ball. And just not tough with the ball. They don't rip it. They don't scrap with it. A lot of lolly-gagging one-handed passes. Cute, nonchalant gestures with ball control. Dorell Wright acting like he's the coolest cucumber in the salad, mr. smooth, he doesn't need to protect the ball at mid court, right? Just to get stripped easily for a layup on the other end. Or Curry, letting the inbounds pass go out in front of him on a lead, like he's going to preserve a few extra seconds on the shot clock, but --oops-- he didn't see the lurking defender waiting for such an error, and --oops-- Dorell Wright forgot to warn Curry about it when he tossed the ball out in front of Curry, so --oops--the defender comes and snatches it and then -- are you serious -- goes right up and scores over the both of them!

    Just lazy. Trying to be to "smooth." Not ripping the ball with two hands. No crisp chest passes. Lazy passes. Trying to look like you belong. There's nothing wrong with looking like you're really concerned with protecting the ball, guys! Especially if you have problems protecting it. But this is just immaturity. I'm going somewhere with this, yes.

    Also, this team lacks toughness on the offensive end. Monta is fearless, yes, albeit reckless and careless too. Now, Curry is showing signs of greatness when it comes to finishing inside. But our "big" three -- Wright/Lee/Beans have shown very little toughness inside. They have attitude, okay, but no finishing power goddammiit... Seriously, Dorell Wright is the weakest finisher in the league, dude. I'm not backing off that one. Lee is crafty, okay, but where is the McDonald's Dunk-Contest guy, the rookie-soph game MVP who dominates inside? He's resigned to taking jumpers or getting crafty floaters and bank shots. He's had a couple of fast-break dunks, but when was the last time you saw a GS front court player dunk on someone. Or tip-dunk in traffic? And Beans, he's just a trip... I don't really know what to say.

    But there's a reason why GS is dead last in FT attempts per game, in the league! And it's not our record. It's our toughness and finishing ability. Dorell Wright will turn an open layup into a fade-away reverse double pump as he falls to the floor without any contact. WTF is up with that?

    So... trade deadline... this team needs defense and toughness. And a little veteran leadership to show the young guys how to grow up, dig in on defense, and protect the ball.

    I'd look to cash in on Monta's value and get an SG who can defend. So, I still go Monta for Iggy+equalizer.

    Here's one that works:

    Monta + Gadz (exp) for Iggy + Lou Williams + Spencer Hawes

    http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=48oda49

    Also, Rip Hamilton was just deactivated for some reason. If he could be had for cheap, that would be some serious veteran leadership and a nice SG too...
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2011
  4. Clif10

    Clif10 Member

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    I actually think the low post offense is pretty decent. It's not like we have a star there but I think Biedrins has shown some nice moves and a good touch down there, especially since the new year. So has Udoh and Lee gets his points. They all shoot a good percentage. I think the team's offense is best when they run it through the post or high post with Lee. It was painful to watch the Bucks game because they were not giving the post players the ball while they were playing clueless and careless basketball on the perimeter. Also B Wright is a good scorer too. But you are right in that they are not powerful players. Now Lou and Gadz are horrible scorers. Their shots are always rejected.

    I think the main obstacle for this team is what Ally Oop said in his post. Just lack of toughness. I think adding a player like Rip Hamilton would be nice. Bring in some reserves so the starters can focus on making every play and not on trying to conserve so they are in the 40+ minutes per game that they are relied on for, may also add more toughness too. I'm more and more for Monta/Iggy deal...
     
  5. Custodianrules2

    Custodianrules2 Cohan + Rowell = Suck

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    Man I'd take Kaman trade, but only on the condition that he cuts his hair short.

    The reason I like Kaman over Biedrins is I think Kaman would be a lot more effective on the pick and roll. Kaman can shoot midrange shots, he can get fouled and make free throws, and he can score with his off hand. I thought both him and Elton Brand were very hard to stop once they got the ball in the paint.

    With Biedrins, even though he's only 24 years old, he just doesn't have the skills or the finesse to be more than what he is now. He's at a plateau, I think. I don't think Biedrins is the problem why we are losing, though. It's the fact we are so thin on the bench, we don't box out, people stand around and watch plays happen rather than react, and the fact our backcourt doesn't give us much defensively.
     
  6. jason bourne

    jason bourne JBB JustBBall Member

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    Last edited: Feb 6, 2011
  7. i hate the warriors

    i hate the warriors Slingboxing from LONDON

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    So, the question is: how much more than $7.5m a year does he want? And, would you pay that for him? He gets. $4.39m/yr now. I guess when you think $7.Xm is what Gadzuric and Radmanovic get paid, it doesn't seem like so much. How much would we have to pay MGasol? He is only paid $3.48m a year now, but he will no doubt get a big pay day. DeAndre Jordan only gets. $0.85m a year, so he too is gonna be getting quite a pay raise. What's he worth? Interesting trio of free agents. Looking at the Celtics' page on HoopsHype, I realized Glen Davis is a free agent too. For the right price, I wouldn't mind him coming off the bench.
     
  8. Zhone

    Zhone JBB JustBBall Member

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    I think Perkins is looking for somewhere between 10 and 12 million, and probably for 5+ years. His agent has to argue that he's worth the equivalent of Noah, or as a lot of articles suggest, definitely worth more than Brendan Haywood ($46 million over 6 years). Biedrins is getting $9 million per year, as have many average centers for the past few years. I used to feel that Perkins was underrated, but looking around at articles on his declining the extension, it seems that there is a more than healthy amount of respect for him, some even calling him one of the best defensive centers.

    Jordan and Gasol will probably get less, since they're restricted, but unless the CBA does something drastic, Jordan will no doubt reach the max MLE, and Gasol should get a contract starting at $7 million, and these are perhaps too low.

    As for other trade options involving bigs, I just don't see any good possibilities. Basically, we have to hope for rebuilding teams to give up talent, and even then, we don't have the young potential (in terms of young players or draft picks) that would tempt them. I just don't think that Biedrins has enough value around the league since he's just producing at a mediocre level at best.
     
  9. AlleyOop

    AlleyOop JBB JustBBall Member

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    We should shoot for a young, big C who hasn't produced yet or is not fitting. Remember how Tyson Chandler was kind of "cast out" before he emerged. Even Darko Milicic (playing well now), Kwamae Brown (he's not doing great but okay). Big men take years to develop sometimes. We should shoot on the young end of that spectrum. Imagine if we'd have snatched Darko off the scrap heap. He's 3rd in the league in blocks right now...

    If GS can swing an Iggy trade, there are several youn gbigs to toss in there, including Marese Speights and Spencer Hawes. In NJ, Johan Petro is a 7-0 C who is only 25... there's he 7-3 Nigerian Nightmare in Thabeet in Memphis... they've already given up on him... Hilton Armstrong is a 6-11 C, 26 years old, getting no run in Washington... although the guy I would really like to get from Washington (ever since I watched him in the summer league) is JaVale McGee...Washington also has another young 7-0 center named Hamady Ndiaye... I know nothing about this guy though...

    Roy Hibbert is really emerging in Indy... could GS swing a blockbuster for Granger/Hibbert? I'd consider Monta/Beans for that... though we'd need to decide on SG...unless we snatch Brandon Rush as well...
     
  10. i hate the warriors

    i hate the warriors Slingboxing from LONDON

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    You wouldn't run DWright at 2 with that lineup?
     
  11. AlleyOop

    AlleyOop JBB JustBBall Member

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    My brother asked the same thing, but I have reservations... he' been very versatile... but he's not a good-enough ball handler IMO, to do things like break the press if Curry is denied, or to create penetration for others. His main job is to catch and shoot, which is fine at SF, but an SG needs to be quick enough to be able to to drive, penetrate, and create plays, the way Monta does, so that the PG isn't the only one doing all the "work."

    Dorell does drive and kick sometimes, but he's just a bit slow. He's a very versatile SF, but I don't know about SG... The same way, after further speculation, that a guy like Anthony Randolph would not work at the SF (the way I had hoped)...
     
  12. jason bourne

    jason bourne JBB JustBBall Member

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    Jeez, if you're gonna have to dish out $50 - 60 M+ for Kendrick Perkins, then I rather make an offer to Nene. He makes about $11 M now and a 20% bump would be around $13.2 M/year to start for five years. The problem is he may want a ring, so would choose a playoff team while Perkins may go for the money since he has a ring. The key is to get rid of Biedrins four year contract at $9 M per year. I wonder if Charlotte would go for a younger center for Diaw or Wallace who have less years remaining.
     
  13. Zhone

    Zhone JBB JustBBall Member

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    Nene or Varajao were originally targets I considered, but I realized they're both going to be over 30 years old. Although bigs don't decline with age as rapidly as guards that rely on quickness, they still do succumb to injuries and time like any other player.

    If we're looking for a young big C that someone else has given up on, I can't think of someone that would be better than Udoh or even Amundsen. But I guess the theory is that they've got some untapped potential? So maybe we could try major projects like Thabeet, Byron Mullens, or Speights or Petro as mentioned above. It's sad that I keep thinking of random players, and they're all so much older than Biedrins, even D-Leaguers. And there isn't a great C in the draft this year (maybe Enes Kanter? though I haven't seen enough, just based on hype), so that's not a short-term solution either.
     
  14. Doctor Kajita

    Doctor Kajita Active Member

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    Perkins is only 26 so if he stays healthy, he's probably worth the 10 - 12M, considering what other centers are making. I wouldn't mind having Perkins on the team.

    AO mentioned Roy Hibbert. I think that guy is a stud. Even younger and bigger. Much more potential. Georgetown center. I'll take him!
     
  15. jason bourne

    jason bourne JBB JustBBall Member

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    I didn't know we've given up on Udoh ;).

    But if you meant Biedrins, that could be another story. He's putting up stats again, especially blocks, but I have to see him more in the 4Q for us to keep him. Since we do have Udoh and Amundson, I would deal AB if we can get someone like Boris Diaw who is 28 and has two years remaining. He and AB would be a straight across swap.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2011
  16. jason bourne

    jason bourne JBB JustBBall Member

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    SIAP, but this was first time I've seen an article on the Warriors being interested in Nene. Hope Biedrins gets a double-double :cool:.

    When the Warriors and Denver Nuggets meet Wednesday night at Oracle Arena, the visitors will have a player who could fill a serious need for Golden State.

    According to multiple sources, the Warriors have inquired about Nene, a 6-foot-11, 250-pound center from Brazil. But the Nuggets would have to agree to trade him, and Nene would have to agree to a contract extension because he is a pending free agent.

    So he remains a relative dream.

    "We have to look at what we have," Warriors coach Keith Smart said. "We can't wish and hope for something we don't have."

    Nene, who is averaging 15.3 points per game on an NBA-best 64.4 percent shooting, would seem to quench the Warriors' thirst for inside scoring.

    But help likely won't come before the Feb. 24 deadline, according to insiders. Some of the other bigs the Warriors would love -- such as Memphis' Marc Gasol -- aren't available, would require dismantling the nucleus of the team or don't want to sign with Golden State.

    That leaves the Warriors relying on a committee of post players.

    One of them doesn't believe management needs to acquire someone to fill the need.

    "Collectively, I would say yes we could do it," Andris Biedrins said about the Warriors' existing players. "If you just give us the opportunities, we can prove we don't need it."

    David Lee said he's getting his post game going again after having been predominantly a pick-and-roll player most of the time. In limited opportunities, rookie Ekpe Udoh has shown flashes of inside scoring ability.

    Biedrins said he could produce more inside if he gets the ball. And Brandan Wright said he is confident he can get the Warriors some offense inside, though he's hardly used.

    "You really have to ask Coach Smart why I couldn't help the team out in that (area)," said Wright, who scored on his one post-up attempt during just five minutes of play in Monday's 104-92 loss to Phoenix. "I guess I'm not the man for the job right now. I could easily produce. "... I feel good about my game."

    Smart said establishing the inside is going to take a team effort. The staff needs to develop the current players' abilities in that area. The perimeter players need to do a better job of looking inside. The big men need to demand the ball by getting in position and giving the entry passer a good target.

    In any case, an answer from another team won't be coming soon. The Warriors' best chance of landing a big man who can score inside, one team source said, will likely be in the offseason. But even that will depend on collective bargaining negotiations.

    So, until then, keep dreaming.

    # Dorell Wright was chosen to participate in the Three-Point Shootout during NBA All-Star Weekend. Many figured Warriors teammate Stephen Curry, last year's runner-up, would be selected. Instead, Wright, who leads the NBA with 124 made 3-pointers, will compete against 2010 champion Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, Kevin Durant, Daniel Gibson and James Jones on Feb. 19 at Los Angeles' Staples Center.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2011
  17. Clif10

    Clif10 Member

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    I am with the players responding to the journalist in regard to inside scoring. Between not getting enough minutes and stretches where the ball never leaves the perimeter players, it may be very hard to expect the bigs to show better offensive stats. Lou and Gadz are horrible with scoring, but the other four are capable of scoring. They may not be Shaq, but definitely serviceable. But I mean Brandan Wright has been used as the team's backup SF more than PF. I think that says a lot on this issue.
     
  18. jason bourne

    jason bourne JBB JustBBall Member

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    Joe Lacob on Keith Smart's rotations: "There are times that I do not understand it."
     
  19. AlleyOop

    AlleyOop JBB JustBBall Member

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    I think the Nene rumor is horrible for GS. What are they thinking? The guy makes $11.3 mils this year -- more than Monta or Beans...for 15 PPG and 7 RPG? Dorell Wright almost has better numbers than this guy. He gets 0.8 Blocks per game... Beans gets 1.0... Would he help? Well, if you just add him to the roster for cheap, yes, okay... but to trade Beans for him, and then sign an extension... he's going to want his 11 mils again... that's just ridiculous.... I'd rather suck for a few years and develop Udoh/BWright... draft a C.... etc.

    And P.S. I'd like to know why Brandan Wright isn't getting PT. I mean, he still hasn't had a solid run of being healthy. The team still does not really know what they have with him. He could be very good, or not. But now's the time to find out, dammit. That irks me.

    He probably has very little trade value right now, primarily because the Warriors have not shown the rest of the league what he can do since the shoulder. Either Keith Smart is trying to hide BWright from being exposed as a phony... or he doesn't understand development.


    Yes, you want to win games... but maybe BWright is the key to winning! We at least need to know whether he can help or not... from the little glimpses we get... I think he can definitely help...

    Looks like Hibbert is starting to get love now, so the market is high on him and it's a bad time to buy...should've tried to get him on the cheap before he emerged..

    Which is what the good GMs do... which is why Dorell Wright makes Larry Riley look more and more brilliant every day.

    What other "under the radar" young players might GS try to grab on the cheap before they "emerge" like Hibbert is doing? Any other centers come to mind?
     
  20. philsmith75

    philsmith75 JBB JustBBall Member

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    B Wright needs to get time NOW! He's shown flashes, now is the time to give him an extended run, 20-25 mins/gm. I bet he'd put up as good an effort as AB and there's the possibility of him exceeding them.

    Trade him? Watch, he'll develop into a better Bellinelli/Diogu/Pietrus. Those guys have gotten better than when they were here.

    I do not want to sink huge $$ into a Nene/Perkins. Go find your DeAndre Jordan.
     

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