Thread: Mock Drafts......

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    Default Mock Drafts......

    It was cool looking back on these mock drafts to see how right and wrong they are. Amazes me how many busts there are. We are all getting excited about our 11th pick or so and there have been so many scrubs in that area of the draft......


    http://www.insidehoops.com/nba-mock-draft.shtml
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by HCP View Post
    It was cool looking back on these mock drafts to see how right and wrong they are. Amazes me how many busts there are. We are all getting excited about our 11th pick or so and there have been so many scrubs in that area of the draft......


    http://www.insidehoops.com/nba-mock-draft.shtml
    I think people are excited about the chance of moving up IN the draft (due to the lottery), not the 11th spot itself.
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    This is why I'm glad we get a second crack (hopefully) at the lottery with Jersey's pick. It sort of like playing the slots, you want as many pulls as you can get and hope for the best ... now if only they had a GM
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    It seems like drafting should be a lot easier than it is. Too much emphasis is put on potential however, which only even pans out half the time.

    I think the number one thing to look at is a guy's mental attitude and work ethic. All these guys have tremendous talent. A good mindset will make an average talent great (Brandon Roy), and on the contrary, a bad one will ruin a great talent (Beasley, Thabeet, OJ Mayo, the list goes on...)

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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by C_note View Post
    I think the number one thing to look at is a guy's mental attitude and work ethic. All these guys have tremendous talent. A good mindset will make an average talent great (Brandon Roy), and on the contrary, a bad one will ruin a great talent (Beasley, Thabeet, OJ Mayo, the list goes on...)
    Kevin Pritchard agrees with you.
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Yeah, I think Pritchard was a great GM. Not much success past the lottery, but it's pretty much a craps shoot after that anyways.

    What the hell was he fired for anyways? Still unknown reasons/Paul Allen?

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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by C_note View Post
    It seems like drafting should be a lot easier than it is. Too much emphasis is put on potential however, which only even pans out half the time.

    I think the number one thing to look at is a guy's mental attitude and work ethic. All these guys have tremendous talent. A good mindset will make an average talent great (Brandon Roy), and on the contrary, a bad one will ruin a great talent (Beasley, Thabeet, OJ Mayo, the list goes on...)
    The trouble with this story is that Roy was actually an elite athlete (40" vert, great size for a 2, elite ball-handling skills, etc.)

    Work ethic and competitive fire are certainly important, but if you don't have the physical tools a player's ceiling is severely limited. The league's history is littered with "high character, average athletes" that never amounted to much -- Adam Morrison, Tyler Hansbrough -- the great ones have elite physical and mental attributes.
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by Nikolokolus View Post
    The trouble with this story is that Roy was actually an elite athlete (40" vert, great size for a 2, elite ball-handling skills, etc.)

    Work ethic and competitive fire are certainly important, but if you don't have the physical tools a player's ceiling is severely limited. The league's history is littered with "high character, average athletes" that never amounted to much -- Adam Morrison, Tyler Hansbrough -- the great ones have elite physical and mental attributes.
    I knew someone would bring this argument. I don't agree fully..

    Elite level in the NBA for a SG I'd say is 45+ vert....40 is above-average. 35 is around average roughly...elite is "best of the best", right?

    Roy had average size for a 2. Also at that point in his career, no one knew he had elite ball-handling skills. That wasn't evident until he got to the NBA level and started ripping apart the opponent's back court, night in and night out.

    But that's not my point. All of these guys in the lotto are typically "elite" athletes. Roy's athleticism didn't blow anyone away. If it did, he would have gone higher. He was more "average", as far as comparing elite athletes goes.

    So I'm operating under the assumption that, as long there is not a large gap between athleticism and the mental stuff (Morrison and others), teams should give more preference to the mental aspects of a guy.

    Ideally you want a good balance of both though, and Roy is the perfect example.

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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    God I miss Brandon!
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by julius View Post
    I think people are excited about the chance of moving up IN the draft (due to the lottery), not the 11th spot itself.
    I didn't mean people were excited for the 11th pick....... just the fact that people (including myself) are pumped because we are possibly going to have 2 nice lottery picks. This link shows how much the draft is a crapshoot! Experts don't even know what is really gonna' happen.
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    elite for a SG is a 45+ vert? wtf. so....nobody? Average size for a 2?

    his athleticism didn't blow people away because of his style. He was not just an average athlete, he was above average, he just has a more cerebral game. Doesn't mean the athleticism wasn't there.

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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Yes 6'5 is average for a SG. MJ, dominique, those guys have elite verts. I'd say anything 42 or above is truly elite. 45 is a little high. Although there's plenty of nba players you could find with 45 or more.

    And here you go, for your reference.

    e·lite
       [ih-leet, ey-leet] Show IPA
    noun
    1.
    ( often used with a plural verb ) the choice or best of anything considered collectively, as of a group or class of persons.
    2.
    ( used with a plural verb ) persons of the highest class: Only the elite were there.
    adjective
    5.
    representing the most choice or select; best: an elite group of authors.

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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by C_note View Post
    I'd say anything 42 or above is truly elite. 45 is a little high. Although there's plenty of nba players you could find with 45 or more.
    Plenty over 45? Really.

    http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-...ce=All&sort=12

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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by PtldPlatypus View Post
    Ok maybe not plenty, but there were some. Jordan was 48, Spud Webb 46, Steve Francis 46, I'm sure there are others.Wilt Chamberlain was said to have a 48 inch vert

    But my point the entire time was, 40" is not extraordinary amongst elite athletes. There are at least a handful of guys around this level every year. Athleticism means nothing if the guy is an idiot.

    Although I do admit 45+ is outlier territory.

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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    I'd be happy with a Paul George caliber player with the 11th pick.
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by C_note View Post
    Ok maybe not plenty, but there were some. Jordan was 48, Spud Webb 46, Steve Francis 46, I'm sure there are others.Wilt Chamberlain was said to have a 48 inch vert

    But my point the entire time was, 40" is not extraordinary amongst elite athletes. There are at least a handful of guys around this level every year. Athleticism means nothing if the guy is an idiot.

    Although I do admit 45+ is outlier territory.
    It's not just his vertical jump, it was his elite shot creating ability and elite ambidexterity that made him an elite physical specimen. Yes, he also had an elite mental makeup and worked very hard at his craft, but it's not like people can just will themselves to have great hand-eye-coordination or dexterity; that's part of their "athleticism"
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by C_note View Post
    Roy had average size for a 2.
    He was 6-7 and as husky as a PF. McMillan played him half his minutes at SF. His great size made him quite the inside player.
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by HCP View Post
    I didn't mean people were excited for the 11th pick....... just the fact that people (including myself) are pumped because we are possibly going to have 2 nice lottery picks. This link shows how much the draft is a crapshoot! Experts don't even know what is really gonna' happen.
    This is why I don't like tanking (unless situation like now with handful of games left and out of playoffs).

    It is such a crap shoot that the difference in a few draft spots vs. losing game after game after game doesn't seem worht it.

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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by Nikolokolus View Post
    It's not just his vertical jump, it was his elite shot creating ability and elite ambidexterity that made him an elite physical specimen. Yes, he also had an elite mental makeup and worked very hard at his craft, but it's not like people can just will themselves to have great hand-eye-coordination or dexterity; that's part of their "athleticism"
    Plus, when he came out of HS and was thinking of the draft (due to academic issues), he was seen mostly as a high flyer, not the methodical killer we knew him to be as a Blazer. So he had elite athleticism, even if he chose not to show it all the time.


    Quote Originally Posted by jlprk
    He was 6-7 and as husky as a PF. McMillan played him half his minutes at SF. His great size made him quite the inside player.
    When was this? Maybe for very short spurts, but his Sr season we had Brockman, Mike Jensen and Jamaal Williams as bigs. They all played a lot. Plus, Bobby Jones was the main 3. Brandon played mostly at the 2.

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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    ^ I think he was saying that Brandon was one of the strongest 2 guards in the game.
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by C_note View Post
    Wilt Chamberlain was said to have a 48 inch vert
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by Nikolokolus View Post
    It's not just his vertical jump, it was his elite shot creating ability and elite ambidexterity that made him an elite physical specimen. Yes, he also had an elite mental makeup and worked very hard at his craft, but it's not like people can just will themselves to have great hand-eye-coordination or dexterity; that's part of their "athleticism"
    Ya I agree, vertical is overrated as far as athleticism goes. But no one knew Roy had so much potential, I think his attitude played the biggest part for him in realizing it, not so much his innate abilities.

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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    6'7? Roy is 6'5 without shoes, 6'6 with...average SG.

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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by C_note View Post
    Ya I agree, vertical is overrated as far as athleticism goes. But no one knew Roy had so much potential, I think his attitude played the biggest part for him in realizing it, not so much his innate abilities.
    Roy had injury issues at Washington and there were concerns about his knees holding up when he entered the draft which pushed him down the board ... being a senior also had people concerned that he might have been close to maxed out in terms of potential. Beyond that if he didn't have the level of body control and physical attributes he possessed he'd just be another Adam Morrison story.
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    Default Re: Mock Drafts......

    Quote Originally Posted by Nikolokolus View Post
    Roy had injury issues at Washington and there were concerns about his knees holding up when he entered the draft which pushed him down the board ... being a senior also had people concerned that he might have been close to maxed out in terms of potential. Beyond that if he didn't have the level of body control and physical attributes he possessed he'd just be another Adam Morrison story.
    What other player on the Blazers who was supposed to be a physical beast and have good body control(this one is a tad bit of a reach since he was always considered clumsy) is essentially another Adam Morrison but playing a different position? Oh hello Thabeet.

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