Thonus: ESPN's new stat shows Carlos Boozer as one of the worst players in NBA

Discussion in 'Chicago Bulls' started by truebluefan, Apr 9, 2014.

  1. truebluefan

    truebluefan Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    Read more on Noah, Gibson, and Augustin at link: http://www.chicagonow.com/chicago-b...os-boozer-as-one-of-the-worst-players-in-nba/
     
  2. such sweet thunder

    such sweet thunder Member Staff Member Moderator

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    That snipit makes you think, doesn't it? I have no idea what the new advanced stats from ESPN mean but I think I agree with Thonus' sentiment.

    I've been slowing coming around to the fact that Thibodeau's schemes are the reason Boozer's looked so god awful on defense the last few years. The schemes are entirely based around bigman footspeed and the ability for all five players to be able to guard perimeter players. I think Carlos would be downright average -- slightly below, probably -- in other systems that don't rely on his weakness.

    Where I think Carlos Boozer's career has gone of the rails is on the offensive end. What do you do with a stretch four, with a slow release who can't shoot threes? I have no solid opinion yet on whether Boozer's struggles on offense could also be attributable to Thib's schemes. But I wouldn't be surprised if he'd struggle offensively on most teams. You probably need a quicker release from that position if you're tying to play free throw line extended.
     
  3. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Agreed about Thibs' schemes and Boozer. On OAnd D both.

    I'm not sure this advanced stat is any good. DJ is horrible, and Taj us our best player?

    Even Thonus finds it highly dubious of any value:

    I don't know how much I'd rely on this stat. Much like the net +/- number on 82games.com, it backs up some things that make sense to me while flying in the face of other things I think are obviously true. I personally can't put too much faith in it without knowing more about how the stat is calculated though.

    ---

    And I disagree that Boozer is a zero if his shots aren't falling. Every defensive rebound he gets is the end of the opponent's possession.

    Boozer, as poorly as he's played, is still our best offensive player. Fredette hasn't played enough to qualify. Dunleavy or DJ would be 2nd best. Our offense stinks that much.
     
  4. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    I think Thonus "buried the lead." According to ESPN's Real Plus Minus (RPM), D.J. Augustin downright sucks. He's worse than Boozer. Worse than Nazr. In fact, the only Bulls' player he's not worse than is Snell.

    I gotta schedule an appointment with my ophthalmologist.
     
  5. kukoc4ever

    kukoc4ever Let's win a ring! Staff Member Moderator

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    New stats have to past the eye test. Ranking DJ as a lousy player this season for the Bulls is a rough start for this one. Of course, it was unclear if it was DJ's play all season, or just his play for the Bulls, that was being evaluated here.
     
  6. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    DJ played 82 minutes for Toronto. It's hard to see how those dragged down the ~1800 he's played with the Bulls.
     
  7. TomBoerwinkle#1

    TomBoerwinkle#1 Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    For the record I know Thonus and think he is a class 1 jackhole who gets and spins spoonfed data from his connections at DX. Beyond those connections he is a pretty below average vanilla guy.
     
  8. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Augustin's RPM is -4.66, ranking him #404 of 435. His offensive RPM (ORPM) is -0.49 and his defensive RPM (DRPM) is -4.17 (BTW, Fredette has the worst DRPM in the league at -5.42).

    I'll give 'em the DRPM though it seems a bit harsh based on my eye test. This said, someone has to explain to me how a player playing on the lowest-scoring team in the league can average 17.5 points and 6 assists per 36 while maintaining a stellar 2.7 assist/turnover ratio and team-high TS% of .578 yet somehow be considered below average (zero is the league average) offensively.

    A real head-scratcher, this is.
     
  9. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    If a guy plays nothing but garbage time minutes, you'd expect his defensive RPM to be horrible. It's often like watching the all-star game - all offense, no defense.
     

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