Stephon Marbury had 31 points on 10-19 shooting yesterday along with 8 assists but, we still managed to find a way to lose the game yesterday. Everybody probably already heard the statement the best PG in the league. Yesterday he said ?it?s like asking somebody if it?s raining outside and it?s raining.? To me, if you are going to have the audacity to make such a strong statement you better back it up homie! The PG is supposed to be a leader on the floor however, he is not a leader therefore, what he is said is ridiculous. Marbury missed many clutch freethrows which really cost us the game down the stretch. I am very confident that we could have won the game yesterday had Marbury made his freethrows. We also experienced this against Orlando when Marbury bricked the 2 freethrows and was costly in the game. And even bringing I back to last season, Marbury missed those game 3 freethrows against New Jersey which ended again costly for us as we lost a close one. On other occasions you have games where Marbury just explodes and leads us to victory like Wednesday against Minnesota. This shows Marbury is inconsistent in the clutch.Although Marbury;s attitude has gotten better, I still don?t think it is at leadership quality yet. Therefore, maybe Lenny Wilkens?s decision of making Marbury a captain was perhaps too early. In addition, Marbury only plays on one side of the floor. Marbury?s handle is as good as they come and is an excellent scorer but, on defense?absolutely horrendous. Isiah Thomas could not have been more clear when he said that Marbury was the worst defensive guard in the league. So, what Marbury does is plays even better offense but, he continues his usual atrocious defense. On Monday Francis had a decent 25 point game. Sam Cassell was struggling a bit because of overall better Knick effort on defense and he had somewhat of a bad night. His struggling was definitely not due to the defensive prowess of Stephon Marbury. I only saw about half of the game on TV (stingy brother) but, I heard the rest on the radio. You can not believe all of the times I heard Spencer Ross say and another layup for Jason Kidd. Atleast for me, anytime you have someone just coming back from knee surgery, beat you to the hole, it is a sign of dreadful defense. But again, I didn?t see the game however, the way Mr. Spencer describes it, it sounds as if Kidd had the best game of the season. I am sure almost all of you are familiar with the phrase ?defense wins championships.? Now the Knicks have a good amount of offensive weapons like Houston, Crawford (when he comes back), Marbury, Nazr, Kurt, and even JYD can give them an occasional lift. Do you guys wonder why that second unit of Moochie Norris, Sweetney, Kurt Thomas, Ariza and JYD, always seems to be effective? Because it is an evenly balanced attack. The other Knicks are just offensively oriented and allow the other team so many opportunities. When the Knick starters are having a bad day games= games like against Dallas occur. Marbury is a good player but, maybe somewhat overrated because of his highlights or his numbers. I think his lack of success in his 8 year NBA career, is partly due to him and some of his flaws. I hope it doesn?t sound as if I?m bashing Marbury, because he has done many great things for us. I just wanted to point out some of my concerns. I don?t know how to say it better than Tim Thomas is a grade A bum. He makes the bums you see at the subway look like Bill Gates. Tribute, my bad homie, I would rather have KVH over TT on any day. In fact, I would rather have my grandma starting at that SF spot. Maybe even Carlton Banks on the Fresh Prince, or maybe even Gary Coleman! It wont matter of the height, Tim Thomas doesn?t use his either. He too plays like he is only 4 feet tall. I mean the guy is 6?10 and yet manages to find a way to average 3.4 rebounds per game. I have no idea how that is possible. Tribute you should be an NBA scout. If you could perceive Tim Thomas being a bum at this level I wonder what else you might see! I?ve heard the whole family situation. He said his sister and his cousin died and I really do feel sorry for him. But, the Knicks do not have the time for him to find his groove. If he feels he can not be effective which has clearly shown, don?t play. Now I am not asking him to take it as well as when Frank Williams did or Ben Wallace. They took some time off but, as soon as they came back they became effective again. When he plays this dismal basketball he is taking away possible shots for our key players and role players. I am sure players like Allan Houston, or Stephon Marbury could have made atleast some of the 15 shots he missed attempted out of 18 The thing that really gets to me is the man has all the talent in the world to be a superstar. He is strong, athletic, tall, and versatile. But, the man is lazy plain and simple. How is it that PG?s about 6?2, or 6?3 in this league average more rebounds than him? I really can?t understand that. Can someone please tell me how? You know what? I would rather have KVH than him anyday, hour minute or second of the week. KVH was playing some spectacular basketball for us. Sometimes he played a bit soft, but, he was having the best year in his career consistency wise. I remember he had this little 9 game streak with 20+ points. He was a guaranteed 17 and 7 kind of guy. He also had his fair share of highlights like that reverse dunk on Radmanovic . But, more important than the highlight reels he was beneficial to us. There is no question in my mind that if KVH were here, we would have atleast 20 wins by now. But, for some reason, Isiah felt that a man averaging a career high of 14ppg and an amazing 5 rebounds per game could prove to help this team. I still have my doubts about the ?Nazr was the key thing.? I heard he traded him because he had some beef with his agent. He also tried to trade him a number of times as well before the deadline. This will shortly lead into my concerns on Isiah Thomas. But, close out on our starting Fugazy, I really thought this guy would improve I had all the faith in the world but, after I saw him this season I lost all of that. Any Knick fan or human being on this earth that still believes in Tim Thomas should be given props because of their great faith! Knicks Analyst, I read your resolution on Tim Thomas. However, there is no resolution good enough to fix this problem. For him to become half way decent will require nothing short of a pure miracle! He is the other dangerous Thomas not on the court but, sitting at the desk. Do you guys ever wonder if the Knicks can ever really go far? Well many of Isiah Thomas? moves, I think are for temporary purposes. I think he decides to do things just to be immediately better because either he doesn?t have the patience, or he wants the praise of the unopened eyes. I was just like this but, after I took a closer look and really started analyzing and thinking I realized I was a blind dude on a bandwagon. Do you guys remember a young guy by the name of Frank Williams? For those who do, he clearly had a great future. I remember many of the things he did when he got sufficient time. Do you guys remember that game where he had 12 points in about half a quarter against the Lakers last season? Or maybe that time when he had 10 points and 10 assists in only one quarter of play. Or that time he gave us 17 against the T?Wolves. Let?s not forget those 14 points against the Grizzlies! How about what he did in the playoffs! The fact of the matter is Frank has really shown us some flashes that he could clearly become very valuable to us. Isiah Thomas brought in Marbury and it was almost as if that move killed the growth of him. This guy could have been really good for us. That?s exactly why I don?t really want Abdur-Rahim, or definitely not Walker, or the rest of these guys. These guys will only kill the development of Sweetney just like Frank Williams. Sure we might get a couple of more wins in the season but, a franchise is not one year therefore the future of the club should be considered. Isiah Thomas also gave up 2 potentially good players, and the projected next Dirk Nowitzki for Marbury. Look at Phoenix now. I remember hearing the Suns are stupid, why trade Marbury look what you got. Now look at them. They currently hold the best record in the league. Now you tell me did they get the short end of the stick. While Phoenix was doing the smart thing in seeing what was good for the future, we came and decided what was good now. The Knicks could have made the playoffs had Marbury not been here either. I wont talk about the deal too much because we got a decent player in it however, indeed very risky, and I think getting Marbury would have required much less work. I already said my opinion about the KVH/TT deal so I will leave that one alone. Finally, I will say I he shouldn?t let his personal matters get into the way of the business of his job. I wouldn?t trade a player because of his agent nor my personal feelings on them. The teams performance is the most important part. The firing of Don Chaney was also a ridiculous way of handling things. I read in the paper that Fratello was not interested in coaching the Knicks?but, if he chose Lenny over him Isiah is a fool. I also thought it was interesting how there is only one white person on the team, and what he said about Larry Bird. Hmm?I wonder what this means about him. What do you guys feel about it? I find it very peculiar. I will be real brief on this guy because taking a little look at the ?What we really need is?? thread, it looks as though Tribute has gotten that part covered . I feel Lenny Wilkens is not a good fit for his team and is a very mediocre coach if not bad. People are loving this cat because he has the most wins ever but, let?s not forget he also has the most losses! For such a veteran he makes some of the most awful decisions. The one that really never left me quite yet is that zone on the Mavericks. You had 3 people on the floor that shot over 40% from behind the arc and yet you play zone?!?! Also there is another one that I can?t understand. When he puts an effective unit on the floor, why not keep it there? He always seems to substitute right after the team has gotten us back into the game. Also he doen;t put any balance into the roster. Yesterday as we all saw was a good example of that fourth quarter collapse due to the imbalance. He also doesn?t know how to balance time either. How is it Bum, I mean Tim Thomas has averaged a pretty good chunk of 27 minutes per game. He sees that Thomas is ineffective and Ariza is but, my son isn?t getting burn even when he does his thing. Also I?m very sure Vin Baker could help much more than Tim Thomas and yet he gets playing time as little as Tim Thomas? work ethic. Also I see Sweetney on the bench many times too. I can not understand Lenny Wilkens at all. I bet I can coach the Knicks better than him! The Knicks are so unpredictable. I would say they are ?a box of chocolate?you never know what you?re going to get.? The games that we should be wining we are not. Now Washington increased with a win today but, a unnecessary loss yesterday to the Nets just got us further below in the standings. Boston also won yesterday and are doing better than I expected. If we keep on playing this inconsistent basketball, we are in trouble. We have all the weapons, and talent in the world. Let?s make a nice run and stay running instead of falling when it could have been avoided like yesterday.
You made some good points, the analysis could have been richer with some #'s thrown in there. And if you were trying to write an in-depth piece, you could've gone further in detail. This was a good read though. Nicely done. I'm glad I converted you to a fellow TT-Hater. I'm so proud.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Knicks Analyst:</div><div class="quote_post">You made some good points, the analysis could have been richer with some #'s thrown in there. And if you were trying to write an in-depth piece, you could've gone further in detail. This was a good read though. Nicely done. I'm glad I converted you to a fellow TT-Hater. I'm so proud. </div> To tell you the truth I was just writing and as I was letting all of my thoughts out it came out like that. I really never intended for it to be that long at all. It was just kind of like a freestyle. Good job Knicks Analyst in showing me the light
That pretty much hit the nail on the head. Marbury is a career loser. He leaves Minny and look at them. He leaves NJ and you see how well they did after he left. He leaves the Suns and they're the top of the league right now. I think most of this is Isiah's fault. He manages the team like its a fantasy basketball team. When he took over, I pretty much expected a rebuilding process, because I saw it as the only way to get out of the mess. However, Isiah pulled of a decent trade and I thought he had a plan to rebound without actually rebuilding. Looks like he just goes after every big name he sees, regardless of the contract or work ethic.
You know what a good trade might be in this case: Wade for Marbury. If the team that SM is on begins winning after he leaves, then the knick'll start winning after that trade, considering that Wade is a better winner . Just my 2 cents.
Miami would never do that. Wade fits with them perfectly and is already a star in this league in his second year. I can dream but, it will never happen. This is the closest thing Wade as been to being a Knick
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">Miami would never do that. Wade fits with them perfectly and is already a star in this league in his second year. I can dream but, it will never happen. This is the closest thing Wade as been to being a Knick </div> Also, it seems like Wade is the only star Shaquille O' Neal will get along with.
Man, you really put some thought into your posts . I liked where you said you'd rather have KVH than TT and I think I would too. It's a shame that Van Horn didn't get a full season in NY, cos he played pretty well while he was there. Also, they seem to have this thing about "playing down to the other team's level" - they'll go and beat the good teams and lose to the bad ones. Damn inconsistency! It seems to have been a trait of recent past Knick teams too. Why is it that Kurt Thomas plays good defense against Garnett, but doesn't play as well against the Nets?? Marbury should focus on playing the game, making his teammates better, playing defense. Maybe that cockiness will come back to bite him in the rear end somehow. It's ok to be confident, but those comments went over the top, IMO.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Man, you really put some thought into your posts . I liked where you said you'd rather have KVH than TT and I think I would too. It's a shame that Van Horn didn't get a full season in NY, cos he played pretty well while he was there.</div> Thanks, I do try Nylex . The trade was basically for Mohammed because TT is definitely not even playing basketball. It's like a 5-4. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">but those comments went over the top</div> Especially if he did not win the other day. Btw, if I have offended any TT fan I am sorry. But, I really can't see anyone actually being a fan of him expcept maybe his mother. Maybe not even...
!! Great post mrj18. You got almost everything right on the money mainly that starbury is a loser and that TT is a friekin idiot. I really enjoyed reading it and appreciated it.
My concern is that instead of rebuilding for a championship team, Isiah will continue to trade and the Knicks will stay as a mediocre playoff team.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Jwohl:</div><div class="quote_post">Great post mrj18. You got almost everything right on the money mainly that starbury is a loser and that TT is a friekin idiot. I really enjoyed reading it and appreciated it.</div> Thank You man. I've been seeing some of your posts too. Looks like you're a rising star here in the Knicks forum! <div class="quote_poster">Quoting R_ChutneY:</div><div class="quote_post">My concern is that instead of rebuilding for a championship team, Isiah will continue to trade and the Knicks will stay as a mediocre playoff team.</div> That's exactly my concern as well. The Knicks had more than enough good factors for a successful equation. I think he gave up on them just to become good temporarily however, I feel his route will end up in a dead end but, maybe backing up a bit, and taking a different route might have lead to a longer and more prosperous path. That's just my opinion though.
Golly mrj18 it looks like you actually read some of my old posts... I remember all those arguments we had...you were so convinced that Isiah Thomas was The Messiah for the New York Knicks...you've come a long way. Strange though, I said all this stuff months ago and people thought that I was crazy. You say this stuff...and your posts are deep and thoughtful. I guess that's how the cookie crumbles sometimes. But on to the matter at hand. You should be concerned. You dont need me to tell you that though. You said it all right there. I couldnt have said it better myself, well I actually I probably could have, but that's besides the point. The point is it's unlikely that were going to get anywhere with Isiah Thomas as the GM. And that he should be fired now along with Lenny. I'm convinced the immediate problem is the coaching but the bigger, deeper problem is Isiah. He's more concerned with chasing big name players than building a team that has a good chance at competing for the championship. This team will win now but despite having Trevor Ariza, Michael Sweetney and Jamal Crawford I am worried about the future. I get the feeling that he's going to trade one or more of these talented guys to get better right away. So if you dont like the direction the Knicks are heading in now...you're really not going to like what happens in the next few seasons.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Tribute to H2O:</div><div class="quote_post">Golly mrj18 it looks like you actually read some of my old posts... I remember all those arguments we had...you were so convinced that Isiah Thomas was The Messiah for the New York Knicks...you've come a long way. Strange though, I said all this stuff months ago and people thought that I was crazy. You say this stuff...and your posts are deep and thoughtful. I guess that's how the cookie crumbles sometimes. But on to the matter at hand. </div> Yeah, it was always you and me trying to convince him. And we argued on and on and on. And now, it looks like he finally learned. We got him!
I think it's just because when I first came here I had different views on the Knicks. When I posted sometimes it lacked the quality, but now, I am evolving as a poster and have come a long way from when I just came here back in late August. So, I think it might be more fo a surprise for them. From Waly, to Isiah, and the many other people I have changed my way of thinking. But, as I was analyzing them and on their future, I noticed the flaws as I wrote above. I also took a look at why some Knick fans like you 2 didn't like the TT, etc. So, after the analyzation and everything I changed my opinion. Their is always room for change guys Btw, imagine how I would look if I asked Knicks Analyst for a TT sig? Thanks a lot guys. I would have had bum written all over me. Literally!
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">Thanks, I do try Nylex . The trade was basically for Mohammed because TT is definitely not even playing basketball. It's like a 5-4.</div> Oops, I'd forgotten that Isiah had said Mohammed was a key part of the deal . I see your point about TT; he's been in a slump too long to call it a slump any more. I hear Ariza is a good defender and has a pretty good feel for the game, but doesn't have a jumpshot. If only Lenny would get him in some more. You'd think he'd see more time, what with Crawford and Penny being out.
Nice post mrj18.....interesting stuff certainly. I aint a big Tim Thomas fan either, I'd much rather have Sweetney playing in there with KT even though he isn't strictly a small forward.
I agree with your opinion of tim thomas Tim Thomas is absolutely horrible. Every time he touches the ball I cringe and my stomach churns. Your so right, he doesn't rebound, doesn't shoot well and cant post anyone up. I thought it was almost comical the other night when he kept trying to post up eddie jones and couldn't produce. He must of had the ball stolen 5 times just on the entry pass. He had a 5 inch advantage and couldn't produce, thats a bigger advantage than shaq vs. mohammed. I cant stand his game, I wouldn't be opposed to us trading for wally. I don't like giving up kurt thomas but wally is young and sweetney will get much more playing time. I understand that kurt gives us great mid range shooting but wally would pick up the slack. Also we might be able to get troy hudson in the package for almost nothing. This trade would make our starting five of steph, jamal, wally, sweetney, and mohammed very young and exciting to watch. If were going to be a 500 team anyway we should develop our younger players. I must say I like the way Isiah tries to make us better, I like the steph trade, he's one of the only players in the league that can take over a game. I think isiah swung and missed with tim thomas though. Its nice to know that i'm not the only one who cant stand T. thomas, he kills us night in and night out.
You guys really need to stop acting like you're the only ones who think Isiah Thomas is a bad GM, ask the entire Indiana fanbase...they'd tell you the same thing years ago. Ultimately, Thomas will make a bad trade and give another max contract to a mediocre player, but I'm more worried about Marbury and his leadership skills. I'm probably one of the few knicks fans who think he should be traded, because I just don't see this team going past the 2nd round with him as our PG.
