Good news!

[Denny Crane]

Remember when the smarmy answer to low paying jobs was "Yeah, I'm working three of them."?

Now just one low paying job seems like manna from Heaven. Times have changed.

There was a Clinton joke along those lines...

Clinton jogs into a McDonalds. The guy behind the counter recognizes him and tells him he's not going to vote for him next time around. Clinton says, "you do realize I've created millions of jobs!". And the guy responds, "yeah, I have 3 of them."

During his first term, jobs like food service and janitorial were the fastest growing sectors. After the Internet was privatized, a huge number of high tech jobs were created.

 

[Denny Crane]

There are many engineering jobs that aren't filled right now due to lack of labor supply. I'd submit that there aren't many engineering graduates who can't find a job, and fewer still with a Master's in a field and/or some research experience. English majors, sure. PoliSci? You bet. Metallurigical engineers? Materials designers? Nuclear physicists? All hiring right now.

A LOT of engineering jobs are being filled by foreigners here on visas. Michio Kaku says we have a serious brain drain going on because those guys end up going home.

 

[PapaG]

A few points.

Unemployment can never be zero. There is always going to be maybe 3% or 4% of the 120M workforce that is between jobs.

When we had ~4% unemployment, places like Burger King had to pay quite a bit higher than minimum wage because of supply/demand (supply being few available workers, demand being lots of people able to afford burgers).

When employment is near full, bigger govt. means govt. is starving the private sector for employees.

So yeah, it would be a great thing if McDonalds was hiring after others hired first.

It would also be a great indicator for the economy if the fastest growing sectors were high paying jobs.

I'm an independent business owner/contractor who doesn't pay my corporate taxes until the end of the year. I think I may be considered "unemployed", at least by the current standard used by the government. I wonder how many others like me dropped out of the traditional job market and went to a more streamlined business model? The venture capital days of 15 years ago are over, and now small businesses are being built largely by contracting out work to independent contractors and consultants, such as myself. It saves on payroll, benefits, and mostly, a large capital investment for the start-up. I work with two multi-million companies right now. One guy has one salaried employee (a director of engineering), and 2 independent consultants (one guy back east, me here in the west). The other guy has a secretary, and 3 independent consultants working on 2-year contracts. Yet we're generating revenue at a decent rate, and without any real overhead for any of us, and both businesses are growing rapidly.

It's how entrepeneurs are trying to survive right now. Trim costs, because there isn't much money out there to bankroll new projects.

 

[RR7]

500,000 new engineers?! I suppose if the goal is to educate our unemployed, then fine. But you're going to end up with a lot of overqualified people looking at lower jobs. Who is going to employ these new 500,000 skilled workers?

 

[DaLincolnJones]

I think this sums it up well.

The Gov says the unemployment is 9% when in fact it does not take into account those who no longer have benefits or are underemployed.

Jobs that had produced living wage incomes have all been shipped over seas. Companies like HP who once employed 13k employees at the location in Corvallis alone, only have retained ten percent of that workforce. Far too many tax breaks for companies to "help developing " countries. We now produce at a historic low.

 

[Denny Crane]

I'm an independent business owner/contractor who doesn't pay my corporate taxes until the end of the year. I think I may be considered "unemployed", at least by the current standard used by the government. I wonder how many others like me dropped out of the traditional job market and went to a more streamlined business model? The venture capital days of 15 years ago are over, and now small businesses are being built largely by contracting out work to independent contractors and consultants, such as myself. It saves on payroll, benefits, and mostly, a large capital investment for the start-up. I work with two multi-million companies right now. One guy has one salaried employee (a director of engineering), and 2 independent consultants (one guy back east, me here in the west). The other guy has a secretary, and 3 independent consultants working on 2-year contracts. Yet we're generating revenue at a decent rate, and without any real overhead for any of us, and both businesses are growing rapidly.

It's how entrepeneurs are trying to survive right now. Trim costs, because there isn't much money out there to bankroll new projects.

You're not unemployed if you're not eligible for unemployment benefits.

 

[barfo]

There are many engineering jobs that aren't filled right now due to lack of labor supply. I'd submit that there aren't many engineering graduates who can't find a job, and fewer still with a Master's in a field and/or some research experience. English majors, sure. PoliSci? You bet. Metallurigical engineers? Materials designers? Nuclear physicists? All hiring right now.

Well, good news for engineers then! Are salaries going up due to the shortage? Or are companies generally unwilling to bid up salaries in order to fill their open positions?

Is this shortage a new phenomenon, or has this been the status quo for N years?

barfo

 

[BrianFromWA]

don't know what it was before---I've only been in the civilian workforce for a few years.

But it's not that salaries are going up, it's that projects are taking longer because a man-year design project takes, say, a year instead of 3 months (if you had 4 guys instead of 1)

And one of the first things cut to maintain schedule is R&D. It's kind of a vicious cycle. But as someone with an engineering degree and a clearance, I had my pick of a few offers.

 

[barfo]

don't know what it was before---I've only been in the civilian workforce for a few years.

But it's not that salaries are going up, it's that projects are taking longer because a man-year design project takes, say, a year instead of 3 months (if you had 4 guys instead of 1)

That suggests that the shortage of engineers isn't considered a serious problem. "Ah, we can do without". It's still good news for those with the credentials to take one of those jobs - but it would be even better news if the employers felt they had to fill those jobs. Then there would be a bidding war for the services of the engineers who do exist. I'll note that given that circumstance, your plan of training many more engineers is likely to drive down the salary of engineers.

And one of the first things cut to maintain schedule is R&D. It's kind of a vicious cycle. But as someone with an engineering degree and a clearance, I had my pick of a few offers.

That's good - but not great. Jobs which might get cut at the whim of the bean-counters are definitely better than no jobs at all, but tend to make one save money rather than blowing it on the lastest whatever-it-is-that-excites-engineers. And it's better for the economy if you engineers blow your money.

barfo

 

[DaLincolnJones]

You're not unemployed if you're not eligible for unemployment benefits.

as far as the government figures, that is correct. If you listen to how they report the figures its always based on jobless claims. You ar not counted once you fall off for any reason. Makes the numbers look better..

 

[maxiep]

500,000 new engineers?! I suppose if the goal is to educate our unemployed, then fine. But you're going to end up with a lot of overqualified people looking at lower jobs. Who is going to employ these new 500,000 skilled workers?

Engineers create. You don't think they would start companies to sell their inventions? Fuck, this is sad. There appears to be an entire segment of society that can't figure out how to just do something themselves.

 

[maxiep]

When looking at unemployment statistics, one should look at the U6, not the U3.

 

[barfo]

Engineers create. You don't think they would start companies to sell their inventions? Fuck, this is sad. There appears to be an entire segment of society that can't figure out how to just do something themselves.

Some do, some don't. Not all engineers are inventors. Not all engineers are entrepreneurial. And for some types of engineers, entrepreneurship is not so feasible (aerospace engineers, nuclear engineers, chemical engineers, for example).

barfo

 

[barfo]

Looking at the word engineer repeated several times in my post, I started wondering about the word. Looked it up and discovered that a civil engineer was originally an engineer who wasn't a military engineer (the original engineers were military). Never knew that before. I always thought they were just more polite than the other engineers.

barfo

 

[julius]

Looking at the word engineer repeated several times in my post, I started wondering about the word. Looked it up and discovered that a civil engineer was originally an engineer who wasn't a military engineer (the original engineers were military). Never knew that before. I always thought they were just more polite than the other engineers.

barfo

Civil Engineer makes me think of a football game between Oregon State and Oregon.

This year it was 4 score and 7 points to Oregon, and....

 

[huevonkiller]

mcdonalds is terrible..low quality ingredients and plebians dirtying it up with their hands. but were all going to be eating there when the government takes it over as part of the road to serfdom :MARIS61:

Wendys for me.

 

[The_Lillard_King]

I have felt a slight change in the economic environment. I have heard many people echo the same thoughts.

It has been slow and slight, but definitely a change towards the positive again with some cautious optimism that it will slowly continue in this direction.