Good thing Blake's shooting well/Go after Conley?

[shamelessblazer]

It's a good thing Blake happens to be shooting the ball well...because he's doing everything else miserably. Blake has recently run the point about as well as Webster would (w/o the defense). I'm so sick of our terrible first half of third quarters and start to games (exception at the start tonight). It's so clear the Blake just contributes almost nothing and motivates no one to move on offense because he doesn't reward them.

Even though Nate stubbornly runs isolation plays into the ground, the players still move when Sergio comes in (tonight they didn't happen to make shots or catch the ball when he passed it though).

Now obviously Lamarcus has plain sucked lately, Greg's struggled, and Outlaw's gone back to Mr. Stagnant, but can't we attribute a little of all three to Blake never getting the ball to anyone for easy buckets.

Nate needs to step up the motion, Lamarcus needs to grow a pair, and Greg needs to become the player he's supposed to be, but does anyone else just feel sick of stagnant Blake ball?

I agree there's blame all around, Roy hasn't been doing anything but isolation lately either, but why not mix it up once in a while and let Rudy handle a little (instead of being a fixed spot up shooter), is anyone else longing for the Houston Rockets game Rudy running around Artest?

All this to say: It's a shared blame, but having a PG who gets out more in the open court and makes more aggressive passes in the half-court could help us.

Conley's value is extremely low, and he's working with a team full of guys who have no idea of how to do anything other than score 1 on 1 with no post threat (of course he looks bad), is it the right time to make a move for him.

I would imagine Blake, Outlaw, and Diogu for Conley and Walker (expiring) would work out, would you guys make the trade now? I really think we could use someone to feed the post and get our guys some easy buckets, he has chemistry with Greg, it would consolidate some guys, and KP was supposedly very high on him pre-draft and rumored to be pursuing him with Outlaw already.

We'd still have plenty of depth:
Conley/Sergio/Bayless (of course combined it's really only 30 mpg with Roy and Rudy)
Roy/Fernandez
Webster/Batum
Aldridge/Frye/Randolph/Walker
Oden/Pryzbilla/Lafrentz

The 1 spot is very inexperienced, but the SG is always the leader on the floor for our team anyways, Conley has better handles and leads the break better than Blake anyways (two main things we need out of a PG), and I'm willing to learn through some aggressive mistakes, rather than passive hesitation basketball (where we just look at Roy).

Of course I'd still rather go: Bayless, Blake, Outlaw for Nash, but I'm not sure Phoenix is ready for that yet...

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

I actually had a gut feeling for a while now that we're going to push for Conley by the deadline.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Not in love with Conley's game at all. I don't know if his suckiness is just a result of being poorly coached and used inappropriately or not, since I would rather stick a hot poker in my urethra than watch a Memphis game, but the fact remains that he is sucking a big fat one right now and I'm not sure what value there is in adding yet another insanely young point guard to our roster.

Blake and Sergio at the point may not be all-world, but it's been pretty steady so far. If there's going to be a trade please for the love of god, let it be for a veteran, legit starting quality, point guard.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

Conley has been unimpressive this season but Mike has a lot of potential. He has Tony Parker quickness and is a good leader. His trade value is at an all-time low, he may be worth a shot.

 

[MARIS61]

Conley sucks, belongs in the D league right now.

Hand the reins to Sergio and get out of the way.

 

[C_note]

I was never impressed with Conley and was shocked to see him shoot up the draft board projections late that year...then taken 4th. He may have PG skills, but they were surely inflated, playing with a beast like Oden in college. I hope we stay away from him.

 

[Rodolfo]

Conley sucks, belongs in the D league right now.

Hand the reins to Sergio and get out of the way.

Sergio is definitely improved from last year...I think we have to stick with him and let him continue to develop. Dude's only 21.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

I like what I see in Sergio. But his offense will hold him back. He can't shoot to save his life and is not a good finisher at the rim. Same problem Telfair has, except Sergio is by far a greater playmaker.

 

[Rodolfo]

Maybe Sergio should think about re-inventing his jumpshot? It's like he's throwing up laser beams out there.

 

[craigehlo]

Maybe Sergio should think about re-inventing his jumpshot? It's like he's throwing up laser beams out there.

Didn't he spend the summer working on it? Lot of help that did. I think it's too late for him to develop a consistent jumper at this point.

 

[number 10]

Sergio is definitely improved from last year...I think we have to stick with him and let him continue to develop. Dude's only 21.

he's 22

 

[shamelessblazer]

Conley sucks, belongs in the D league right now.

Hand the reins to Sergio and get out of the way.

with Conley and Oden in the second unit?

Sergio/Roy/Batum/Aldridge/Pryzbilla

Conley/Rudy/Webster/Frye/Oden

with Roy/Rudy closing
and Sergio/Rudy getting quite a bit of burn

 

[Boob-No-More]

I was high on Conley heading into the 2007 draft and was hoping we could move Jarrett Jack for the 10th or 11h pick and grab him. That was before he shot all the way up to being a top 4 pick. He has been underwhelming so far, but learning to be an NBA PG takes time, especially when you have weak jump shot. Teams will back off you, clog the passing lanes and dare you to shoot.

Anyone remember all the "Gary Payton is a bust" talk his first two seasons in the league? It wasn't until he spent a summer with Tim Grgurich working on his jump shot that Payton became a solid NBA PG. Conley is in a similar situation. His rookie number weren't that far off Payton's (more points, fewer assists, similar PER). The difference being Payton was a 4-year starter at Oregon State and Conley played just one year of college ball. He still has the potential to develop into a solid NBA PG, but he's a long way away and it will take time.

He's been playing better lately, but it still very inconsistent, which is typical for a young PG. He certainly isn't ready to start for the Blazers. So, trading Blake (plus others) for him would hurt our play-off chances this season. So, while I haven't given up on Conley, I'm not sure a trade of him for Blake makes sense right now. Blake is solid, knocks down the open shots, hands the ball to Roy and gets out of the way and doesn't make stupid turnovers. Not exactly a Hall of Fame resume, but you know what you're getting from him every night and that might be better short term than an up and down young PG like Conley.

BNM

 

[shamelessblazer]

He certainly isn't ready to start for the Blazers. So, trading Blake (plus others) for him would hurt our play-off chances this season. So, while I haven't given up on Conley, I'm not sure a trade of him for Blake makes sense right now. Blake is solid, knocks down the open shots, hands the ball to Roy and gets out of the way and doesn't make stupid turnovers.

I think you forgot that Roy currently plays PG for us. No one worries about starting a rookie SG, everyone frets about a rookie PG. our SG plays PG so it's not a big deal. It just means we rely on Roy and Rudy a lot, as is if either goes down already we're in trouble.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I think you forgot that Roy currently plays PG for us. No one worries about starting a rookie SG, everyone frets about a rookie PG. our SG plays PG so it's not a big deal. It just means we rely on Roy and Rudy a lot, as is if either goes down already we're in trouble.

In which case, Blake, who can hit on open jumper when the defense collapses on Roy, is a better fit than Conley, who can't. So, I still don't see why we should trade Blake for Conley.

If it's so Conley can be our PG of the future, I don't see that either. Bayless has all the same strengths as Conley, plus he's 2" taller and a year younger. I'd rather keep Blake and count on Bayless as out PG of the future. Trading for Conley would hurt us short term and he'd be redundant long term.

BNM

 

[shamelessblazer]

Bayless has all the same strengths as Conley, plus he's 2" taller and a year younger.

Conley's strengths are ballhandling, court vision, and pushing the tempo, Bayless is terrible at all three. Plus I don't think Memphis would have a strong interest in Bayless w/Mayo there, we could probably keep him.

The rumor I hear about Bayless is that (in addition to pt situation) he hates Portland and would like to play in Miami, but I'm not banking on it.

However...
Bayless/Raef/Blake/Outlaw for Marion/Livingston/Conley
Warrick/Conley for Blake/Outlaw
Marion/Livingston for Bayless/Raef/Warrick

sounds alright to me...

 

[C_note]

There's an extremely low chance Sergio will improve his shooting at this point...you either have it, or you don't. I don't know what the hell his problem is, but he just can't shoot for shit. I had high hopes for him his rookie year, but now I think I've gotta face the facts: Sergio sucks ass at shooting and will never be any better.

 

[BatumKaboom]

No!!!! Why trade someone who is kicking ass???? Blake needs to stay. You will miss him when he is gone.

 

[tlongII]

Saying Blake was the reason for our lackluster performance last night is way off the mark. Aldridge, Outlaw, and Oden were the primary reasons we didn't play well, not Blake.

 

[shamelessblazer]

There's an extremely low chance Sergio will improve his shooting at this point...you either have it, or you don't. I don't know what the hell his problem is, but he just can't shoot for shit. I had high hopes for him his rookie year, but now I think I've gotta face the facts: Sergio sucks ass at shooting and will never be any better.

bad shooters their first couple of years in the league:
Stockton
Hornacek
Glen Rice
Paul
Kidd (still)

etc etc etc

teams that draft "shooters" end up with very 1 dimensional players, he's 22, give it some time, these guys don't have tons of practice time during a season with all the travel. The nice thing about our second half being so light is we'll get lots of practice/rest/going over sets time and be real ready for the playoffs (in theory).

 

[shamelessblazer]

Saying Blake was the reason for our lackluster performance last night is way off the mark. Aldridge, Outlaw, and Oden were the primary reasons we didn't play well, not Blake.

none of them (who are all very athletic) get any easy buckets EVER with Blake in. A good PG gets a struggling guy an easy bucket to help him get going, simple as that.

 

[Boob-No-More]

none of them (who are all very athletic) get any easy buckets EVER with Blake in. A good PG gets a struggling guy an easy bucket to help him get going, simple as that.

I thought you said Roy was our PG. So, if Blake doesn't have the ball in his hands, why is it his fault his teammates aren't getting any easy baskets?

BNM

 

[PapaG]

First you people run Jarrett Jack, the one player off the bench that could get to the foul line, out of town for a rookie who doesn't play, and now Steve Blake is the target.

Blake had 12 pts, 5 assists, 4 steals, and 3 rebounds last night, and some people want to trade him for a bust like Mike Conley.

Wow.

 

[Tortimer]

First you people run Jarrett Jack, the one player off the bench that could get to the foul line, out of town for a rookie who doesn't play, and now Steve Blake is the target.

Blake had 12 pts, 5 assists, 4 steals, and 3 rebounds last night, and some people want to trade him for a bust like Mike Conley.

Wow.

I agree and think Blake has played pretty well lately. I'm still glad we traded Jack though. I think Bayless is going to be good for us when he gets a chance to play. I think eventually Blake would make a great backup PG if Bayless developes or we trade for a better PG.

 

[MrJayremmie]

Bayless, Sergio, Blake >> Conley.

Just because Conley is young, was a high draft pick, and played with oden doesn't mean we should trade for him. It makes our team WORSE.

Bad idea.

 

[PapaG]

I agree and think Blake has played pretty well lately. I'm still glad we traded Jack though. I think Bayless is going to be good for us when he gets a chance to play. I think eventually Blake would make a great backup PG if Bayless developes or we trade for a better PG.

I tend to agree with this, but as for right now. with all of the handwringing about being a jump-shooting team, I find it hilarious that many of those same posters were criticizing Jarrett Jack for turning the ball over while penetrating the lane last season.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Conley's strengths are ballhandling, court vision, and pushing the tempo, Bayless is terrible at all three. Plus I don't think Memphis would have a strong interest in Bayless w/Mayo there, we could probably keep him.

If Conley is so great at court vision, ballhandling and pushing the tempo, why is he only averaging 3.9 APG? He plays in Marc Iavaroni's run and gun D'Antoni-style offense, with two very athletic high scoring wing players, yet he averages fewer APG than Steve Blake who is basically a spot-up shooter and secondary ballhandler.

If Conley is really what you claim (his stats say otherwise), wouldn't he just take the ball out of Brandon Roy's hands? Blake, with his ability to actually make an open shot - especially open 3-pointers, is a better fit next to Roy than Conley. I wish Blake was playing better defense, but it's not like Conley is a lock down defender. Blake knows his role and fills it well. While the offense may not run through Blake, his ability to hit the 3-pointer (0.426 3FG%) helps spread the defense and create openings for his teammates. Conley is a worse creator than Roy and a far, far worse shooter than Blake. His 0.167 3FGA% isn't going to spread the floor. In fact, the opposite is true. With him in the game, opposing defenses can play a tight zone, clog the lane and dare him to shoot from the outside. Blake makes team's pay for doubling Roy, Conley wouldn't.

He's a worse creator than Roy and a worse shooter than Blake. Exactly how would he improve this team? I don't totally dislike Conley as a player, but I just don't see how he improves our team and losing Steve Blake's outside shooting would definitely hurt the team. So, your proposed trade seems like a step in the wrong direction to me.

BNM

 

[PapaG]

Mike Conley -

37% FG/17% 3 pt FG, 75% FT (but only 20 attempts in 14 games), 6.7 ppg, 3.9 apg, 1.4 TO/game for a 4-10 team.

I'm sorry, but whoever started this thread has basically zero credibility from my perspective.

 

[Tortimer]

I tend to agree with this, but as for right now. with all of the handwringing about being a jump-shooting team, I find it hilarious that many of those same posters were criticizing Jarrett Jack for turning the ball over while penetrating the lane last season.

The thing I though we would miss from Jack is penetrating. Right now Roy is the only player we have that drives to the basket. I do think Bayless and maybe Rudy can penetrate but haven't because of not playing and possibly not playing Rudy correct. I'm not sure we are using Rudy to get the most out of his abilities. I do have to admit though Jack did drive me crazy sometimes with him stepping out of bounds but I didn't mind the TO's as much if he was drawing fouls. I do think Bayless will be the better player if he gets the chance. If he doesn't with us he will be a better player on another team IMO.

 

[MrJayremmie]

Yeah, when you really look at Conley, his game isn't what we need at all.

That isn't taking into account that he isn't all that good of an NBA player.