I think there's a good chance we don't make a trade

[Natebishop3]

At least not during the season. We can't even trade Crabbe/Harkless/Leonard until after January 15th, CJ until after January 27th.

I think there's a good chance we hold onto what we have, let these guys develop some chemistry, and then make a move next summer when Crabbe might be a little easier to move.

It also seems like the guys are improving.

Turner is playing a lot better. Over the last 10 games he's averaging 11 points, 3.8 assists, 4.6 rebounds, 1 steal and he's shooting 48.3% from the field.

Crabbe is also playing better. Over the last ten games he's averaging 11 ppg, 3.4 rebounds, and he's shooting 46.3% from the field. Crabbe is averaging over 41% from three this season.

Is this production worth all that money? No, but at least they're not completely sucking anymore.

 

[Trackjack]

If there a move it won't be nettle mover it be something small. But it will all depend how this group is playing on Jan 15 if they would consider a major move. This summer it will be a salary cap type move if there consider signing Plum next year.

 

[Scalma]

There will be a move. It's been a year and a half with the same front court, and the same problems are there, and it's gotten worse. The move might not happen until the offseason, but "letting them develop chemistry" won't be the reason why. The evaluations should be done by now imo. The sample size is more than big enough.

 

[Natebishop3]

There will be a move. It's been a year and a half with the same front court, and the same problems are there, and it's gotten worse. The move might not happen until the offseason, but "letting them develop chemistry" won't be the reason why. The evaluations should be done by now imo. The sample size is more than big enough.

I didn't say it would be the reason why.

make a move next summer when Crabbe might be a little easier to move.

The one variable is Plumlee. He becomes a free agent this summer and frankly I think he's going to be too expensive. He's one of the only guys still on a cheap contract.

 

[Nikolokolus]

I think Neil is going to be motivated, but I'm guessing it's going to be tough sledding unloading some of these guys.

 

[Natebishop3]

I think Neil is going to be motivated, but I'm guessing it's going to be tough sledding unloading some of these guys.

Crabbe especially, and he's the one guy that I think we have to move. He's too expensive to be a bench player.

Either that, or we need to trade CJ for a comparable star player and start Crabbe.

 

[BBert]

At least not during the season. We can't even trade Crabbe/Harkless/Leonard until after January 15th, CJ until after January 27th.

I think there's a good chance we hold onto what we have, let these guys develop some chemistry, and then make a move next summer when Crabbe might be a little easier to move.

It also seems like the guys are improving.

Turner is playing a lot better. Over the last 10 games he's averaging 11 points, 3.8 assists, 4.6 rebounds, 1 steal and he's shooting 48.3% from the field.

Crabbe is also playing better. Over the last ten games he's averaging 11 ppg, 3.4 rebounds, and he's shooting 46.3% from the field. Crabbe is averaging over 41% from three this season.

Is this production worth all that money? No, but at least they're not completely sucking anymore.

In how many minute? If they can keep that up, that's damn good, albeit expensive, bench production.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

I predict we will not make a trade today.

 

[Natebishop3]

In how many minute? If they can keep that up, that's damn good, albeit expensive, bench production.

Crabbe has been playing even better in December (7 games)

12.3 ppg, shooting 47.6% from the field in 27 minutes per game.

Turner is averaging 26 minutes per game in the last 10. Turner is shooting 49% in December.

 

[Sinobas]

If there a move it won't be nettle mover it be something small. But it will all depend how this group is playing on Jan 15 if they would consider a major move. This summer it will be a salary cap type move if there consider signing Plum next year.

Neil has obviously givien up on "moving the needle".

 

[Denny Crane]

I believe NO does have to make some sort of consolidation trade, but not necessarily at this trade deadline.

It would make re-signing Plums a lot easier in the summer, though.

If the team looks like it would go deeper in the playoffs if we made a move at the deadline, I can see a deal or deals happening.

If there's an opportunity deal to be done, acquiring a promising player, I can see that, too.

 

[Natebishop3]

Couple more interesting things:

Turner is having, by far, his best ORtg. It is currently at 105 and his career ORtg is 97. Unfortunately, he's also having his worst DRtg at 113. His career DRtg is 105. I think this is a reflection of Stotts great offensive coaching..... and completely horrible defensive coaching.

 

[Scalma]

I didn't say it would be the reason why.

To me, the vibe of your entire post was that the team wont make a move because the team is improving. While that may be true, they really had nowhere to go but up. Even at their best, they are still just average defensively, and a large part of that has to do with the massive deficiency in the front court. It was there last season as well. It's not a new development. Neil doesn't/shouldn't need more time to evaluate it, but I would understand if a move wasn't made, just because it takes two to tango.

As for those eligibility dates, that's not really an issue. Most teams don't trade until the deadline anyway. You can probably count on two/three fingers the number of trades thatll go down before February.

 

[Scalma]

I believe NO does have to make some sort of consolidation trade, but not necessarily at this trade deadline.

It would make re-signing Plums a lot easier in the summer, though.

If the team looks like it would go deeper in the playoffs if we made a move at the deadline, I can see a deal or deals happening.

If there's an opportunity deal to be done, acquiring a promising player, I can see that, too.

Yeah, I feel like if there is a center to be had that also fits long term, you make that move asap, regardless of whatever our record might be. The question is will other teams be more motivated to deal in February, or in the summer.

 

[Natebishop3]

To me, the vibe of your entire post was that the team wont make a move because the team is improving. While that may be true, they really had nowhere to go but up. Even at their best, they are still just average defensively, and a large part of that has to do with the massive deficiency in the front court. It was there last season as well. It's not a new development. Neil doesn't/shouldn't need more time to evaluate it, but I would understand if a move wasn't made, just because it takes two to tango.

As for those eligibility dates, that's not really an issue. Most teams don't trade until the deadline anyway. You can probably count on two/three fingers the number of trades thatll go down before February.

Sorry, that wasn't my intention at all. I think they might not make a trade because I think a trade will be easier to make during the offseason. To me, giving the team more time to gel and develop is an added bonus.

I completely disagree that Neil doesn't need more time to evaluate the roster. We are only now seeing the fruits of adding Evan Turner to the lineup, and our guys are constantly improving. Harkless is better than he was last year. Plumlee seems to be better offensively than he was last year. Vonleh has been.... disappointing. Leonard is a bust. I absolutely think that we are seeing the wheat separating from the chaff.

I also think that we need a better idea of whether Dame and CJ can actually coexist long term. I still have my doubts. We need to know what limitations Crabbe has, and whether he could potentially be a starter. To say that that evaluation is done and that Neil shouldn't need any more time to determine who should stay and who should go is...... rather short sighted.

 

[Scalma]

Sorry, that wasn't my intention at all. I think they might not make a trade because I think a trade will be easier to make during the offseason. To me, giving the team more time to gel and develop is an added bonus.

I completely disagree that Neil doesn't need more time to evaluate the roster. We are only now seeing the fruits of adding Evan Turner to the lineup, and our guys are constantly improving. Harkless is better than he was last year. Plumlee seems to be better offensively than he was last year. Vonleh has been.... disappointing. Leonard is a bust. I absolutely think that we are seeing the wheat separating from the chaff.

I also think that we need a better idea of whether Dame and CJ can actually coexist long term. I still have my doubts. We need to know what limitations Crabbe has, and whether he could potentially be a starter. To say that that evaluation is done and that Neil shouldn't need any more time to determine who should stay and who should go is...... rather short sighted.

Let me clarify, when it comes to evaluations, I was referring mainly to the center position. I agree about the rest.

 

[Denny Crane]

FWIW, I think Ezeli is gone this summer if he doesn't play.

 

[Natebishop3]

Let me clarify, when it comes to evaluations, I was referring mainly to the center position. I agree about the rest.

But that's part of the problem.... the entire world knows we need a big man. That doesn't put us in a position of strength while trying to deal. Frankly, I don't think adding a big man is going to magically transform us over night into a contender. Not unless New Orleans wants to give us Anthony Davis, or we can get Cousins without giving up CJ.

I would love to get Whiteside but it sure doesn't sound like he's going anywhere.

 

[Scalma]

FWIW, I think Ezeli is gone this summer if he doesn't play.

Maybe even earlier. His contract could help us take on salary. Btw, any guesses on what his injury actually is?

 

[Denny Crane]

Maybe even earlier. His contract could help us take on salary. Btw, any guesses on what his injury actually is?

I think this year he's guaranteed. If he agrees to a buyout, then we save money. But why would he?

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Should also be noted that with all the hand-wringing about the potential enormous tax bill if we keep our current roster (including a re-signed Plumlee) after this summer, the bill won't be calculated until April 2018, and that we have until February 2018 to make trades to get us under the tax line. So if tax considerations are going to be the major driver of an eventual salary-shedding deal, we've got more than a year to figure that out.

If we make a deal, salary won't be the main issue--talent will be.

 

[Scalma]

But that's part of the problem.... the entire world knows we need a big man. That doesn't put us in a position of strength while trying to deal. Frankly, I don't think adding a big man is going to magically transform us over night into a contender. Not unless New Orleans wants to give us Anthony Davis, or we can get Cousins without giving up CJ.

I would love to get Whiteside but it sure doesn't sound like he's going anywhere.

I agree about the leverage part, but there are also teams out there with logjams that might be motivated to move a player, so a fair compromise could be reached. That's why I believe guys like Nurkic and Noel are realistic targets. Besides, as Olshey has alluded to before, most teams aren't out there trying to rip other teams off, because in doing so, they negatively affect potential business down the road. Probably why nobody wants to do business with Danny Ainge.

 

[Denny Crane]

Should also be noted that with all the hand-wringing about the potential enormous tax bill if we keep our current roster (including a re-signed Plumlee) after this summer, the bill won't be calculated until April 2018, and that we have until February 2018 to make trades to get us under the tax line. So if tax considerations are going to be the major driver of an eventual salary-shedding deal, we've got more than a year to figure that out.

If we make a deal, salary won't be the main issue--talent will be.

Yep.

I've posted that a number of times.

Once trade deadline 2018 hits, we are stuck. Maybe we can buy guys out, though.

 

[Natebishop3]

I agree about the leverage part, but there are also teams out there with logjams that might be motivated to move a player, so a fair compromise could be reached. That's why I believe guys like Nurkic and Noel are realistic targets. Besides, as Olshey has alluded to before, most teams aren't out there trying to rip other teams off, because in doing so, they negatively affect potential business down the road.

Personally, I see everyone outside of Lillard as tradeable. Even CJ. We have a lot of young assets and while I would love to keep most of our core together, I'm not really married to the idea of our current roster. I'm not even sold on Stotts. He's a great offensive coach, but his defense is just god awful. We will never win a thing until we actually develop a defensive strategy that works.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Yep.

I've posted that a number of times.

Once trade deadline 2018 hits, we are stuck. Maybe we can buy guys out, though.

You're right--I was just reiterating for the purposes of this thread.

 

[Scalma]

Personally, I see everyone outside of Lillard as tradeable. Even CJ. We have a lot of young assets and while I would love to keep most of our core together, I'm not really married to the idea of our current roster. I'm not even sold on Stotts. He's a great offensive coach, but his defense is just god awful. We will never win a thing until we actually develop a defensive strategy that works.

The defense is more of a personnel issue. We were fine defensively when we had rolo and Wes. I think it's convenient to blame the coach, because that's just one guy, and I also think it's somewhat ignorant to infer Stotts doesn't understand defense.

 

[Pinwheel1]

I heard today on one of the national shows that the new CBA will create even higher salaries. If this is actually true, the contracts for our recently signed FA's will be average and thus not too hard to unload. I have no idea if they are right about it, but it was the first thing I thought of when I heard it.

Did Neil and Paul see this coming?

 

[Natebishop3]

The defense is more of a personnel issue. We were fine defensively when we had rolo and Wes. I think it's convenient to blame the coach, because that's just one guy, and I also think it's somewhat ignorant to infer Stotts doesn't understand defense.

We have a lot of young, long, athletic guys. Why is it that someone like Turner has a reputation as being a good defensive player on other teams, but he has a career low DRtng on our team?

 

[rasheedfan2005]

i predict if we get a lot of value for a loss of a little value we will make a trade. if we can't get good value for low loss we wont make the trade because that would make us worse. holy shit i should be a GM

 

[Scalma]

We have a lot of young, long, athletic guys. Why is it that someone like Turner has a reputation as being a good defensive player on other teams, but he has a career low DRtng on our team?

Our switching works when Aminu is in there, but still outside of him and Harkless, we have no above average defenders in the starting 5. There's so much pressure put on our center, yet we don't have one capable of handling it. That's why it's imperative that we acquire one.

As for Turner, I haven't paid attention to his stats but his defense has always been there for me from day one. Maybe I'm blind.

Btw, I actually liked what we did vs Westbrook. Plumlee and our other bigs just chilled in the paint waiting for him and it worked. We should do that more.