If every debt holder cashed in right now

[magnifier661]

The world's economic system would shut completely down. The value of the nation's monetary system would be worth the paper it's printed on.

It's a scary thought; but any world-wide economic panic could completely break the system. Consumer economy is wasteful and destructive. Manufacturers are purposely designing products and materials to break down sooner; so they can stay relevant and price competitive with their competition.

Consumers are buying things they want, instead of getting things they truly need. As much as I support "free enterprise"; looking at the entire picture like this is fucking scary!

 

[Eastoff]

someone got into the shrooms again.

 

[magnifier661]

someone got into the shrooms again.

Why? The financial scare of the "Bear Sterns" era almost bankrupt this company. And that wasn't even close to everyone cashing in. The huge "sell-off" in the stock and housing market gave us a sample of the utter seriousness of an economic collapse. People are scared of zombies or natural supplies? How the fuck will people act when their US$ 10,000,000 savings is worth $20 worldwide dollars? I see a ton of riots and police action.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I don't think there are enough people who lost $10M to make a difference against 100M people who don't give a ****.

 

[Eastoff]

Why? The financial scare of the "Bear Sterns" era almost bankrupt this company. And that wasn't even close to everyone cashing in. The huge "sell-off" in the stock and housing market gave us a sample of the utter seriousness of an economic collapse. People are scared of zombies or natural supplies? How the fuck will people act when their US$ 10,000,000 savings is worth $20 worldwide dollars? I see a ton of riots and police action.

I'm just kidding man! Honestly, if the world economy collapses, then that would be bad. I don't have control over the world economy though. I voted in the person I think will bring the most stability, and that's all I can do other than invent the next tablet computer.

 

[Eastoff]

As far as I can tell, the country seems fine.

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

The world's economic system would shut completely down. The value of the nation's monetary system would be worth the paper it's printed on.

It's a scary thought; but any world-wide economic panic could completely break the system. Consumer economy is wasteful and destructive. Manufacturers are purposely designing products and materials to break down sooner; so they can stay relevant and price competitive with their competition.

Consumers are buying things they want, instead of getting things they truly need. As much as I support "free enterprise"; looking at the entire picture like this is fucking scary!

And if every debt holder did this, they'd be screwing themselves over. So, it's not so scary.

People are greedy by nature, and debt holders are (likely) smart enough to know they'd not even be fucking the world economy over, they'd be fucking themselves over. So this doesn't scare me. It's like saying the US has enough nuclear power to blow up the world. Well, great. But we'd be screwing ourselves over as well.

 

[magnifier661]

And if every debt holder did this, they'd be screwing themselves over. So, it's not so scary.

People are greedy by nature, and debt holders are (likely) smart enough to know they'd not even be fucking the world economy over, they'd be fucking themselves over. So this doesn't scare me. It's like saying the US has enough nuclear power to blow up the world. Well, great. But we'd be screwing ourselves over as well.

It happened during the Great Depression. And it's not the government; it's individuals and businesses holding the debt. The Federal Reserve isn't even a government entity.

 

[MARIS61]

No.

 

[magnifier661]

As far as I can tell, the country seems fine.

Yes the country seems fine. But the senario still exists. Even today; countries throughout the world are becoming "Bear Sterns". How much of this "Bankrupcy" can the world's economy withstand? Eventually the dikes will break and the flood of economic distaster will pour in.

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

It happened during the Great Depression. And it's not the government; it's individuals and businesses holding the debt. The Federal Reserve isn't even a government entity.

Yes, I know it's not the Feds (I don't think I said it was the Feds).

But today's world is a different place man. I have no doubts the debt holders DO NOT have the balls to cash in. That cash would quickly mean little, and they'd be sucked into the chaos and depression quickly. Not to mention, you'd have a whole shit-ton of people who would hunt down each individual who caused such significant damage to the economy.

 

[magnifier661]

No.

No? How so? If every debt is collected; there isn't enough world wealth in the entire world to pay it back. You disagree with this? You actually think the world's economy can support all the debt on this planet?

Remember I'm not just talking about the USA. I am talking about the entire planet.

 

[magnifier661]

Yes, I know it's not the Feds (I don't think I said it was the Feds).

But today's world is a different place man. I have no doubts the debt holders DO NOT have the balls to cash in. That cash would quickly mean little, and they'd be sucked into the chaos and depression quickly. Not to mention, you'd have a whole shit-ton of people who would hunt down each individual who caused such significant damage to the economy.

Oh I only responded about the "Feds" thing because you referred to the nuclear bomb thing.

 

[MARIS61]

No? How so? If every debt is collected; there isn't enough world wealth in the entire world to pay it back. You disagree with this? You actually think the world's economy can support all the debt on this planet?

Remember I'm not just talking about the USA. I am talking about the entire planet.

It's not something that could ever realistically occur.

Nearly 100% of all debts in the world have a designated due date, and only a tiny fraction are due tomorrow. Also, the majority of debts are current on payment and terms, leaving the lender no avenue to claim immediate payment. Also, the majority of debt is currently financed at absurdly high terms compared to the terms available today, so any wise lender will be happy to continue as they have as long as the paym,ents keep coming in.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

The world's economic system would shut completely down. The value of the nation's monetary system would be worth the paper it's printed on.

It's a scary thought; but any world-wide economic panic could completely break the system.

The money's not here. Your money's in Joe's house...right next to yours. And in the Kennedy house, and Mrs. Macklin's house, and a hundred others. Why, you're lending them the money to build, and then, they're going to pay it back to you as best they can. Now what are you going to do? Foreclose on them?...Now wait...now listen...now listen to me. I beg of you not to do this thing. If Potter gets hold of this Building and Loan there'll never be another decent house built in this town. He's already got charge of the bank. He's got the bus line. He's got the department stores. And now he's after us. Why? Well, it's very simple. Because we're cutting in on his business, that's why. And because he wants to keep you living in his slums and paying the kind of rent he decides. Joe, you lived in one of his houses, didn't you? Well, have you forgotten? Have you forgotten what he charged you for that broken-down shack? Here, Ed. You know, you remember last year when things weren't going so well, and you couldn't make your payments. You didn't lose your house, did you? Do you think Potter would have let you keep it? Can't you understand what's happening here? Don't you see what's happening? Potter isn't selling. Potter's buying! And why? Because we're panicky and he's not. That's why. He's picking up some bargains. Now, we can get through this thing all right. We've got to stick together, though. We've got to have faith in each other.

 

[ABM]

I'll head to MARIS' house.

 

[barfo]

I don't see the point here. Yes, if every debt holder cashed in, it would cause a crisis. So would a giant asteroid strike, or a worldwide plague, or President Justin Bieber. Any of those things *could* happen, shall we worry about them? I say no (unless we are in the business of worrying about them, e.g. working for CDC).

barfo

 

[ABM]

I don't see the point here. Yes, if every debt holder cashed in, it would cause a crisis. So would a giant asteroid strike, or a worldwide plague, or President Justin Bieber. Any of those things *could* happen, shall we worry about them? I say no (unless we are in the business of worrying about them, e.g. working for CDC).

barfo

Ya know, you're just like an intelligent ape, barfo. A hairy reasoner.

 

[BLAZER PROPHET]

I don't see the point here. Yes, if every debt holder cashed in, it would cause a crisis. So would a giant asteroid strike, or a worldwide plague, or President Justin Bieber. Any of those things *could* happen, shall we worry about them? I say no (unless we are in the business of worrying about them, e.g. working for CDC).

barfo

I have to agree. I never saw the point here.

 

[magnifier661]

I don't see the point here. Yes, if every debt holder cashed in, it would cause a crisis. So would a giant asteroid strike, or a worldwide plague, or President Justin Bieber. Any of those things *could* happen, shall we worry about them? I say no (unless we are in the business of worrying about them, e.g. working for CDC).

barfo

Everything other than Justin Beiber are beyond our control. Debt has a choice. There are people that have a choice to live in debt and others that have a choice to be free from it. So your rebuttle is invalid. Unless of course we debat Justin Bieber being president.

 

[magnifier661]

It's not something that could ever realistically occur.

Nearly 100% of all debts in the world have a designated due date, and only a tiny fraction are due tomorrow. Also, the majority of debts are current on payment and terms, leaving the lender no avenue to claim immediate payment. Also, the majority of debt is currently financed at absurdly high terms compared to the terms available today, so any wise lender will be happy to continue as they have as long as the paym,ents keep coming in.

Okay, but let's say that every individual cashed in their savings then? Then the banks wouldn't have the money to actually return the savings. Our worldwide economy is based on the amount of "leveraged debt". If a bank has $100,000; then they are able to lend $1,000,000 to that $100,000.

And that did happen not long ago. It was called "The Great Depression".

 

[blazerboy30]

Yes, I know it's not the Feds (I don't think I said it was the Feds).

But today's world is a different place man. I have no doubts the debt holders DO NOT have the balls to cash in. That cash would quickly mean little, and they'd be sucked into the chaos and depression quickly. Not to mention, you'd have a whole shit-ton of people who would hunt down each individual who caused such significant damage to the economy.

You really think that in a mass panic bank run people are going to be thinking about the long-term and what's good for the country? People will be rushing to get what they possibly can before it's completely gone. That's why bank runs have happened and why the government and Feds were incredibly scared of that happening in 2008.

 

[magnifier661]

You really think that in a mass panic bank run people are going to be thinking about the long-term and what's good for the country? People will be rushing to get what they possibly can before it's completely gone. That's why bank runs have happened and why the government and Feds were incredibly scared of that happening in 2008.

I don't think most people had any idea on how close the United States was going to become bankrupt in 08. And if the US bankrupts; the world economy turns to shit. All we needed was 25%-35% of the nations people to want to cash in on thier savings and the snow ball would have been too large to recover from. Because when the people cash in, the banks would need to cash in to pay back; which would force the banks they borrow from to cash in and so on.

I think a lot of people just haven't seen it first hand, therefor they don't believe it could ever happen. When something does happen; shit will hit the fan.

 

[huevonkiller]

What the hell is mags talking about? Bank runs start because of producer goods and long-term capital projects like housing.

Dude no, the consumer goods markets is the very last market to collapse, you're being paranoid.

 

[magnifier661]

What the hell is mags talking about? Bank runs start because of producer goods and long-term capital projects like housing.

Dude no, the consumer goods markets is the very last market to collapse, you're being paranoid.

Consumer income and oil is what leads this economy's revenue. If there is a mass sell off, or cash in on savings or investments, the value of revenue drops considerably; which would create a chain reaction of others selling off; which would cause a chain reaction of people worried about spending money; which would lead to a much lower revenue. That includes banking systems that use consumer and housing to borrow more money.

 

[huevonkiller]

Consumer income and oil is what leads this economy's revenue.

Hmm no the economy is quite diversified. Capital malinvestment from government price-fixing is what usually causes the business cycle historically.

If there is a mass sell off, or cash in on savings or investments, the value of venenue drops considerably;

Why are banks that highly leveraged and vulnerable to bank runs in the first place? We have a public banking system with fractional reserve banking. Bad credit expansion happens in unison, and this is made possible by the board of governors at the central bank and the reserve ratio they set for all banks. The government decides how much money needs to be created, which causes price distortion. Without a market equilibrium price it is impossible for anyone to behave rationally.

which would create a chain reaction of others selling off; which would cause a chain reaction of people worried about spending money; which would lead to a much lower revenue. That includes banking systems that use consumer and housing to borrow more money.

The central bank decides what long-term capital products cost, there is an overinvestment in the market but the market is never allowed to adjust because interest rates are never allowed to rise. As the production structure becomes more roundabout, producers realize that there has been an underinvestment in the consumer goods markets. Once the central bank fears hyperinflation the depressionary period of the market begins, which causes stagflation in consumer goods markets.

 

[magnifier661]

I invite anyone to read the financial collapse of 2007-08 and try and tell me I am being paranoid.

This event created a "world-wide global recession"

Housing, consumer spending, and employment all dropped. Mass over-leveraging created this impossible hole to come out of. The ironic situation is our government is mass leveraging right now. Our deficit is at an all-time high. Eventually, we won't have enough income vs. credit to overcome unless we take a stand and do something now.

I think it's funny that people blame our issues and problems on the insanely stupid lending practices of these big banks and overlook our government practicing the same thing.

 

[magnifier661]

Hmm no the economy is quite diversified. Capital malinvestment from producers is what usually causes the business cycle historically.




Why are banks that highly leveraged and vulnerable to bank runs in the first place? We have a public banking system with fractional reserve banking. Bad credit expansion happens in unison, and this is made possible by the board of governors at the central bank and the reserve ratio they set for all banks. The government decides how much money needs to be created, which causes price distortion. Without a market equilibrium price it is impossible for anyone to behave rationally.



The central bank decides what long-term capital products cost, their is an overinvestment in the market but the market is never allowed to adjust because interest rates are never allowed to rise. As the production structure becomes more roundabout, producers realize that there has been an underinvestment in the consumer goods markets. Once the central bank fears hyperinflation the depressionary period of the market begins, which causes stagflation in consumer goods markets.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_companies_by_revenue

Look at the top revenue producing companies and their sector and get back to me. Retail and Oil are the highest %.

 

[huevonkiller]

I invite anyone to read the financial collapse of 2007-08 and try and tell me I am being paranoid.

This event created a "world-wide global recession"

Housing, consumer spending, and employment all dropped. Mass over-leveraging created this impossible hole to come out of. The ironic situation is our government is mass leveraging right now. Our deficit is at an all-time high. Eventually, we won't have enough income vs. credit to overcome unless we take a stand and do something now.

I think it's funny that people blame our issues and problems on the insanely stupid lending practices of these big banks and overlook our government practicing the same thing.

I don't think you understood my post then, since it is the government that makes all this possible.

Oh don't misquote me because I agree there will be another financial collapse soon, but for somewhat different reasons.

 

[huevonkiller]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_companies_by_revenue

Look at the top revenue producing companies and their sector and get back to me. Retail and Oil are the highest %.

No I am looking at percentage of jobs lost during the recession, not the amount of jobs lost. There's a difference.

Sectors are impacted disproportionately.