...Pete Rose

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Even if Shoeless Joe were ever elected (which is a grave indiscretion in my book), then Rose should be shit canned forever, never to enter the Hallowed Halls.

His lying and playing us and MLB for fools, over and over, has reduced his stature to that just a hair below a fkn sewer rat, IMHO.......

Yes, to Joe, No to the wilted Rose.......
 
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Rose is just lucky that he wasn't created by papa Gapeto.
 
sorry gambling and lying about it had no impact on the game and definitely didn't change his performance.
how a league that turned a blind eye to quite a few other indiscretions, some that had more of an on-field impact...its just hypocrisy.

ok...he's a habitual gambler, time for folks to get over it. charlie hustle always played the game right...period.
 
If Pete wasn't the all time Hits Leader, we wouldn't be having this discussion..........the man's got a disease, that doesn't correlate well to MLB, or its ethical practices, which Pete made a mockery out of, ........just ask the IRS...........no no, not the Irish Republic Armed Services....

Rose lives and dies by the creed, "Don't tell 'em anything they don't ask about", and- don't ever divulge information, when asked, and if so, then lie like hell, let 'em spend a couple decades, determining one's true indiscretions......? Calls made IN the Dugout, and on the Clubhouse Phones, that plain takes balls.......

I had a Inspector who was a bookie, making more money by far on his illegal gambling operations, than he ever made at Northrop.....a helluva damn fine Inspector too, but, the dummy had to go and collect his bets, using a Shielded TSAR Phone***, the fkn moron...........the latter is harder to swallow, than the prior indiscretion, just like the case of Rose...........? He knew better, both......did.........but still..........they fkd up........and what's fkd up cannot always be undone, or atoned for.....
 
totus44 said:
sorry gambling and lying about it had no impact on the game and definitely didn't change his performance.
how a league that turned a blind eye to quite a few other indiscretions, some that had more of an on-field impact...its just hypocrisy.

ok...he's a habitual gambler, time for folks to get over it. charlie hustle always played the game right...period.
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...so it's OK for Baseball player to bet on Baseball?

...simply put, Charlie "hustled" us...and I'm sorry, but when the HOF is concerned, you cannot separate his stats from his indiscretions, and lies, and the fact that he broke the one cardinal rule of Baseball... it ALL counts.

...and no, Rose did not "always play the game right"... recent evidence says otherwise. And considering that he's lied so many times about if/when he bet on the game, we really have no idea for sure how far back his gambling goes, do we?

...and drawing a parallel to PED use is a weak defense...Baseball may have "turned a blind eye" to PEDs, but they certainly did not turn a blind eye to gambling on the game. And there is no 5o games suspension, or one year suspension for Rose's offense...it's a very clear and simple rule than has been in place for nearly 100 years and it is the ONE universal"death penalty" for Baseball. Rose knew that, but did it anyway.
 
totus44 said:
sorry gambling and lying about it had no impact on the game and definitely didn't change his performance.
how a league that turned a blind eye to quite a few other indiscretions, some that had more of an on-field impact...its just hypocrisy.

ok...he's a habitual gambler, time for folks to get over it. charlie hustle always played the game right...period.
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This!

His numbers indicate his greatness! Yeah, he's had indiscretions, but he is an all time great none the less
 
...like I said, as far a HOF goes, you can't separate his Baseball stats from his Baseball "crime".

...here's the deal, he can't even be on a HOF ballot until he is reinstated...and he won't be reinstated, at least not as long as he's alive.

...fuck Rose.
 
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The crime against baseball is taking money to throw games/shave points and/or then also betting to further benefit from that graft. Black Sox = guilty, we agree.
But show me the evidence where Pete bet against his own team, or bet where he had an influence on the games outcome. Was he addicted and sick, absolutely. Was he a baseball cheat - no way.
Sorry but if Pete had the current collective bargaining power today's cheats have.....he would have been banned 50-100 days with counseling and community service, and then straight into the HOF.
 
totus44 said:
The crime against baseball is taking money to throw games/shave points and/or then also betting to further benefit from that graft. Black Sox = guilty, we agree.
But show me the evidence where Pete bet against his own team, or bet where he had an influence on the games outcome. Was he addicted and sick, absolutely. Was he a baseball cheat - no way.
Sorry but if Pete had the current collective bargaining power today's cheats have.....he would have been banned 50-100 days with counseling and community service, and then straight into the HOF.
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...sorry, but you need to familiarize yourself with the actual rule governing this. It says nothing about distinguishing between betting on your team vs betting against your team.

...and sorry, but Pete doesn't have "the current bargaining power"... the PED testing was voted and agreed upon by the players and ratified by the MLBPA...in fact, they actually asked for it...show me one instance of the MLBPA wanting alter the rule on betting on Baseball.

...at this point how can you believe anything the guy says now?...virtually all of even the most stubborn "Rose for the HOF" supporters have now abandoned him after the most recent proof that his betting activities went back to when he was still playing. I'll say it again, after he's lied for so long and for so many years about how and when he did bet on Baseball, how can you say with any degree of certainty that he was not betting on the game for most of his career ? ...you can't.
 
...fyi;

http://seanlahman.com/files/rose/rule21.html


Rule 21 (d) "BETTING ON BALL GAMES. Any player, umpire, or club official or
employee, who shall bet any sum whatsoever upon any baseball game in
connection with which the bettor has no duty to perform shall be declared
ineligible for one year.

Any player, umpire, or club or league official or employee, who shall
bet any sum whatsoever upon any baseball game in connection with which
the bettor has a duty to perform shall be declared permanently ineligible."





http://www.cincinnati.com/story/spo...rose-passage-time-changes-situation/25610281/

http://www.indystar.com/story/sport...e-but-gambling-is-mlbs-biggest-enemy/6209289/
 
totus44 said:
The crime against baseball is taking money to throw games/shave points and/or then also betting to further benefit from that graft. Black Sox = guilty, we agree.
But show me the evidence where Pete bet against his own team, or bet where he had an influence on the games outcome. Was he addicted and sick, absolutely. Was he a baseball cheat - no way.
Sorry but if Pete had the current collective bargaining power today's cheats have.....he would have been banned 50-100 days with counseling and community service, and then straight into the HOF.
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^^^^THIS THIS THIS THIS^^^^
 
...lol...the over whelming minority of bleeding hearts can jump up and down all they want and insist that Rose is somehow the victim...they can also cite irrelevant stats that were built mostly on longevity, but it won't change what I've already said;

1. Rose cannot be on any HOF ballot unless he is reinstated by the Commissioner.

2. The Commissioner will not reinstate him.


...fuck Rose. He's a pathological liar and has no credibility and he willfully agreed to a "lifetime ban" and is not getting in the HOF while he's alive.
 
The Man has lied to the audience and MLB for so long, I think he's forgotten half of His crimes against MLB.......

you know the type, consummate liars, who begin to believe their own lie(s).....


I enjoyed Pete's chase to create an all times hit leader in the day, but his bullshit is far heavier than his record.......

I'd bet the worst part of Pete, has been long burned and turned to dirt, that is, any evidence he did not want us to see. For that much, that could of easily been the proof of the pudding, your asking for.....

we will have to agree to disagree on this one, as Pete IMO, given today's collective bargaining, would still be buried for life, due to the rules noted in 59's Post #14...........Rule 21.d
 
Mattingly23NY said:
The Man has lied to the audience and MLB for so long, I think he's forgotten half of His crimes against MLB.......

you know the type, consummate liars, who begin to believe their own lie(s)....

I'd bet the worst part of Pete, has been long burned and turned to dirt, that is, any evidence he did not want us to see. For that much, that could of easily been the proof of the pudding, your asking for.....

we will have to agree to disagree on this one, as Pete IMO, given today's collective bargaining, would still be buried for life, due to the rules noted in 59's Post #14...........Rule 21.d
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...and Matts, that is precisely the reason why he was the one who initiated the meeting with Giamatti and agreed to the "lifetime ban"...plain and simple, he wanted the investigation to stop.
 
yankeesince59 said:
...and Matts, that is precisely the reason why he was the one who initiated the meeting with Giamatti and agreed to the "lifetime ban"...plain and simple, he wanted the investigation to stop.
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...^^^

Yep, and Pete agreed to a Lifetime Ban.....with no reservations, and is now trying to play an entire new generation for fools.....good thing, MLB has old time Fans, (like Rick who predate the dinosaurs; and came up with the concept for "The Flintstones")....

No doubt in my mind, when Pete approached Giamatti, Pete was probably not sleeping, thinking of FBI agents, going thru His trash, (meaning his life of lies); and every record known to man.........

NTM-the IRS investigators, who became involved, for the mucho deniros he received for Autograph Shows, of which he also lied about, over and over.
Rose lied to the IRS also, first by not reporting, then changing his amount of $$$$ income from those shows. Then Rose cited: one figure of cash Pete received, then another, then "Oh I forgot I ever did that show".........and on and on........

personally, If I had the FBI and every unknown agent, albeit investigators, both private and govt agencies, pulling out evidence; I'd not sleep at night either, and would move to the top of Patagonia's highest Mt.

Or dig a hole and live in it, which Rose did rhetorically........!

Pete made his bed, agreed to sleep in it, and now is whining like a school girl...........FK Pete, give me Shoeless Joe anyday........!!!

Which reminds me, why are we discussing Rose, when its Shoeless Joe who deserves to be enshrined in the HOF IMHO.......
 
4,256 reasons. I don't give a shit about the gambling rules, it underscores the hypocrisy of the substance abuse policy.
Keeping Pete out of the HOF serves no purpose other than to hurt baseball.
 
after further review, it is the opinion of this know it all that totus44 is absolutely correct, only reason in the writers opinion that he is not in hall, arrogance, when bonds gets in, so will rose
 
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totus44 said:
4,256 reasons. I don't give a shit about the gambling rules, it underscores the hypocrisy of the substance abuse policy.
Keeping Pete out of the HOF serves no purpose other than to hurt baseball.
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...lol...You "don't give a shit about the gambling rules"?...that's all I needed to hear...great defense.

...but exactly how is it a "hypocrisy"?...and exactly how does it "hurt baseball".
 
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Pastafazul said:
after further review, it is the opinion of this know it all that totus44 is absolutely correct, only reason in the writers opinion that he is not in hall, arrogance, when bonds gets in, so will rose
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...sorry mensa, but it's not just the "writers". Do a little reading/research on the subject...hell, I think there's even sites that limit their wording to 2 syllables or less.

...tell me, who's more deserving of the HOF?

...this guy; ... .303 .375 .409 .784

...or this guy; .356 .423 .517 .940
 
yankeesince59 said:
...so it's OK for Baseball player to bet on Baseball?

...simply put, Charlie "hustled" us...and I'm sorry, but when the HOF is concerned, you cannot separate his stats from his indiscretions, and lies, and the fact that he broke the one cardinal rule of Baseball... it ALL counts.

...and no, Rose did not "always play the game right"... recent evidence says otherwise. And considering that he's lied so many times about if/when he bet on the game, we really have no idea for sure how far back his gambling goes, do we?

...and drawing a parallel to PED use is a weak defense...Baseball may have "turned a blind eye" to PEDs, but they certainly did not turn a blind eye to gambling on the game. And there is no 5o games suspension, or one year suspension for Rose's offense...it's a very clear and simple rule than has been in place for nearly 100 years and it is the ONE universal"death penalty" for Baseball. Rose knew that, but did it anyway.
Click to expand...
 
yankeesince59 said:
...so it's OK for Baseball player to bet on Baseball?

...simply put, Charlie "hustled" us...and I'm sorry, but when the HOF is concerned, you cannot separate his stats from his indiscretions, and lies, and the fact that he broke the one cardinal rule of Baseball... it ALL counts.

...and no, Rose did not "always play the game right"... recent evidence says otherwise. And considering that he's lied so many times about if/when he bet on the game, we really have no idea for sure how far back his gambling goes, do we?

...and drawing a parallel to PED use is a weak defense...Baseball may have "turned a blind eye" to PEDs, but they certainly did not turn a blind eye to gambling on the game. And there is no 5o games suspension, or one year suspension for Rose's offense...it's a very clear and simple rule than has been in place for nearly 100 years and it is the ONE universal"death penalty" for Baseball. Rose knew that, but did it anyway.
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It all counts is simple but says it all.
 
yankeesince59 said:
...lol...that's all I needed to hear...great defense.
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I have no issue with us disagreeing on this topic....but I'm offended that you cherry picked my sentence and didn't quote it in its entirety.

Nuff said.
 
totus44 said:
sorry gambling and lying about it had no impact on the game and definitely didn't change his performance.
how a league that turned a blind eye to quite a few other indiscretions, some that had more of an on-field impact...its just hypocrisy.

ok...he's a habitual gambler, time for folks to get over it. charlie hustle always played the game right...period.
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Why, should we get over Rose so soon, when Shoeless Joe, has been banned now for approximately 95 years. With evidence proving Joe never took a cent of money to throw the Black Sox Scandalous W.S. Proof in the pudding of stats in the 1919 Series, Joe not only led all Hitters in B'Avg........and did not have 1 Error either.....

(this report has more to say about the Black Sox fiasco than most Encyclopedias)......Ref: next paragraph URL....

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...still-awaits-justice-50-years-after-his-death


Besides The Courts acquitted Joe and the Other 7 men. Acquitting all players was not justice, yet acquitting Jackson would of been justice. So no Courts found Joe guilty, while Kennesaw Mt. Landis, had a hard on for not only Joe, but the entire fiasco affair, which damn near ended MLB as we know it......(but then OJ was acquitted, and we all know He was guilty), but not in Joe's case Landis made sure his vendetta was carried out......with a lifetime ban of his own doing, and abuse of His powers......! Had the Courts of found A-Roid innocent or acquitted Him, we'd of had a riot........

http://www.history.com/news/ask-his...ckson-conspire-to-throw-the-1919-world-series

I love this quote on Shoeless Joe, by Babe Ruth: ". Babe Ruth, the greatest player the game has ever seen, said of Shoeless Joe, “I copied Jackson’s style because I thought he was the greatest hitter I had ever seen, the greatest natural hitter I ever saw. He’s the guy who made me a hitter.”

another very good read on the Black Sox scandal:
http://www.breitbart.com/sports/2014/01/01/did-shoeless-joe-jackson-take-the-money/

NTM- the old time saying supposedly from the mouth of a young kid/fan, upon Joe's departure out the courthouse: "say it ain't so Joe", NEVER was Spoken or stated, as much a myth, as Hercules, being told over decades.
 
totus44 said:
4,256 reasons. I don't give a shit about the gambling rules, it underscores the hypocrisy of the substance abuse policy.
Keeping Pete out of the HOF serves no purpose other than to hurt baseball.
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Honestly, and never with any disrespect to ya' Tom, I don't see how not letting Rose in hurts baseball.....?

I used Rose for years; as a LL role model for players to emulate and play "balls out", including girls, but the word itself: "Charlie Hustle", is now almost not politically correct at all.

Please clarify if you will, how keeping Rose out of the HOF, hurts baseball...........honestly, I don't get it.....????

shoeless.jpg
 
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JOe Jackson.jpg

In-fkng-credible, as a rookie Joe hit .408, unfathomable by today's standards.......!
 
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