Politics Preferred Trump Endgame re: Russia, nukes, ...?

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BrianFromWA

BrianFromWA

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Out of sheer curiosity, what's the preferred endgame on these investigations and raids and hearings? Is it the opinion of many of you that the country would be better if Trump and his whole gang was impeached/evicted from the White House and this became a Pence presidency? Or is it that you think if Trump goes down there will be a (D) landslide in the 2018 midterms? Or ...?

I didn't want to pollute any of the other threads or to make it a "Hypocrite! You didn't want to investigate KILLARY!11!" thread. I'm seriously curious. Based on my particular sensibilities (which I am positive are diametrically opposed to many of yours) you can probably imagine what I think of a Trump vs. Pence vs. Kasich vs. Ryan vs. whoever Presidency/VP.
 
I don't have a preferred endgame, per se, I just think the investigations are important for the deterrence. If Trump and his campaign colluded with Russia to try to win, and if there were no consequences, it would simply change the game again to both sides utilizing outside agents as much as possible to influence the election their way--a successful tactic is not abandoned and forgotten; others will use it and it would be stupid not to if the other side is. It's important to establish that winning is not the end--if you do it through illegal means, you'll be at risk of being evicted from the position. If you surround yourself by people willing to do the dirty work for you, you'll still be dogged by it through your Presidency.

If an investigation as probing as Mueller's seems to be comes back clearing Trump of any meaningful connection to Russia, that's fine. I'd accept that.
 
BrianFromWA said:
I think of a Trump vs. Pence vs. Kasich vs. Ryan vs. whoever Presidency/VP.
Click to expand...

My concerns with the current process has nothing to do with the specific people currently involved or any of those that could possible have been elected.

The major issue is the Constitutional process of selecting the President is now blown apart. The original intent was a rather simple process agreed to when you vow to uphold and defend the Constitution.

The President is the be elected in each State by the voters of the states as input to the electoral college. The President is to serve four years. The Executive power shall be invested in the President of the United States.

That's is!

We have never added and amendment to in-effect do the following;

The President and all persons that can shed any light on the President, shall be continuously investigated for wrong doing, irrespective of or the lack of any supporting evidence. This investigations shall be conducted by people completely independent of the Executive Power of the President and shall have the power to make any deal in exchange providing testimony of wrong doing.

I doubt an amendment to support this ridiculous process could pass. If it did, only fools would seek the job. The Constitution protects the President from public trial on charges, it is ridiculous to subject him to codified, institutional, sedition.

It is an unworkable way to select and support the leader.
 
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MarAzul said:
My concerns with the current process has nothing to do with the specific people currently involved or any of those that could possible have been elected.

The major issue is the Constitutional process of selecting the President is now blown apart. The original intent was a rather simple process agreed to when you vow to uphold and protect the Constitution.

The President is the be elected in each State by the voters of the states as input to the electoral college. The President is to serve four years. The Executive power shall be invested in the President of the United States.

That's is!

We have never added and amendment to in-effect do the following;

The President and all persons that can shed any light on the President, shall be continuously investigated for wrong doing, irrespective of or the lack of any supporting evidence. This investigations shall be conducted by people completely independent of the Executive Power of the President and shall have the power to make any deal in exchange providing testimony of wrong doing.

I doubt an amendment to support this ridiculous process could pass. If it did, only fools would seek the job. The Constitution protects the President from public trial on charges, it is ridiculous to subject him to codified, institutional, sedition.

It is an unworkable way to select and support the leader.
Click to expand...

What should be the process in the event that the President commits a crime?
 
MarAzul said:
I have every confidence you can find the remedy provided in the Constitution.
Click to expand...

The president can't be indicted. The Constitution provides that he can be indicted afterwards.

He can be impeached if you can convince the House to do so, and he can be removed if the Senate can be convinced to do so.
 
No one is above the law. Not even the president. When the president and the president's administration commits crimes they should be removed and go to prison. The office of the president should not be a place of corruption, but one that stands with highest regard and respect for the laws of the land.
Russia interfered with our election process. It is expected that Trump and his administration are guilty of colluding with Russia. They are being investigated, and if they are found innocent then good. If they are found to be culpable in these crimes then they need to be removed from office.
 
Chris Craig said:
No one is above the law. Not even the president. When the president and the president's administration commits crimes they should be removed and go to prison. The office of the president should not be a place of corruption, but one that stands with highest regard and respect for the laws of the land.
Russia interfered with our election process. It is expected that Trump and his administration are guilty of colluding with Russia. They are being investigated, and if they are found innocent then good. If they are found to be culpable in these crimes then they need to be removed from office.
Click to expand...
 
MarAzul said:
I have every confidence you can find the remedy provided in the Constitution.
Click to expand...

Indeed, and investigations precede the impeachment step. Therefore, everything is proceeding as the Constitution would have it.
 
MarAzul said:
My concerns with the current process has nothing to do with the specific people currently involved or any of those that could possible have been elected.

The major issue is the Constitutional process of selecting the President is now blown apart. The original intent was a rather simple process agreed to when you vow to uphold and defend the Constitution.

The President is the be elected in each State by the voters of the states as input to the electoral college. The President is to serve four years. The Executive power shall be invested in the President of the United States.

That's is!

We have never added and amendment to in-effect do the following;

The President and all persons that can shed any light on the President, shall be continuously investigated for wrong doing, irrespective of or the lack of any supporting evidence. This investigations shall be conducted by people completely independent of the Executive Power of the President and shall have the power to make any deal in exchange providing testimony of wrong doing.

I doubt an amendment to support this ridiculous process could pass. If it did, only fools would seek the job. The Constitution protects the President from public trial on charges, it is ridiculous to subject him to codified, institutional, sedition.

It is an unworkable way to select and support the leader.
Click to expand...
That's your problem. I'm all for abiding by the Constitution and following its word. But Trump brought this on himself. The Constitution was not designed with social media and the split second spreading of news that is now common in today's world. Trump didn't create social media, but he leveraged it to build his brand and is now being hurt by the same thing that helped him to get to this position in the first place.

People want to know everything about everyone now. Look at us with Blazer players, each IG post, tweet, facebook post they put out there is posted on this message board, dissected and discussed. We do that for fucking basketball players. What do you expect is going to happen to the LEADER OF THE FREE WORLD?

The constitutional process of selecting a President isn't broken, in fact it was strengthened by the last election. Trump became President because of the EC, not the popular vote. The process did it's job. What is broken is the actual concept of a President and representatives. The infrastructure the Constitution gave our country and our democracy are the reason we are here today and have grown to the super power that we are. That being said, the concept of needing representatives was formed back in the day where there was no email, no tweets, no internet. These people aren't representing OUR values anymore...they are representing the interests of whoever can provide them with the most money to stay in there position of power and not have to work a real job. Our system isn't broken...it's just out-dated and holding us back.
 
Blazer Freak said:
The constitutional process of selecting a President isn't broken, in fact it was strengthened by the last election. Trump became President because of the EC, not the popular vote. The process did it's job.
Click to expand...

Hey now.
I can promise you I won the popular vote in a landslide.
It's really very sad, very sad Obama allowed all these illegal people to vote.
We're going to build a wall, it's going to be a big and beautiful wall. Which will keep all these illegals from voting.
I inherited a mess, but I know how to fix it because I make great deals. No one makes better deals than I do.
cc Trump.
 
I don't see how any other situation would provide more amusement, so I'm fine with things continuing as they are until 2020.

Since America has decided that politics is entertainment, we might as well laugh while the country burns.

barfo
 
riverman said:
Very Piratish......maybe play a fiddle tune from the rooftops while it burns! Did el prez hack your acct?
Click to expand...

El Prez and I are the same person, didn't you know???

barfo
 
BrianFromWA said:
Based on my particular sensibilities (which I am positive are diametrically opposed to many of yours) you can probably imagine what I think of a Trump vs. Pence vs. Kasich vs. Ryan vs. whoever Presidency/VP.
Click to expand...

I can imagine lots of things, but I'd rather have you tell us what you'd like to have happen.

barfo
 
BrianFromWA said:
Out of sheer curiosity, what's the preferred endgame on these investigations and raids and hearings? Is it the opinion of many of you that the country would be better if Trump and his whole gang was impeached/evicted from the White House and this became a Pence presidency? Or is it that you think if Trump goes down there will be a (D) landslide in the 2018 midterms? Or ...?

I didn't want to pollute any of the other threads or to make it a "Hypocrite! You didn't want to investigate KILLARY!11!" thread. I'm seriously curious. Based on my particular sensibilities (which I am positive are diametrically opposed to many of yours) you can probably imagine what I think of a Trump vs. Pence vs. Kasich vs. Ryan vs. whoever Presidency/VP.
Click to expand...

America, one nation under Dog.

And that dog should be me.
 
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@MarAzul - the flaw in your analysis always is that you think something must be in the Constitution to be legal. That's not how it works.

There are 3 branches of government. Congress makes laws. Administrative policies are enacted to carry out those laws. Courts interpret laws and create case law. There are lots of things that are perfectly legal that are not per se in the Constitution. That is not what a constitution is supposed to do anyway. It is the framework.
 
If you guys really think the end game here is trump getting in some insane war then lol. It's posturing. Nothing more. It's funny people really think this guy is hitler and I am not even a supporter, it's just logic. In your eyes it's "OMG THE WORLD IS COMING TO AN END. MILLIONS WILL BE DEAD IN A WAR WITH NORTH KOREA BY THE FASCIST RACIST HOMOPHOBIC TRANSPHOBIC GUY!!"."


chill. This is politics. Your boy Obama got caught in it, Bush did, etc. These are lies. Nobody even knows how much control the president actually has. It's just assumed.
 
Regarding the thread title:

Both presidents simultaneously having heart attacks? :dunno:
 
Endgame, I want a couple things. Most importantly I want to trust elections. Without that, there is nothing to our system of governance. I want to learn that nobody involved with the elections participated in collusion and if they did I want it exposed into the light of day. I also want Russia to know that attempting to hack or illegally influence our government is futile.

The second thing I want is gridlock as long as there's a R congress.
 
Chris Craig said:
No one is above the law. Not even the president. When the president and the president's administration commits crimes they should be removed and go to prison. The office of the president should not be a place of corruption, but one that stands with highest regard and respect for the laws of the land.
Russia interfered with our election process. It is expected that Trump and his administration are guilty of colluding with Russia. They are being investigated, and if they are found innocent then good. If they are found to be culpable in these crimes then they need to be removed from office.
Click to expand...

You set the bar low on that one.

I happen to actually like Bill Clinton (his wife is a wicked witch, though). He committed crimes and remained in office.

Next!
 
Denny Crane said:
This poll was cherry picked by other posters a few days ago.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/trump_administration/prez_track_aug11

The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Friday shows that 45% of Likely U.S. Voters approve of President Trump’s job performance. Fifty-three percent (53%) disapprove.

A week ago, only 39% approved of the job Trump is doing.
Click to expand...
The only important poll is the S2 poll......where Trump's approval ratings are in single digits
 
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