OT Stephen A. SMH

[blazerkor]

Stephen A: Nash will do a 'hell of a job in Brooklyn,' but being hired with no coaching experience is white privilege



Now, I totally believe white privilege is a very serious and real thing but this wasn't the time to talk about it. If you count Bill Russell as a head coach when he was playing which you should then 10 out of the 17 guys who got head coaching positions in the NBA without any other coaching experience were people of color. 9 of them are black men and Jason Kidd's dad is black, I know Jason Kidd is very light skinned.

I agree with the outrage of Stephen A. about issues of systemic racism but it was badly badly aimed. I am definitely all for social justice reform, BLM and everything that goes with it but this is a preposterous example given the history of this exact situation. I don't care that the team is in Brooklyn because being in a diverse place would make it a lot easier to do than it was for Red Auerbach to make Bill Russell the first black head coach in league history with no coaching experience, in 1960s Boston, on a six time defending championship team. I mean shit there is a lot of stuff that Stephen A. could have linked that rant to including the response some politicians and others had to players boycotting after Kenosha but not this. Come on!

 

[Hoopguru]

Thats a bunch of bs, imo.
The GM is very tight with Steve and he feels Nash qualifies as well.
You can bet that Kyre and Kevin signed off too.

 

[blazerkor]

Thats a bunch of bs, imo.
The GM is very tight with Steve and he feels Nash qualifies as well.
You can bet that Kyre and Kevin signed off too.

Yeah, it's just a ridiculous place to aim all of that frustration. I can't fathom the frustration but I don't get it being triggered by this, especially with the history of the subject.

 

[wizenheimer]

unless I'm missing some context, in the last 40 years, 16 NBA coaches have been hired with no coaching experience. And 9 of the 16 were black

SAS needs to take the time to look at NBA history before he starts trashing the Nash hire as white privilege.

 

[blazerkor]

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unless I'm missing some context, in the last 40 years, 16 NBA coaches have been hired with no coaching experience. And 9 of the 16 were black

SAS needs to take the time to look at NBA history before he starts trashing the Nash hire as white privilege.

Exactly, I missed the 40 years part so I guess Russell isn't relevant but he is the first person who came to mind when SAS was going off. I mean 1966 Boston and he's acting like this has never happened for a black man. Again, so many things are unfair for black people in America in my opinion, this just isn't one of them.

 

[THE HCP]

We just don’t need this type of bullshit out there right now......there are enough REAL issues!

 

[VanillaGorilla]

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unless I'm missing some context, in the last 40 years, 16 NBA coaches have been hired with no coaching experience. And 9 of the 16 were black

SAS needs to take the time to look at NBA history before he starts trashing the Nash hire as white privilege.

Did I mis count or are you counting Jason Kidd as black? I know his dad is black but from what I've seen of current thoughts on this kind of thing, at least from young generations, Jason Kidd doesn't count as black to most black people.

 

[THE HCP]

Did I mis count or are you counting Jason Kidd as black? I know his dad is black but from what I've seen of current thoughts on this kind of thing, at least from young generations, Jason Kidd doesn't count as black to most black people.

In my neighborhood growing up any of my friends who were 1/2 black were considered by everybody to be black.

 

[speeds]

SAS wants to be on both sides of every argument.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

In my neighborhood growing up any of my friends who were 1/2 black were considered by everybody to be black.

Yeah I know that was the more common view, and still is for older (sorry!) generations. I just have encountered a lot of millennials and younger, in person and online, that say people like J Kidd who could pass as white aren't considered black in many ways that matter now. Like that someone who looks like him doesn't face anywhere near the amount of discrimination, or that they can't say the n-word.

I'm not saying it's my view, as I don't really know what my view on the topic is, but I have heard it being discussed more and more. I've seen black people flat out saying mixed people aren't black. Which is kinda confused since few black people in america are actually 100% black. Obviously as a white person it's not my place to be declaring anything about it.. but it is confusing and also interesting.

I suppose there has to be a "cut off" somewhere, I just have no idea where that might be.

 

[blazerkor]

In my neighborhood growing up any of my friends who were 1/2 black were considered by everybody to be black.

I lived in the same neighborhood as Jason Kidd's dad in the East Bay and he's a really nice guy and he is also black. Kidd was the best player I've ever seen play in high school and I was kinda shocked that his dad is black because he's so light skinned. Incidentally I also count Jason Kidd among the guys that make this Stephen A. shit so shitty.

 

[blazerkor]

Yeah I know that was the more common view, and still is for older (sorry!) generations. I just have encountered a lot of millennials and younger, in person and online, that say people like J Kidd who could pass as white aren't considered black in many ways that matter now. Like that someone who looks like him doesn't face anywhere near the amount of discrimination, or that they can't say the n-word.

I'm not saying it's my view, as I don't really know what my view on the topic is, but I have heard it being discussed more and more. I've seen black people flat out saying mixed people aren't black. Which is kinda confused since few black people in america are actually 100% black. Obviously as a white person it's not my place to be declaring anything about it.. but it is confusing and also interesting.

I suppose there has to be a "cut off" somewhere, I just have no idea where that might be.

Well he's definitely a person of color.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

Well he's definitely a person of color.

What makes a person a person of color?

Is it primarily how they look or their ancestry?

 

[blazerkor]

What makes a person a person of color?

Is it primarily how they look or their ancestry?

I'm pretty sure it's their ancestry.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

I'm pretty sure it's their ancestry.

Fair enough. Like I said I don't have a fully formed opinion about this, I just know there is growing disagreement. Partially because there does have to be a boundary at some point. I think the disagreement is where that point is, and whether it is primarily based on ancestry or appearance.

But this probably isn't the place for a discussion on this.

 

[THE HCP]

It’s a fine line for sure. I’m HISPANIC on my drivers license and all work paperwork. Since my dad left me and my mom, that was the side of the family I gravitated towards.

 

[SheedSoNasty]

Is Blake Griffin black?

 

[THE HCP]

Is Blake Griffin black?

yes

 

[KSF-ERIC]

I don’t know. Lots of qualified black coaches being turned down for gigs.

 

[blazerkor]

I don’t know. Lots of qualified black coaches being turned down for gigs.

Right, I do think there are a lot of qualified black coaches out there and there is a huge discrepancy in how many black men are qualified to be head coaches in the league and how many actually are head coaches. If that were Stephen A Smith's rant, I would be all for it and partially that was his rant but he kicked it off and came back several times to the fact that Steve Nash had never coached before and was getting this job over qualified people who had. That was a horrible place to make his stand because of how many times the same thing has happened and how many times the people getting the opportunity Steve Nash is now getting were black men. It's plain and simple, more black men have benefited from going from no coaching experience to NBA head coach than any other race. Again, there has to be something done in the NBA like the Rooney rule in the NFL, to get more black men in head coaching and general managing roles but Stephen A just picked the completely wrong point to jump off from.

 

[KSF-ERIC]

Right, I do think there are a lot of qualified black coaches out there and there is a huge discrepancy in how many black men are qualified to be head coaches in the league and how many actually are head coaches. If that were Steven A Smith's rant, I would be all for it and partially that was his rant but he kicked it off and came back several times to the fact that Steve Nash had never coached before and was getting this job over qualified people who had. That was a horrible place to make his stand because of how many times the same thing has happened and how many times the people getting the opportunity Steve Nash is now getting were black men. It's plain and simple, more black men have benefited from going from no coaching experience to NBA head coach than any other race. Again, there has to be something done in the NBA like the Rooney rule in the NFL, to get more black men in head coaching and general managing roles but Steven A just picked the completely wrong point to jump off from.

I guess. I heard an interesting comment on a podcast the other day: "Some players aren't good as coaches. Magic Johnson was a bad coach. Steve Kerr was a good coach." And I was thinking, hold on, you just said a black coach was bad and a white coach was good when there was a BIG BIG BIG difference between the rosters those guys coached. With the Warriors roster, Magic could've been a very good coach. And if Kerr was given the Knicks roster, he probably would've been fired after one year. It should be noted that Kerr was terrible as a GM, making one of the worst trades ever for the Suns (Marion for an old Shaq). I mean, when Luke Walton took over for Kerr during the 2015-16 season, the Warriors went 39-4. A much better stretch than Kerr ever coached them too. And then Kerr failed to coach them to a championship that year. Furthermore, Walton has not been successful as a coach for Lakers or Kings, jobs he probably wouldn't have gotten if it wasn't for that 39-4 stretch. Now, Nash gets a championship ready roster which a coach like David Vanterpool would kill for. Why not give Vanterpool a chance with that roster? Well, presumably it was Durant and Kyrie's decision so I guess it's their fault.

 

[blazerkor]

I guess. I heard an interesting comment on a podcast the other day: "Some players aren't good as coaches. Magic Johnson was a bad coach. Steve Kerr was a good coach." And I was thinking, hold on, you just said a black coach was bad and a white coach was good when there was a BIG BIG BIG difference between the rosters those guys coached. With the Warriors roster, Magic could've been a very good coach. And if Kerr was given the Knicks roster, he probably would've been fired after one year. It should be noted that Kerr was terrible as a GM, making one of the worst trades ever for the Suns (Marion for an old Shaq). I mean, when Luke Walton took over for Kerr during the 2015-16 season, the Warriors went 39-4. A much better stretch than Kerr ever coached them too. And then Kerr failed to coach them to a championship that year. Furthermore, Walton has not been successful as a coach for Lakers or Kings, jobs he probably wouldn't have gotten if it wasn't for that 39-4 stretch. Now, Nash gets a championship ready roster which a coach like David Vanterpool would kill for. Why not give Vanterpool a chance with that roster? Well, presumably it was Durant and Kyrie's decision so I guess it's their fault.

Also it's said that Nash is close with Nets ownership. The whole thing is more political and less merit based than it should be. There needs to be rules that give more people of color opportunities at head coaching jobs, especially in a sport dominated by black men. We see far too big of a discrepancy in the ratio of black assistant coaches to black head coaches. All of that said it's a fact, there have been more black men who have been given a chance to be a head coach in the NBA with no coaching experience than white men... I like that it's that way because far more black men play at the highest level than white men. That being said, again there is no way that Stephen A should have been pointing out that Nash had no experience, he should have just focused on the lack of equal opportunity in a league that likes to pride themselves on opportunity in regards to diversity.

 

[KSF-ERIC]

Also it's said that Nash is close with Nets ownership. The whole thing is more political and less merit based than it should be. There needs to be rules that give more people of color opportunities at head coaching jobs, especially in a sport dominated by black men. We see far too big of a discrepancy in the ratio of black assistant coaches to black head coaches. All of that said it's a fact, there have been more black men who have been given a chance to be a head coach in the NBA with no coaching experience than white men... I like that it's that way because far more black men play at the highest level than white men. That being said, again there is no way that Steven A should have been pointing out that Nash had no experience, he should have just focused on the lack of equal opportunity in a league that likes to pride themselves on opportunity in regards to diversity.

Isn’t that a small sample size though? I believe it was just 9 out of 16 who were black.

 

[blazerkor]

Isn’t that a small sample size though? I believe it was just 9 out of 16 who were black.

It's the situation he was citing so it's the only ratio that matters but no I wouldn't say that 40 years is a small sample size and 9 out of 16 is obviously enough that he should have steered clear of talking about that specific phenomenon being an example of systemic racism. I mean we have millions of examples in this country and I'm sure more than a thousand examples in basketball to choose from that exemplify systemic racism but he chose an example that historically bucks the trend and has been very progressive in going beyond equal opportunity. Qualified black coaches don't have equal opportunity to be NBA head coaches, I'm agreeing with you and Stephen A about that but he just really needed to leave out the point that he continuously harped on that Nash had never coached before... because of the history it has no baring whatsoever and actually hurt the perceived validity of the rest of what he was saying.

 

[TBpup]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...arkley-steve-nash-white-privilege/5713814002/

 

[blazerkor]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...arkley-steve-nash-white-privilege/5713814002/

Obviously I agree with Chuck, all of what he said is the exact reason that this thread was started. I mean, it's almost unbelievable that Stephen A didn't know that what he was saying was so far off. I know he knew that Doc and Derek Fisher had no previous coaching experience... I don't for one second believe that the idea of Bill Russell didn't flash in his mind leading up to his segment on TV. I mean he may not have known that 9 out of the 16 times this has happened in the last 40 years that it was a black man that kind of leapfrogged the system but he had to be aware that this wasn't unprecedented and that it had happened for multiple black men too. Some of me thinks this was the ultimate troll job. Maybe Stephen A wanted to talk about systemic racism, which needs to be talked about, and he thought, "Maybe if I say something completely off base to begin with and keep going back to that, this will put a bigger spotlight on the issue?" I don't know if he would be that calculated and still that stupid though because the only thing harping on Steve Nash's hiring did was give ammo to those who don't believe in systemic racism... which is why I'm so incredibly outraged with Stephen A Smith and obviously it's why Charles Barkley is too.