Stop with this Outlaw "won the game for us"

[MIXUM]

Any blazer fan who thinks this was a "good win" needs their head examined. Outlaw did everything he could to lose the game with his buddy aldridge. Outlaw missed crucial free throws, took about as bad as a shot as you will see in the final seconds of a game. He was terrible tonight. Outlaw has no BB IQ whatsoever. Deer in headlights come to mind.

Roy is the only nice thing about this team at the moment. Even Rudy is missing wide open threes.

 

[JfizzleBlazer]

I dunno about you, but I would add Joel to the list of nice things about this team at the moment. He looks great this year, even more of an improvement from last year

 

[STOMP]

why is this a new thread? You're clearly responding to another discussion.

STOMP

 

[MIXUM]

sorry i didnt see anything about outlaw.

anyway joel has been solid but i hope he stays helathy.

hey, im thrilled wew on but that was an ugly ugly win and we were not teh better team tonight. im not drinking the kool aid about this win. we were god awful.

 

[craigehlo]

Outlaw's still a liability in close games to me. We need a SF that can get easier shots and can his FTs when the game is tight.

 

[MIXUM]

i cringe when outlaw has the ball unless its a wide open three. im being serious...its never pretty when he dribbles and puts his head down.

almost as ugly as an aldridge jumper.

 

[gambitnut]

What was the difference between what Outlaw did with his minutes and what Batum did with his? Why did Outlaw get so many more minutes than Batum?

 

[KingSpeed]

Outlaw had 2 big steals, SKIED PRACTICALLY ABOVE THE BACKBOARD for 3 huge offensive rebounds, scored 7 points in a stretch that brought us back from 8 down, and was willing to take the big shot which is better than coughing it up under pressure. He was aggressive on that last play and I like that. He also played the game winning defense. As for Travis hitting FTs, he has hit a TON of HUGE free throws for us this season. He just missed today. That's all. If you don't appreciate what Travis brings to this team then you're not watching all 48 minutes of every game this season.

 

[MIXUM]

no im just watching outlaw continue to dribble, put his head down and throw up a brick...which the other team rebounds and outlaw has the "AW SHUCKS" look on his face. you know the deer in headlights look he has had since his rookie year.

god imagine the fun sheed had with that kid. talk about hazing lol

 

[KingSpeed]

[video=youtube;R2Z4nxdjpnE]

 

[KingSpeed]

Evidence:

Travis hits two clutch FTs to take the lead at the start of OT:

http://www.nba.com/games/20081106/HOUPOR/playbyplay.html

Travis puts Minnesota away with two clutch FTs with 4 seconds left in the game:

http://www.nba.com/games/20081108/MINPOR/playbyplay.html

 

[BrianFromWA]

OK...I've watched all 48 minutes of every game this season (except for the LAL game that TNT nicely decided I didn't need to see the first few minutes of)...

Outlaw had 2 big steals, SKIED PRACTICALLY ABOVE THE BACKBOARD for 3 huge offensive rebounds

My issue has never been with his hops. My issue has been with the fact that he got his hands on 3 of our 50 misses tonight. He's a big SF, or PF. Why isn't he getting to more rebounds? Is someone telling him not to? (BTW: This is not just for Travis...I've had this criticism of LMA and Frye almost all year. LMA picked it up today).

was willing to take the big shot which is better than coughing it up under pressure.

But not as good as giving it to either your PG or your all-star SG, or the Spanish guy with handles. Not as good as NOT taking a contested running shot with 7 seconds still left on the clock. Not as good as pulling it back and trying a play, even if it's calling your own number.

If you don't appreciate what Travis brings to this team...

I appreciate what Travis brings to the team. What I don't think that many realize is that Travis brings a lot of cons with his pros, and are only willing to focus on the pros. He had great spurts tonight, no doubt about it. He also played like a 5th-grader tonight, in spurts. One of those spurts happened to be on our last possession of the game.

Believe me, I LOVE that he's taking that open 3 from the corner and making it much more than anyone expected. My beef for the last 10 games has been when he takes the ball inside the 3pt line. He is now 34-90 for the season inside the 3pt line. (37%) I could understand if he was drawing fouls and hitting shots. But the last time he made more than 2 FTs in a game was Orlando 8 games ago. Today's FT woes dropped him to a still-respectable 74%. But I can understand why he's rusty...since that Orlando game he's shot 15FTs in 8 games (210 minutes). For the non-engineering types, that's one FT every 14 minutes in the game.

Do I have to just swallow the notion that Travis can't be criticized until he's doing this for ATL or MEM or something?

 

[ehizzy3]

OK...I've watched all 48 minutes of every game this season (except for the LAL game that TNT nicely decided I didn't need to see the first few minutes of)...


My issue has never been with his hops. My issue has been with the fact that he got his hands on 3 of our 50 misses tonight. He's a big SF, or PF. Why isn't he getting to more rebounds? Is someone telling him not to? (BTW: This is not just for Travis...I've had this criticism of LMA and Frye almost all year. LMA picked it up today).


But not as good as giving it to either your PG or your all-star SG, or the Spanish guy with handles. Not as good as NOT taking a contested running shot with 7 seconds still left on the clock. Not as good as pulling it back and trying a play, even if it's calling your own number.


I appreciate what Travis brings to the team. What I don't think that many realize is that Travis brings a lot of cons with his pros, and are only willing to focus on the pros. He had great spurts tonight, no doubt about it. He also played like a 5th-grader tonight, in spurts. One of those spurts happened to be on our last possession of the game.

Believe me, I LOVE that he's taking that open 3 from the corner and making it much more than anyone expected. My beef for the last 10 games has been when he takes the ball inside the 3pt line. He is now 34-90 for the season inside the 3pt line. (37%) I could understand if he was drawing fouls and hitting shots. But the last time he made more than 2 FTs in a game was Orlando 8 games ago. Today's FT woes dropped him to a still-respectable 74%. But I can understand why he's rusty...since that Orlando game he's shot 15FTs in 8 games (210 minutes). For the non-engineering types, that's one FT every 14 minutes in the game.

Do I have to just swallow the notion that Travis can't be criticized until he's doing this for ATL or MEM or something?

wow. it couldn't be explained better

 

[KingSpeed]

I think it's fine for you to criticize but I don't like it when people get their facts wrong, i.e. saying that he is a liability in close games while he has been so clutch for us in close games on both sides of the court. Craigehlo said we need a SF that can hit clutch FTs. Well he has:

Me as a broken record:

Travis hits two clutch FTs to take the lead at the start of OT:

http://www.nba.com/games/20081106/HO...laybyplay.html

Travis puts Minnesota away with two clutch FTs with 4 seconds left in the game:

http://www.nba.com/games/20081108/MI...laybyplay.html

I can't find a single game in which we lost a game because of Travis' free throw shooting. It doesn't exist.

 

[THE HCP]

Outlaw's still a liability in close games to me. We need a SF that can get easier shots and can his FTs when the game is tight.

I think his name is Martell Webster. If I'm not mistaken, I think he's going with the team on the upcoming road trip.

 

[KingSpeed]

I think his name is Martell Webster. If I'm not mistaken, I think he's going with the team on the upcoming road trip.

Really? Sweet.

As for Martell hitting FTs when the game is tight, it's never happened. Martell was on the bench last season when the game was tight. He may be able to do it, but he has no record of doing it. Outlaw does.

 

[TheCzar@mac.com]

This thread oozes of butthurt; the czar likey.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I can't speak for Ehlo. What I can say is that I've been one of those in the past who've criticized Travis for his play at the end of games (and not just Travis...I lit up Jack most of last year).

The reasons are multiple, and have little to do with "clutch FT shooting".

You are correct in that I can't find a game this year Travis has lost from the FT line. I won't try. He attempts 2 per game, and is shooting 74%. I could probably comb through to see what his % is with less than 3 minutes left, but I'll grant you the "clutch FT%" point.

Can you honestly say you trust his decision-making in the flow of the game, especially late? I think he's a powerful weapon when Nate can draw a play up for him (like Memphis last year, for instance). I think he can really play defense and rebound when he wants to. It's that I haven't consistently seen him "want to", and when he's able to "freelance" in a close game, he makes mental mistakes.

I can think of two anecdotes from last year off the top of my head, but I'm jealous of your ability to find video clips. One was where he was bringing the ball up on a break, seemed to realize what he was doing, and kind of stutter-stepped to a halt near halfcourt for a traveling call. Another was (iirc) when we were up one, and he dribbled the ball downcourt and right into the corner, where he was trapped and turned it over.

It's plays like those that make me sad that LMA couldn't be our PF on the floor for the last possession of the game.

 

[KingSpeed]

I can't speak for Ehlo. What I can say is that I've been one of those in the past who've criticized Travis for his play at the end of games (and not just Travis...I lit up Jack most of last year).

The reasons are multiple, and have little to do with "clutch FT shooting".

You are correct in that I can't find a game this year Travis has lost from the FT line. I won't try. He attempts 2 per game, and is shooting 74%. I could probably comb through to see what his % is with less than 3 minutes left, but I'll grant you the "clutch FT%" point.

Can you honestly say you trust his decision-making in the flow of the game, especially late? I think he's a powerful weapon when Nate can draw a play up for him (like Memphis last year, for instance).

I don't think the play was drawn up for Travis. It was for Roy but they couldn't get the ball to him so Outlaw came to the ball and went for it on his own. If he had missed, everyone would've said "what the hell was that, Travis?"

 

[alex42083]

Travis is fine.. he screwed up a couple times tonight but the guy had some key offensive boards down the stretch or kept balls alive. The guy isn't perfect, or else he'd be Kobe or LeBron.
He was Mr. Fourth Quarter for us last season, and I do remember a few times he came through in the clutch with his FTs. With that said, Travis just needs to stick to his strengths and not try to drive into the lane and hoist up circus shots while falling down.

 

[SpanishFly]

Travis is fine.. he screwed up a couple times tonight but the guy had some key offensive boards down the stretch or kept balls alive. The guy isn't perfect, or else he'd be Kobe or LeBron.
He was Mr. Fourth Quarter for us last season, and I do remember a few times he came through in the clutch with his FTs. With that said, Travis just needs to stick to his strengths and not try to drive into the lane and hoist up circus shots while falling down.

TO should be traded while his 3 pt % remains high, I just don't like his overall game and I don't think he's going to get any better. We have Batum and webs comin back, TO needs to go.

 

[PapaG]

Still amazed at how many Blazer fans seem to take joy in tearing down productive members of the team.

 

[STOMP]

Still amazed at how many Blazer fans seem to take joy in tearing down productive members of the team.

I'm amazed at their imaginations.

For his career, Marty has shot 41% from the field, 75% from the line and 37% from 3's

For his career, Travis has shot 44% from the field, 73% from the line and 37% from 3's

Implying one trick pony MW is going to be making a major splash for the team is probably one of those absence makes the heart grow fonder things. I'm sure many of these same posters praising/pining for him will turn on him with his first miss or TO.

While I occationally take these fans seriously, I actually sort of enjoy reading the daily mania. Its really pretty funny. The club has played the fewest home games in the league against a gauntlet of last years playoff teams, yet they're 9-6 and a 1/2 game out of first place in their division. They won despite the Kings shooting the lights out from 3's (9-17) and them playing far less then their top game. I always laughed at the old Mr Bill SNL skits too

STOMP

 

[MAS RipCity]

Outlaw had 2 big steals, SKIED PRACTICALLY ABOVE THE BACKBOARD for 3 huge offensive rebounds, scored 7 points in a stretch that brought us back from 8 down, and was willing to take the big shot which is better than coughing it up under pressure. He was aggressive on that last play and I like that. He also played the game winning defense. As for Travis hitting FTs, he has hit a TON of HUGE free throws for us this season. He just missed today. That's all. If you don't appreciate what Travis brings to this team then you're not watching all 48 minutes of every game this season.

I think you and I are some of the only people around here who actually watch the game other than the shot that is being taken.
His D was also phenomenal on Salmons during the last possession, causing him to travel at least 3 times (which were not called,bs)

 

[Crimson the Cat]

Outlaw's still a liability in close games to me. We need a SF that can get easier shots and can his FTs when the game is tight.

I'm sorry but this is just wrong. Teams struggle sometimes collectively. Outlaw and Aldridge have both had trouble with their shot. But there's a lot more to the game then just shooting. A sign of a good player is that they find other ways to contribute.

Brandon was struggling to start the year. Do we need a new SG? Of course not. This is Travis's time to struggle with his shot. It happened last year. It's happening now. It'll probably happen again. More often than not, he isn't a liability ... this year.

Consider this:

In the 4th quarter or overtime, this season, with less than 5 minutes left, and neither team ahead by more than 5 points, Outlaw is on the court 69% of the time. The team has a +4 in net production.

I'm sorry but putting this on Outlaw, or not giving him his due for the obvious hard work he's put in and putting in, isn't fair. Despite his shooting struggles he was instrumental in coming back in the fourth. He got to the line and hit one free throw with 6 minutes left, grabbed a rebound and got back to the line with 5 minutes left, grabbed an offensive board with 4 minutes left that led to Brandon scoring, and grabbed another offensive board with 3 and a half minutes left which led to Aldridge scoring.

Without Outlaw we lose this game IMO. If he would have hit his shots the games a lot less dramatic.

 

[BatumKaboom]

WOOW!!!!! This Mixum guy is a God damned crybaby!!!! I would hate to know him in real life. Pouting and crying all the time. God I hate people like that lol. There are a few at my work. Just cry and bitch about everything all day long. Could find something wrong with winning the lottery.

 

[Nikolokolus]

WOOW!!!!! This Mixum guy is a God damned crybaby!!!! I would hate to know him in real life. Pouting and crying all the time. God I hate people like that lol. There are a few at my work. Just cry and bitch about everything all day long. Could find something wrong with winning the lottery.

You mean like high fucking taxes?

 

[PapaG]

Outlaw's still a liability in close games to me. We need a SF that can get easier shots and can his FTs when the game is tight.

Well, everything but history over two seasons now and the W/L percentage back you up on this claim!

As for easier shots, um, there is a reason that Outlaw has to take contested shots at times. Unless you think there is a SF out there who can just magically get open shots, anytime he pleases.

 

[BrianFromWA]

yeah...he doesn't have a PG that finds the open man.