US Wants to Criminalize Movie and Music Streaming

[barfo]

OK, all the USSC did in Citizens United was give corporations (entities comprised of a person or people)

The problem with that is that corporations are not entities comprised of a person or people. Corporations are NOT people, nor are they groups of people. In fact that's the entire point of a corporation - to draw a legal distinction between humans and the corporate entity.

You can make the argument that unions are not people either, although there is maybe a clearer connection since they do have individual members.

Corporations have stockholders, and sometimes those stockholders are natural persons, but sometimes they are not.

I don't disagree that the issue has lots of political implications, but I can't see the argument that corporations are people in any normal sense of the word.

barfo

 

[NewsSource]

The problem with that is that corporations are not entities comprised of a person or people. Corporations are NOT people, nor are they groups of people. In fact that's the entire point of a corporation - to draw a legal distinction between humans and the corporate entity.

barfo

It can just as easily be said that tax-exempt unions aren't people, either, and that money donated by union leadership second-handed from the dues of members isn't from a "person", either.

Also, as posted earlier, I'm a one-person corporation. I'm structured so my personal money or property can't be taken if my LLC is sued and I lose, but it's still 100% my money in that LLC. Am I not a person when I'm at work? Hell, it's an easier case to make for a LLC partnership being a person over a union, since the union dues aren't even taxed, yet are donated to political candidates and PACs. If a union is sued, its members' personal property isn't at risk, just the money in the union coffers.

It should be either/or. Either only individual money from a person's personal account can be used, or legally protected entities like unions and corporations can both contribute. To only allow unions to donate is 100% partisan.

 

[barfo]

It can just as easily be said that tax-exempt unions aren't people, either, and that money donated by union leadership second-handed from the dues of members isn't from a "person", either.

Also, as posted earlier, I'm a one-person corporation. I'm structured so my personal money or property can't be taken if my LLC is sued and I lose, but it's still 100% my money in that LLC. Am I not a person when I'm at work? Hell, it's an easier case to make for a LLC partnership being a person over a union, since the union dues aren't even taxed, yet are donated to political candidates and PACs. If a union is sued, it's members' personal property isn't at risk, just the money in the union coffers.

It should be either/or. Either only individual money from a person's personal account can be used, or legally protected entities like unions and corporations can both contribute. To only allow unions to donate is 100% partisan.

I'm not suggesting otherwise. I'd be fine with removing both corporation and union money. But I think you are on stronger ground arguing that unions are not people than arguing that corporations are people.

barfo

 

[NewsSource]

I'm not suggesting otherwise. I'd be fine with removing both corporation and union money. But I think you are on stronger ground arguing that unions are not people than arguing that corporations are people.

barfo

You may be right, but I don't think the case can be made, if I understand you correctly, that either unions or corporations are "people" in the true sense of the word. Also, I'm not giving any of my LLC profits to any political cause, other than to pay for my internet so I can whine about politics!

 

[Minstrel]

Also, as posted earlier, I'm a one-person corporation. I'm structured so my personal money or property can't be taken if my LLC is sued and I lose, but it's still 100% my money in that LLC. Am I not a person when I'm at work?

You're a person while at work, but your corporation is a separate entity (which is why it can be sued separately from you) and that entity is not a person (in any normal sense of the word).

I'm fine with both corporations and unions being barred from donating money to political candidates.

 

[NewsSource]

You're a person while at work, but your corporation is a separate entity (which is why it can be sued separately from you) and that entity is not a person (in any normal sense of the word).

I know this. It's a legal distinction that protects me, just as being a member of a union is a legal distinction that protects its members from liability.

I'm fine with both corporations and unions being barred from donating money to political candidates.

Me too, but neither party is going to give up those streams of revenue and kickbacks from kickbacks. My larger point is that the entire phony outrage/support over Citizens United is strictly a partisan issue, as is evident by the president's temper tantrum at the SotU after the decision was reached when he mentioned it in front of congress, guests, and the world. Neither side is honest about this USSC decision, but I will say that in terms of "fairness," I support the decision, just as if I'd support it if it were unions barred from donating to political causes while corporations were allowed to do so.