Who would you give up to get Rubio?

[Rastapopoulos]

Let's imagine that (a) Blake Griffin goes #1 and (b) some team like the Clippers or Wizards or possibly Memphis or OKC whose first needs are not at PG has the #2 pick. Assume also that we can add the standard $3M of Paul Allen's money, absorbing of bad contracts (in our cap space) and as many draft picks as you like to the offer. Now the question is:

 

[julius]

Obviously we have to give up Greg Oden. And then next year after being impatient, we give up on someone else for the hot shit that year.

 

[Minstrel]

Let's imagine that (a) Blake Griffin goes #1 and (b) some team like the Clippers or Wizards or possibly Memphis or OKC whose first needs are not at PG has the #2 pick. Assume also that we can add the standard $3M of Paul Allen's money, absorbing of bad contracts (in our cap space) and as many draft picks as you like to the offer. Now the question is:

Some combination of Rudy, Bayless, Outlaw and Webster. I'd consider dealing all of them. Basically anyone outside of Roy, Aldridge and Oden would be on the table, but I'd try my best to retain Batum. I'd rather give up all of the first four listed than Batum.

 

[speeds]

Every time I hear his name I think of the movie Hook, and Dustin Hoffman murdering him.

 

[BTOWN_HUSTLA]

Klondike Bar

 

[BTOWN_HUSTLA]

Outlaw + Bayless/Sergio + pick + cap space.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I voted "Nobody, he's an overrated bum", and here's why: DEFENSE

Perhaps this is a little bit of guilt by association, as the only real opportunity I had to watch Rubio was the Olympics, but Spanish PGs all see to be goo to great passers who can't play a lick of defense. Calderon = great passer, horrible defender, Sergio = good passer, horrible defender, Raul Lopez = decent passer, horrible defender, etc.

So, I predict Rubio will be a great passer, but a horrible defender and what this team needs more than a great passer is an above average defender at the PG position. He's not the answer. If we could actually move up high enough in the draft to get Rubio, there are several other players I'd take over him.

BNM

 

[Rastapopoulos]

I voted "Nobody, he's an overrated bum", and here's why: DEFENSE

Perhaps this is a little bit of guilt by association, as the only real opportunity I had to watch Rubio was the Olympics, but Spanish PGs all see to be goo to great passers who can't play a lick of defense. Calderon = great passer, horrible defender, Sergio = good passer, horrible defender, Raul Lopez = decent passer, horrible defender, etc.

My advice: watch more tape. Defense is absolutely a strength of his game. He's very disruptive, has great instincts, long arms and very quick reactions. In fact, that was his main impact in all the games I saw. Think a taller Greg Anthony. If you doubt me, read the strengths listed here.

 

[speeds]

Calderon isn't that good of a passer. His vision is average and he tends to get his assists by running pick and rolls with Bosh and Bargnani. He rarely creates anything on the break, or from a broken play, other than a kick out or toss back for a three pointer.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Here's a recent video from the Copa Del Rey (note he still has an injured hand):

[video=youtube;pQvpwR8-Pck]

 

[Boob-No-More]

My advice: watch more tape. Defense is absolutely a strength of his game. He's very disruptive, has great instincts, long arms and very quick reactions. In fact, that was his main impact in all the games I saw. Think a taller Greg Anthony. If you doubt me, read the strengths listed here.

I did read the Draftexpress profile - he sounds like the typical euro guard on defense - high risk/high reward. Sounds like he gambles a lot to get steals. There is NOTHING in his Draftexpress profile that praises his man-to-man perimeter defense. He may be able to get away with gambling on defense playing in Europe, but my concern is will he be able to stop the bigger, stronger, faster more athletic PGs he'll have to guard in the NBA?

BNM

 

[speeds]

I did read the Draftexpress profile - he sounds like the typical euro guard on defense - high risk/high reward. Sounds like he gambles a lot to get steals. There is NOTHING in his Draftexpress profile that praises his man-to-man perimeter defense. He may be able to get away with gambling on defense playing in Europe, but my concern is will he be able to stop the bigger, stronger, faster more athletic PGs he'll have to guard in the NBA?

BNM

Most NBA guards can't stop each other. Is it so critical?

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Here's a good compilation of plays from the Olympics, including several against the US:

[video=youtube;T5mpST596qU]

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Outlaw + Bayless/Sergio + pick + cap space.

+1

I think KP can buy a pick and bundle with above.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

I did read the Draftexpress profile - he sounds like the typical euro guard on defense - high risk/high reward. Sounds like he gambles a lot to get steals.

So, in other words, just like Chris Paul.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

So, in other words, just like Chris Paul.

...and the entire Denver Nuggets.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

As the poll is going so far, most people aren't prepared to give up what it would take. Have to hope for a bonehead GM (NOT someone like Geoff Petrie) or hope that Rubio isn't as good as virtually everyone who's scouted him believes.

(I thought of a comparison for his defense: Manu Ginobili. If you're going to do "guilt by association" I guess I have to come up with a Spanish-speaking white guy. The Spurs seem to have done okay with that defense. It certainly isn't because of Tony Parker's.)

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Some combination of Rudy, Bayless, Outlaw and Webster. I'd consider dealing all of them. Basically anyone outside of Roy, Aldridge and Oden would be on the table, but I'd try my best to retain Batum. I'd rather give up all of the first four listed than Batum.

If a team was prepared to trade the pick (you'd have to have the right team, as I said), then this might just be enough. I'd be prepared to do anyone but the big three just because Rubio is such a rare talent. If it took a Batum-Rudy-Bayless combo it would hurt a lot, but I'd still pull the trigger. Then I'd see what I could get for Blake or Sergio to re-stock the bench.

 

[Todd]

I would trade Oden for him! The kid is fast, has great court vision, and isn't afraid to take risks. I will say that he probably wouldn't do so hot with nate as the coach, he just doesn't like to run.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Most NBA guards can't stop each other. Is it so critical?

The ones that can win championships. Isn't that the goal here?

Defense and rebounding, not fancy no look passes, win championships.

I think the price for Rubio will be too high. I think there will be several players drafted after him who will have better NBA careers. Sure, Rubio will rack up some good offensive stats and frequently make the SportsCenter Top 10 with a flashy pass, but I just don't see him leadign a team deep into the NBA play-offs. I could be wrong, but none of the other Spanish PGs to enter the NBA, including Calderon, have had any success in the play-offs.

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

So, in other words, just like Chris Paul.

No, not at all. Chris Paul has the foot speed and lateral quickness to stay in front of other NBA point guards. Does Rubio? Not that I've seen.

P.S. Chris Paul is 1st team all-defense. Do you honestly see Ricky Rubio as a future defensive star in the NBA - one of the two best best defending guards in the entire league?

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

...and the entire Denver Nuggets.

Really???????????

Gee, sure makes me wonder why four members of the Nuggets, including two of their guards, got votes for the NBA all-defensive teams.

You must be confusing the current Nuggets with the old Allen Iverson Nuggets. As soon as the Nuggets jettisoned the offensive minded Iverson for the much better defending Billups, their season turned around and they became contenders. See what a difference a good perimeter defender at the PG position can make. Denver seems to be doing pretty damn well in the post season, too. Offense is overrated. Defense is underrated.

BNM

 

[kobimel]

I did read the Draftexpress profile - he sounds like the typical euro guard on defense - high risk/high reward. Sounds like he gambles a lot to get steals. There is NOTHING in his Draftexpress profile that praises his man-to-man perimeter defense. He may be able to get away with gambling on defense playing in Europe, but my concern is will he be able to stop the bigger, stronger, faster more athletic PGs he'll have to guard in the NBA?

BNM

You know, it's absolutely hilarious to see so many comments on so many different forums about Rubio, all from either a)stereotypes, b)draft profiles, c)youtube clips or d)some combination of a, b and c. Have you ever actually seen him play in the ACB? Have you even seen him in the Euroleague? How can you judge his defense if you've barely (or never) seen him play? Ridiculous.

 

[Boob-No-More]

(I thought of a comparison for his defense: Manu Ginobili. If you're going to do "guilt by association" I guess I have to come up with a Spanish-speaking white guy. The Spurs seem to have done okay with that defense. It certainly isn't because of Tony Parker's.)

Since when does Ginobili guard the opposing team's PG? That's who Rubio will be trying to guard.

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

You know, it's absolutely hilarious to see so many comments on so many different forums about Rubio, all from either a)stereotypes, b)draft profiles, c)youtube clips or d)some combination of a, b and c. Have you ever actually seen him play in the ACB? Have you even seen him in the Euroleague? How can you judge his defense if you've barely (or never) seen him play? Ridiculous.

Have you ever seen him play in the NBA? How can you be so sure he will be able to guard NBA point guards? Ridiculous.

BNM

 

[kobimel]

Have you ever seen him play in the NBA? How can you be so sure he will be able to guard NBA point guards? Ridiculous.

BNM

I never said that I'm sure he will be able to. You're the one who immediately dismissed that option, for some twisted, stereotypical reason.

That's also an extremely weak argument. Have you ever seen ANY of the draftees play in the NBA? No. You judge them by their performance in college. Just like you should judge Rubio's performance by his play in Spain and the Euroleague.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I never said that I'm sure he will be able to. You're the one who immediately dismissed that option, for some twisted, stereotypical reason.

That's also an extremely weak argument. Have you ever seen ANY of the draftees play in the NBA? No. You judge them by their performance in college. Just like you should judge Rubio's performance by his play in Spain and the Euroleague.

So, then. If you know so much, do you honestly think Rubio will be an even average NBA defender?

BNM

 

[kobimel]

So, then. If you know so much, do you honestly think Rubio will be an even average NBA defender?

BNM

Yes. He has the right body, determination and skills. He won't be a lockdown defender right off the bat, but defense is certainly not something the team that drafts him will have to worry about.

 

[SnakeOiler]

Whats the difference between rubio and sergio? Hair color.

 

[cdub503]

Whats the difference between rubio and sergio? Hair color.

not even its the hair length if anything