2008 GM Draft 1 Peer Evaluation Thread

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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ Aug 6 2008, 09:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Gooden put up 14.6 and 9.3 boards in 31 MPG for the Bulls. 1.7 BPG, too.

His defense is average, not horrible.

He may end up playing a lot of C for the Bulls this coming season.</div>

He is the biggest stat compiler in the league. That's not hyperbole. The biggest.

Th gap between his production in the box score and his actual contribution to winning is the largest in the league, IMO. That includes Zach Randolph and Stephon Marbury, too.

He sucks. He'll have a good game or make some difficult shots or get a timely block and you will be like "Oh, man! This guy is better than I thought!"

Then you'll look at the standings and you'll notice the more he plays, the worse your team gets. That's because he is clueless about team basketball and his role in playing it. It's not a coincidence that such a productive guy keeps getting benched and traded. I'm guessing LeBron threw a party when he left.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Aug 6 2008, 10:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ Aug 6 2008, 09:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Gooden put up 14.6 and 9.3 boards in 31 MPG for the Bulls. 1.7 BPG, too.

His defense is average, not horrible.

He may end up playing a lot of C for the Bulls this coming season.</div>

He is the biggest stat compiler in the league. That's not hyperbole. The biggest.

Th gap between his production in the box score and his actual contribution to winning is the largest in the league, IMO. That includes Zach Randolph and Stephon Marbury, too.

He sucks. He'll have a good game or make some difficult shots or get a timely block and you will be like "Oh, man! This guy is better than I thought!"

Then you'll look at the standings and you'll notice the more he plays, the worse your team gets. That's because he is clueless about team basketball and his role in playing it. It's not a coincidence that such a productive guy keeps getting benched and traded. I'm guessing LeBron threw a party when he left.
</div>

UH OH. Prepare for Denny Crane to take shots at your team because you don't like a player someone else picked!
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jerseycarter15 @ Aug 7 2008, 12:07 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>C:Ben Wallace
PF:Antawn Jamison
SF:James Posey
SG:Vince Carter
PG:Andre Miller

DISCUSS</div>

Worst team in the draft. Sorry, but that's how I see it. I think that starting line-up could only be as high as an average team in the real NBA (without the benefit of a league-wide fantasy draft). The players you picked went way too high for their value, or aren't starting quality.
 
I wonder what you guys think of my team so far


C BPA
PF Al Jefferson
SF Travis Outlaw
SG J.R Smith
PG Jose Calderon.



And if all you have to say is "dumbest team" then keep it to yourself. I need more constructive criticism
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Claud @ Aug 7 2008, 12:40 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I wonder what you guys think of my team so far


C BPA
PF Al Jefferson
SF Travis Outlaw
SG J.R Smith
PG Jose Calderon.



And if all you have to say is "dumbest team" then keep it to yourself. I need more constructive criticism
</div>

You should draft a smart center.
 
Claud you should not tell everyone your drafting strategy mid-draft
 
Also, nice avatar with a dude rocking an Alonzo Mourning jersey!

Nice tribute to a player loved by the Nets fan-base.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Aug 7 2008, 12:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jerseycarter15 @ Aug 7 2008, 12:07 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>C:Ben Wallace
PF:Antawn Jamison
SF:James Posey
SG:Vince Carter
PG:Andre Miller

DISCUSS</div>

Worst team in the draft. Sorry, but that's how I see it. I think that starting line-up could only be as high as an average team in the real NBA (without the benefit of a league-wide fantasy draft). The players you picked went way too high for their value, or aren't starting quality.
</div>


And yet, (on paper) still looks better than:
C: Unnamed Center
PF: Unnamed PF
SF: Unnamed SF
SG: Carter
PG: Harris
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lukewarmplay @ Aug 7 2008, 01:26 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Aug 7 2008, 12:31 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jerseycarter15 @ Aug 7 2008, 12:07 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>C:Ben Wallace
PF:Antawn Jamison
SF:James Posey
SG:Vince Carter
PG:Andre Miller

DISCUSS</div>

Worst team in the draft. Sorry, but that's how I see it. I think that starting line-up could only be as high as an average team in the real NBA (without the benefit of a league-wide fantasy draft). The players you picked went way too high for their value, or aren't starting quality.
</div>


And yet, (on paper) still looks better than:
C: Unnamed Center
PF: Unnamed PF
SF: Unnamed SF
SG: Carter
PG: Harris
</div>

Actually I would disagree. Carter is a constant so lets throw that out. I'd take Harris over Miller (although I'll admit that a lot of that<strike> is bias</strike> has to do with taking a younger player and the GM Draft is a one-year thing). And then given the choice of 3 random guys or a team that has to start Posey, Jamison (good player), or Big Ben, I take my chances.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid Chocolate @ Aug 6 2008, 11:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Claud @ Aug 7 2008, 12:40 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I wonder what you guys think of my team so far


C BPA
PF Al Jefferson
SF Travis Outlaw
SG J.R Smith
PG Jose Calderon.



And if all you have to say is "dumbest team" then keep it to yourself. I need more constructive criticism
</div>

You should draft a smart center.
</div>


Lol good one..
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Aug 6 2008, 11:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Claud you should not tell everyone your drafting strategy mid-draft
</div>


Haha nah man I like my team and that is what counts right? Also im anxious to see how my players do next season so i can come back and tell both you and KC that you were WRONG.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Claud @ Aug 7 2008, 09:34 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Aug 6 2008, 11:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Claud you should not tell everyone your drafting strategy mid-draft
</div>


Haha nah man I like my team and that is what counts right? Also im anxious to see how my players do next season so i can come back and tell both you and KC that you were WRONG.

</div>

Tell me that I was wrong how? I never I thought your team was bad or the players were bad pick.

I like JR Smith. Outlaw I have no feelings on. Outlaw has talent. JR is an offensively talented player.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid Chocolate @ Aug 7 2008, 08:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Claud @ Aug 7 2008, 09:34 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Aug 6 2008, 11:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Claud you should not tell everyone your drafting strategy mid-draft
</div>


Haha nah man I like my team and that is what counts right? Also im anxious to see how my players do next season so i can come back and tell both you and KC that you were WRONG.

</div>

Tell me that I was wrong how? I never I thought your team was bad or the players were bad pick.

I like JR Smith. Outlaw I have no feelings on. Outlaw has talent. JR is an offensively talented player.
</div>

Well you think both Outlaw & Smith have low basketball IQ right?.... And I disagree. That's why I said that Ill be watching the players I picked and hopefully prove you wrong. How do you measure basketball IQ anyway? Is there a test nba players take?! Or you just watch the games and say oh yeah, those 2 are just stupidddddddddddddd?! Because if thats how you measure bb IQ then you have no credibility because last time I checked you are not an nba scout and and you are just stating you opinion as a FAN and that is all.





PS- I changed my avatar, lol I thought it said # 83 not #33.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Claud @ Aug 7 2008, 10:02 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid Chocolate @ Aug 7 2008, 08:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Claud @ Aug 7 2008, 09:34 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Aug 6 2008, 11:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Claud you should not tell everyone your drafting strategy mid-draft
</div>


Haha nah man I like my team and that is what counts right? Also im anxious to see how my players do next season so i can come back and tell both you and KC that you were WRONG.

</div>

Tell me that I was wrong how? I never I thought your team was bad or the players were bad pick.

I like JR Smith. Outlaw I have no feelings on. Outlaw has talent. JR is an offensively talented player.
</div>

Well you think both Outlaw & Smith have low basketball IQ right?.... And I disagree. That's why I said that Ill be watching the players I picked and hopefully prove you wrong. How do you measure basketball IQ anyway? Is there a test nba players take?! Or you just watch the games and say oh yeah, those 2 are just stupidddddddddddddd?! Because if thats how you measure bb IQ then you have no credibility because last time I checked you are not an nba scout and and you are just stating you opinion as a FAN and that is all.
</div>

There is no objective statistic to measure b-ball IQ, but pleeeeeeeeeeease let's not get into that argument again. I would just like you to answer me this question truthfully, and leave it at that. Do you think JR Smith and Travis Outlaw are smart players?

There's so much wrong with the last sentence. That was probably one of the stupidest things I've ever seen on this board, and that's saying A LOT.
So no one's OPINIONS on this board are credible because we are all fans and not NBA scouts?
Why do we have a GM Draft Peer evaluation thread, then? None of the opinions matter, no one has any credibility, according to you.
The problem is that many people just post in this thread because they want others to say how good their team is.
A likely exchanges is, as follows:
Person 1: What do you think of my team? *posts team*
Person 2: They look good, nice picking! What do you think of my team? *posts team*
Person 1: Thanks, you're team is the awesome, too!

I've never said to you, hey Claud, you're team sucks, you are a GM draft r-tard! I told you what I thought was wrong with your team, and you cried about it.
 
Alright:

C - Andres Biedrins
PF - Udonis Haslem
SF - Luol Deng
SG - KOBE!
PG - Beno Udrih

I can't decide if Udrih is a player who helps you win or not, but he's pretty young and he's the 5th starter, so I thought he was a good value at the pick.

I've got Kobe, so it's a playoff team. I'm just wondering if it's (on its way to) championship worthy.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ly_yng @ Aug 7 2008, 01:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Alright:

C - Andres Biedrins
PF - Udonis Haslem
SF - Luol Deng
SG - KOBE!
PG - Beno Udrih

I can't decide if Udrih is a player who helps you win or not, but he's pretty young and he's the 5th starter, so I thought he was a good value at the pick.

I've got Kobe, so it's a playoff team. I'm just wondering if it's (on its way to) championship worthy.</div>

I'm disappointed that for someone who likes to search for pics of their players you couldn't find this one.
luolz.jpg
 
wait what was I wrong about, that you shouldn't announce to everyone that you're taking the BPA with your next pick?
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid Chocolate @ Aug 7 2008, 01:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I'm disappointed that for someone who likes to search for pics of their players you couldn't find this one.</div>

epic_fail.jpg
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lukewarmplay @ Aug 6 2008, 10:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Aug 6 2008, 08:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid Chocolate @ Aug 6 2008, 08:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What makes you say they are better on defense?</div>

Because Joe Johnson and Drew Gooden are better defenders than Hedo Turkoglu and Rashard Lewis.

Actually, I don't even know who my other wing is gonna be, or if JJ is gonna play SF or SG. So I might have to compare JJ to Evans...which I'm not sure he's better.

Still, with a natural PF with good defense and rebounding, should be a bit better
</div>

You impugn Hedo's defense? What stats can I use to disprove this, since I didn't get to watch Orlando last year and can't simply say he's a better defender? (His 82games defensive stats, btw, seem to better than, say, Caron Butlers.)
</div>

For shame. If you're trying to take a shot at me using 82games to justify Butler being better than Gerald Wallace, at least make some sense. I never used 82games defensive stats in my argument. I used their offensive stats to show that Butler was better in "clutch" play than Wallace was, and the stats clearly supported my argument. For shame.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JCB @ Aug 7 2008, 01:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lukewarmplay @ Aug 6 2008, 10:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Aug 6 2008, 08:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid Chocolate @ Aug 6 2008, 08:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What makes you say they are better on defense?</div>

Because Joe Johnson and Drew Gooden are better defenders than Hedo Turkoglu and Rashard Lewis.

Actually, I don't even know who my other wing is gonna be, or if JJ is gonna play SF or SG. So I might have to compare JJ to Evans...which I'm not sure he's better.

Still, with a natural PF with good defense and rebounding, should be a bit better
</div>

You impugn Hedo's defense? What stats can I use to disprove this, since I didn't get to watch Orlando last year and can't simply say he's a better defender? (His 82games defensive stats, btw, seem to better than, say, Caron Butlers.)
</div>

For shame. If you're trying to take a shot at me using 82games to justify Butler being better than Gerald Wallace, at least make some sense. I never used 82games defensive stats in my argument. I used their offensive stats to show that Butler was better in "clutch" play than Wallace was, and the stats clearly supported my argument. For shame.
</div>

Wait, what? I never disagreed with you- in fact, I used the same stats to show Hedo was comparable to Butler in clutch play, and then I was trying to figure out how to use 82games to analyze defense.
 
PG: TJ Ford
SG: Ray Allen
SF: Francisco Garcia
PF: Emeka Okafor
C: Tim Duncan

Thoughts so far?
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JFizzleRaider @ Aug 7 2008, 02:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>PG: TJ Ford
SG: Ray Allen
SF: Francisco Garcia
PF: Emeka Okafor
C: Tim Duncan

Thoughts so far?</div>

Idk about Francisco Garcia, because I've watched him play twice and never paid attention to him, but the rest of your team looks pretty good.

You've got Timmy and Okafor splitting the defense/rebounding. They'll both be able to cover up ray and tj's mistakes.

Ray, TJ, and Duncan can handle most of the scoring (in no particular order), with the other 2 filling in some as well.

What's the upside on Francisco? Could he potentially be as good as Tayshaun Prince?
 
Nice pick in Francisco, I really like him. He's going to be a very good player, as long as he keeps his head on straight.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Aug 7 2008, 01:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JFizzleRaider @ Aug 7 2008, 02:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>PG: TJ Ford
SG: Ray Allen
SF: Francisco Garcia
PF: Emeka Okafor
C: Tim Duncan

Thoughts so far?</div>

Idk about Francisco Garcia, because I've watched him play twice and never paid attention to him, but the rest of your team looks pretty good.

You've got Timmy and Okafor splitting the defense/rebounding. They'll both be able to cover up ray and tj's mistakes.

Ray, TJ, and Duncan can handle most of the scoring (in no particular order), with the other 2 filling in some as well.

What's the upside on Francisco? Could he potentially be as good as Tayshaun Prince?
</div>

I picked Garcia because he can take the ball-handling pressure of TJ a little bit. He's also a good shooter with 39% 3 PT and 46% FG. He's also pretty good at stealing, I don't think he will ever be as good defensively as Prince though.

If someone gets past him I'll have Okafor and Duncan there, so I'm not too worried.
 
Finally got my starting five.

Derek Fisher, Dwayne Wade, Lamar Odom, Zach Randolph, Tyson Chandler


Your thoughts?
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CelticKing @ Aug 7 2008, 04:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Finally got my starting five.

Derek Fisher, Dwayne Wade, Lamar Odom, Zach Randolph, Tyson Chandler


Your thoughts?</div>

Reminds me of the Lakers, pre-Pau.

Fisher, Kobe & Wade (for arguments sake, comparable), LO, Randolph & Kwame (comparable), Chandler & Bynum (again, comparable).
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lukewarmplay @ Aug 7 2008, 02:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JCB @ Aug 7 2008, 01:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lukewarmplay @ Aug 6 2008, 10:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Aug 6 2008, 08:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid Chocolate @ Aug 6 2008, 08:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What makes you say they are better on defense?</div>

Because Joe Johnson and Drew Gooden are better defenders than Hedo Turkoglu and Rashard Lewis.

Actually, I don't even know who my other wing is gonna be, or if JJ is gonna play SF or SG. So I might have to compare JJ to Evans...which I'm not sure he's better.

Still, with a natural PF with good defense and rebounding, should be a bit better
</div>

You impugn Hedo's defense? What stats can I use to disprove this, since I didn't get to watch Orlando last year and can't simply say he's a better defender? (His 82games defensive stats, btw, seem to better than, say, Caron Butlers.)
</div>

For shame. If you're trying to take a shot at me using 82games to justify Butler being better than Gerald Wallace, at least make some sense. I never used 82games defensive stats in my argument. I used their offensive stats to show that Butler was better in "clutch" play than Wallace was, and the stats clearly supported my argument. For shame.
</div>

Wait, what? I never disagreed with you- in fact, I used the same stats to show Hedo was comparable to Butler in clutch play, and then I was trying to figure out how to use 82games to analyze defense.
</div>

The way you typed it ("His 82games defensive stats, btw, seem to better than, say, Caron Butlers") just seemed antagonizing to me. Thought it was a shot at me for trying to use stats to prove a point. Guess I was wrong. My bad.
 
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