Politics A new witness is about to damage Trump.

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calvin natt said:
At this point you have to fight fire with fire. Trump and his lunatic fans don’t play fair. They lie, cheat and spread a false narrative. If you sit back and play nice it’ll never stop. I’m not worried about a “civil war”, so to me this is all just to get them out of office and hopefully in jail. Fuck them.
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History has a tendency to repeat itself, go look at the rhetoric and hate, breakdown in communication in our civil war and other civil wars. Its eerily similar and heck yeah I am worried about it, I have kids that I dont want to have to live through that.

I also completely disagree with you about how to handle it. Hate begets hate, and thats exactly what we see right now nationally, everyone’s fighting pointing the finger, yelling, and occasionally committing mass shootings. I have no problem with pointed, attacks at Trump or the leaders in the GOP for supporting him, I do have an issue with saying “all Republicans” like every single person who is registered as an R falls under the same stereotypes, which is what I objected to in the first place.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
History has a tendency to repeat itself, go look at the rhetoric and hate, breakdown in communication in our civil war and other civil wars. Its eerily similar and heck yeah I am worried about it, I have kids that I dont want to have to live through that.

I also completely disagree with you about how to handle it. Hate begets hate, and thats exactly what we see right now nationally, everyone’s fighting pointing the finger, yelling, and occasionally committing mass shootings. I have no problem with pointed, attacks at Trump or the leaders in the GOP for supporting him, I do have an issue with saying “all Republicans” like every single person who is registered as an R falls under the same stereotypes, which is what I objected to in the first place.
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Then all those innocent registered Republicans need to step up. Otherwise they are guilty by association. You’re either part of the problem or solution.
 
theprunetang said:
You got a link?
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Washington post article....said the half hour conversation had at least half of the content replaced with elipses all in spots where critical conversation topics were being breached. They compared them with his talks with Australia and his talks with Mexico.....a fraction of the words for the half hour time of the call compared to any other call to a leader..Trump talks a lot. His call was clearly doctored.
 
calvin natt said:
Then all those innocent registered Republicans need to step up. Otherwise they are guilty by association. You’re either part of the problem or solution.
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I partially agree, but I'm not sure we're going to see eye to eye on and this and that's ok, can still respect your opinion. I said in 2015 if it was Trump vs. Hillary that could very well be the beginning of the end of the US, and I still believe that and so far after years of reading what people think on the internet, I've been given no reason to believe differently.
 
What will all you whiners do when the Senate probably dispenses with an impeachment in short order? Shit yourself would only seem proper with all the hate you have put into this cause.
Ha! Then you must endure another election .:blush:
 
MarAzul said:
What will all you whiners do when the Senate probably will dispense with an impeachment in short order. Shit yourself would only seem proper with all the hate you have put into this cause.
Ha! Then you must endure another election .:blush:
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hate is your word....disgust would be mine....you back on the shit yourself wagon again Marz? fact is you're whining about a conversation you don't agree with...walk the walk
 
riverman said:
hate is your word
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What else could drive a process down this road to impeachment by one party alone?

"Hamilton warned that the process of impeachment might become political, causing factions to polarize further away from each other in their defense or prosecution of the impeached individual."

I would think at least a few would back up and look to the original intent of impeachment and see it for what it is when it is all one party. A party with zero chance to see it through.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
I partially agree, but I'm not sure we're going to see eye to eye on and this and that's ok, can still respect your opinion. I said in 2015 if it was Trump vs. Hillary that could very well be the beginning of the end of the US, and I still believe that and so far after years of reading what people think on the internet, I've been given no reason to believe differently.
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And there is very clearly one side more to blame than the other. Who tends to have racists on their side? Who tends to commit most mass shootings? Who has failed at getting Mexico to build a complete waste of time wall? Who has ruined the reputation of America amongst our “allies”? This isn’t about two sides sharing equal blame. Nobody is perfect but this shit show that we have found ourselves in...hm..suddenly since Trump took over...can be mostly blamed on the right.
 
MarAzul said:
What else could drive a process down this road to impeachment by one party alone?
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Simple...lies by the president about pay for play foreign blackmail for dirt on an American citizen to influence an election....you keep ignoring what's really going on here....and the fact that your party of favor is actively obstructing the checks and balances in place because of our constitution. Trump brought all this on himself to the embarrassment of conservatives everywhere....he's got more republicans disdain than you allude to. Those that don't have the integrity to hold him accountable are just trying to stay out of the line of fire. This is adult conversation about current events Marz...you either join in or find a group that supports your narrative. Try posting about his accomplishments and resume and why you're so happy with him all you want...expect me to post why I'm so unhappy with him all I want....the oversight committee is not partisan...it has members from both parties. I can list about 100 republicans that quit or were fired in the last two and a half years who support Trumps impeachment....Kelly, Tillerson, Sessions, Bolton on and on...….Trump is no loyal republican....he's a self absorbed narcisist...he calls Putin about his assassination of the ISIS guy and doesn't even bother to tell Congress......how can anyone not find this unacceptable
 
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MarAzul said:
What else could drive a process down this road to impeachment by one party alone?

"Hamilton warned that the process of impeachment might become political, causing factions to polarize further away from each other in their defense or prosecution of the impeached individual."

I would think at least a few would back up and look to the original intent of impeachment and see it for what it is when it is all one party. A party with zero chance to see it through.
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So what. Since we know republicans will block justice democrats should just throw their hands up and look away? That’d be cowardly. Which is what you would likely do, but not how honorable people work.
 
calvin natt said:
And there is very clearly one side more to blame than the other. Who tends to have racists on their side? Who tends to commit most mass shootings? Who has failed at getting Mexico to build a complete waste of time wall? Who has ruined the reputation of America amongst our “allies”? This isn’t about two sides sharing equal blame. Nobody is perfect but this shit show that we have found ourselves in...hm..suddenly since Trump took over...can be mostly blamed on the right.
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Did I ever say anything about it being both sides? All I said that was even close to that was if it came down to “Hillary vs Trump”, but ok...
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
Did I ever say anything about it being both sides? All I said that was even close to that was if it came down to “Hillary vs Trump”, but ok...
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almost everything you post is “well I see it as both sides are guilty”. Which is fine, but that’s kind of your thing.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
There are a lot of “republican” individuals who dont like Trump though. There are a lot of republicans who dont support him.
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Are there though? Polls show Trump with ~85% approval among Republican voters.

Is the other 15% 'a lot'? It is a few million voters in absolute terms, but as a percentage, it's not that big.

barfo
 
barfo said:
Are there though? Polls show Trump with ~85% approval among Republican voters.

Is the other 15% 'a lot'? It is a few million voters in absolute terms, but as a percentage, it's not that big.

barfo
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A few million is a lot yes. Not that I’d give much credence to the polls.
 
riverman said:
This is adult conversation about current events Marz.
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Bullocks!
Until I made the post a few moments ago this is a loser's pity party praying for impeachment to fulfill their hate. History does not support your actions. The founders warn against your self absorption in the current action.
 
calvin natt said:
almost everything you post is “well I see it as both sides are guilty”. Which is fine, but that’s kind of your thing.
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It kind of cracks me up, because basically I dont make a both sides argument and you try to interject that for me, then try to say oh thats what you do, when I didnt do that. I enjoy it, if Im not super pissed off and angry at the right then the left is upset and If im not pissed off and angry at the left then the right is upset. I mean I say a lot of Anti-Trump stuff and have been pretty clear about my negative feelings about him, but I dont take it nearly as far as the people on the left want me too. Sure I make bothsides arguments here and there but I also take stances when I think one is right or one is wrong. I literally said in this very conversation that I think making pointed attacks at Trump and leaders in the GOP is fine, and said nothing about doing that to the left. I said in other threads I hope they take him down, did I say anything about Pelosi??? no, Schiff??? No, because I think they should be doing this inquiry, doesnt sound like a bothsides thing to me, but whatever.
 
MarAzul said:
History does not support your actions.
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History says this process got rid of Nixon, who was significantly less corrupt than Trump, so I don't think I agree.

barfo
 
barfo said:
Why not?

barfo
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I understand statistics and how they work and Im sure theres a vast majority of republicans who are ok with Trump, but is it 85/15? Who knows I wouldnt be at all surprised if its like a +/- 10, many of those polls are just not doing a great job of getting good data at least it seems that way.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
I understand statistics and how they work and Im sure theres a vast majority of republicans who are ok with Trump, but is it 85/15? Who knows I wouldnt be at all surprised if its like a +/- 10, many of those polls are just not doing a great job of getting good data at least it seems that way.
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Well, taking your +/- 10, that means somewhere between 75 and 95% of Republicans support Trump. That's a lot. The 5 to 25% who don't? Less than a lot.

As stereotypes go, 'Republicans support Trump' is actually a relatively well-grounded one.

But it is wrong to say 'All Republicans support Trump', for sure.

barfo
 
MarAzul said:
Bullocks!
Until I made the post a few moments ago this is a loser's pity party praying for impeachment to fulfill their hate. History does not support your actions. The founders warn against your self absorption in the current action.
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I dont hate Trump, thats not how I really work, but I believe he needs to be impeached and removed from office. If they find that he’s holding foreign aid over an ally’s head for dirt on a political adversary then he is not acting in the best interest of the American people he’s acting in the best interest of his political campaigns.

I get what you’re saying let the election process do what it is intended to do, but an abuse of power for political gain is pretty serious stuff...

Theres a littany of other things too, but Im not sure they’re impeachable offenses.
 
barfo said:
Well, taking your +/- 10, that means somewhere between 75 and 95% of Republicans support Trump. That's a lot. The 5 to 25% who don't? Less than a lot.

As stereotypes go, 'Republicans support Trump' is actually a relatively well-grounded one.

But it is wrong to say 'All Republicans support Trump', for sure.

barfo
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Well a lot is subjective in this case, are a majority of Republicans Trump supporters? Yes no doubt there.
 
TorturedBlazerFan said:
It kind of cracks me up, because basically I dont make a both sides argument and you try to interject that for me, then try to say oh thats what you do, when I didnt do that. I enjoy it, if Im not super pissed off and angry at the right then the left is upset and If im not pissed off and angry at the left then the right is upset. I mean I say a lot of Anti-Trump stuff and have been pretty clear about my negative feelings about him, but I dont take it nearly as far as the people on the left want me too. Sure I make bothsides arguments here and there but I also take stances when I think one is right or one is wrong. I literally said in this very conversation that I think making pointed attacks at Trump and leaders in the GOP is fine, and said nothing about doing that to the left. I said in other threads I hope they take him down, did I say anything about Pelosi??? no, Schiff??? No, because I think they should be doing this inquiry, doesnt sound like a bothsides thing to me, but whatever.
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My memory is that you tend to say “well both sides” this and that. It’s fine. We probably need more of it. It’s not a big deal.
 
calvin natt said:
My memory is that you tend to say “well both sides” this and that. It’s fine. We probably need more of it. It’s not a big deal.
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Im sorry, Im having a particularly frustrating day. Im not trying to be a dick it’s just coming naturally at this point because visual studio and I are having some issues getting along. Shouldnt take it out on you.
 
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