OT ACAB All Cops Are Bastards (yes EVERY one)

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Phatguysrule said:
The color of their skin has nothing to do with the way they are acting.
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This, patently, is ridiculous.

The idea that it does is racist. Omitting somebody from a position because of the color of their skin would be unconstitutional, and we don't want that changed.
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This, aspirationally, is reasonable. All cops are bastards, even the ones who are not white.

Part of making this practically reasonable would involve deprogramming white supremecist thinking from white cops. White supremecism and racism isn't people in white hoods and lynchings and the n-word. Those are symptoms, but not causes. Systemic racism, systemic white supremacy, is baked into the way the United States is structured. It is nearly invisible, and is meant to be totally invisible to white people. If you don't have to engage your sympathy because you don't know about it, you won't work from the inside to tear it down.

White cops are a symptom of all cops. All cops, though, are a tool of systemic white supremacy... any work to dismantle racism in America has to start with the mental and moral fortitude to dismantle the tools of white supremacy, and that means tearing down the cops to build up something community oriented and supportive instead. Cops protect property; they don't serve people. This should be the other way around. If we have more systems that serve people, and keep them from desperation, if we have systems that push towards wealth equality and mutual support, crime will go down and disorder will go down. But once you've got yours, you are less likely to share, so tearing down the systems means taking toys away from a lot of people who just happen to have a lot of the power.

It's a struggle, and no single effort will finish the work until the last effort does. Revolution is a series of failures that hopefully more the bar a little closer to equality for all. Progress has to be made in small steps, and victories seen not as the total implementation of the dream, but of making the life of people a little better each time, in ways that *actually* benefit people.
 
YamTastic said:
This, patently, is ridiculous.



This, aspirationally, is reasonable. All cops are bastards, even the ones who are not white.

Part of making this practically reasonable would involve deprogramming white supremecist thinking from white cops. White supremecism and racism isn't people in white hoods and lynchings and the n-word. Those are symptoms, but not causes. Systemic racism, systemic white supremacy, is baked into the way the United States is structured. It is nearly invisible, and is meant to be totally invisible to white people. If you don't have to engage your sympathy because you don't know about it, you won't work from the inside to tear it down.

White cops are a symptom of all cops. All cops, though, are a tool of systemic white supremacy... any work to dismantle racism in America has to start with the mental and moral fortitude to dismantle the tools of white supremacy, and that means tearing down the cops to build up something community oriented and supportive instead. Cops protect property; they don't serve people. This should be the other way around. If we have more systems that serve people, and keep them from desperation, if we have systems that push towards wealth equality and mutual support, crime will go down and disorder will go down. But once you've got yours, you are less likely to share, so tearing down the systems means taking toys away from a lot of people who just happen to have a lot of the power.

It's a struggle, and no single effort will finish the work until the last effort does. Revolution is a series of failures that hopefully more the bar a little closer to equality for all. Progress has to be made in small steps, and victories seen not as the total implementation of the dream, but of making the life of people a little better each time, in ways that *actually* benefit people.
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A bastard is a fatherless child. Not all cops are fatherless….
Ill remove myself from this thread. Too much incorrect generalizing going on.
 
BlazerBender said:
Not sure what that means. Do you think people are incapable of not generalizing? That its a fantasy to expect people to judge individually?
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What I'm saying is that your statement is the "ideal". But as we have seen too many times for far too long, humans have not yet evolved to that point and likely never will. We can't get past our own greed, envy and stupidity.
 
UncleCliffy'sDaddy said:
I thought that was what we were trying to do. Especially since George Floyd. Pick up a newspaper (Metaphorically speaking). Any newspaper. It hasn't been working worth a shit and only seems to get worse. The incident above that sparked this exchange is one more example in a never ending list.
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And entering a race war, as what you are suggesting would be, is only going make it far worse far faster.
 
Chris Craig said:
Actually it does

White male privilege.
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That has nothing to do with the color of their skin. That is a behavior. Skin color does not predict bahavior.

Fucking Christ I can't believe I have to spell this out.
 
UncleCliffy'sDaddy said:
What I'm saying is that your statement is the "ideal". But as we have seen too many times for far too long, humans have not yet evolved to that point and likely never will. We can't get past our own greed, envy and stupidity.
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YamTastic said:
This, patently, is ridiculous.



This, aspirationally, is reasonable. All cops are bastards, even the ones who are not white.

Part of making this practically reasonable would involve deprogramming white supremecist thinking from white cops. White supremecism and racism isn't people in white hoods and lynchings and the n-word. Those are symptoms, but not causes. Systemic racism, systemic white supremacy, is baked into the way the United States is structured. It is nearly invisible, and is meant to be totally invisible to white people. If you don't have to engage your sympathy because you don't know about it, you won't work from the inside to tear it down.

White cops are a symptom of all cops. All cops, though, are a tool of systemic white supremacy... any work to dismantle racism in America has to start with the mental and moral fortitude to dismantle the tools of white supremacy, and that means tearing down the cops to build up something community oriented and supportive instead. Cops protect property; they don't serve people. This should be the other way around. If we have more systems that serve people, and keep them from desperation, if we have systems that push towards wealth equality and mutual support, crime will go down and disorder will go down. But once you've got yours, you are less likely to share, so tearing down the systems means taking toys away from a lot of people who just happen to have a lot of the power.

It's a struggle, and no single effort will finish the work until the last effort does. Revolution is a series of failures that hopefully more the bar a little closer to equality for all. Progress has to be made in small steps, and victories seen not as the total implementation of the dream, but of making the life of people a little better each time, in ways that *actually* benefit people.
Click to expand...
And officially banning people from specific jobs because of the color of their skin would eliminate any progress that has ever been made to eliminate or fight racism.

The suggestion is horrific and ignorant.
 
Phatguysrule said:
That has nothing to do with the color of their skin. That is a behavior. Skin color does not predict bahavior.

Fucking Christ I can't believe I have to spell this out.
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Yes it does. Because they are white they think they are superior.
 
Phatguysrule said:
That has nothing to do with the color of their skin. That is a behavior. Skin color does not predict bahavior.

Fucking Christ I can't believe I have to spell this out.
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I think I see what you're saying. The idea here being that, at birth, you cannot predict that any one white person will or won't be a racist. Absolutely, of course. This is so obvious that this is not the debate.

The problem is when you intersect "All White People" with "People Who Want To Be Cops" and "People Who Stay Cops Even Though They Know What Cops Do", and you end up with basically zero white people who don't act like these cops.
 
Phatguysrule said:
So you think you're superior because you're white?

I didn't know that. I thought better of you.
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No I don't. Never said that. Don't put words in my mouth.

Don't be ridiculous.

They do. And they sought out a job where they could use that perceived superiority. We are seeing it played out.
 
Phatguysrule said:
And officially banning people from specific jobs because of the color of their skin would eliminate any progress that has ever been made to eliminate or fight racism.

The suggestion is horrific and ignorant.
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Oh, I'm banning the job, not the people. What others are saying is well-intentioned but wrong-headed, and won't solve the problem.
 
Chris Craig said:
No I don't. Never said that. Don't put words in my mouth.

Don't be ridiculous.

They do. And they sought out a job where they could use that perceived superiority. We are seeing it played out.
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I wanna support Phatguys here. Cops are cops. It doesn't matter their skin color. White supremacy isn't about individual white people; it's a system and structure, and some minorities benefit from it if they believe and do certain things. A black cop who believes fervently in his job is upholding white supremacy just as much as the 3 percenter white cop next to him.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I hope the EMTs put this dude on a list and if he ever needs an ambulance they tell him to fuck off.
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It would be really interesting if one day he needed an ambulance and the same EMT showed up. I guarantee she would help him and she should despite him being the fucked up asshole he is.
 
YamTastic said:
Oh, I'm banning the job, not the people. What others are saying is well-intentioned but wrong-headed, and won't solve the problem.
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I think we need somebody to maintain law and order. But you're 100% correct that our current police force is not doing that, and we need a drastic change.
 
YamTastic said:
I wanna support Phatguys here. Cops are cops. It doesn't matter their skin color. White supremacy isn't about individual white people; it's a system and structure, and some minorities benefit from it if they believe and do certain things. A black cop who believes fervently in his job is upholding white supremacy just as much as the 3 percenter white cop next to him.
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I wasn't saying all white people are supremacists. I was saying based on the system those types of characters find their way into the profession.

But, it's not just that. It's ex military guys who went from killing enemies to patrolling streets in America.

There is a lot of people who don't belong being cops.
 
Phatguysrule said:
I think we need somebody to maintain law and order. But you're 100% correct that our current police force is not doing that, and we need a drastic change.
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We can agree to that.
 
Chris Craig said:
No I don't. Never said that. Don't put words in my mouth.

Don't be ridiculous.

They do. And they sought out a job where they could use that perceived superiority. We are seeing it played out.
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Exactly it's ridiculous. So stop supporting it.
 
Phatguysrule said:
I think we need somebody to maintain law and order. But you're 100% correct that our current police force is not doing that, and we need a drastic change.
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We need structures to protect and serve the communities. The police do neither, and we as a society keep banging our heads against a glass window thinking it's an open door trying to wrap our heads around that fact. Fuck, even something as simple as forcing cops to live where they serve would be a start, but I don't like incrementalism with this system; it feels like small progress would backslide too easily.
 
Chris Craig said:
I wasn't saying all white people are supremacists. I was saying based on the system those types of characters find their way into the profession.

But, it's not just that. It's ex military guys who went from killing enemies to patrolling streets in America.

There is a lot of people who don't belong being cops.
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Yeah, just like politics, anyone who wants the job definitely shouldn't have it.
 
YamTastic said:
We need structures to protect and serve the communities. The police do neither, and we as a society keep banging our heads against a glass window thinking it's an open door trying to wrap our heads around that fact. Fuck, even something as simple as forcing cops to live where they serve would be a start, but I don't like incrementalism with this system; it feels like small progress would backslide too easily.
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They should definitely get to know the people of the communities they patrol in.
 
YamTastic said:
I think I see what you're saying. The idea here being that, at birth, you cannot predict that any one white person will or won't be a racist. Absolutely, of course. This is so obvious that this is not the debate.

The problem is when you intersect "All White People" with "People Who Want To Be Cops" and "People Who Stay Cops Even Though They Know What Cops Do", and you end up with basically zero white people who don't act like these cops.
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I don't act like those cops. I wouldn't act like that if I were a cop. Because I'm not a racist asshole. Most white people are not racist assholes. But corrupt racist assholes tend to get rid of people who would turn them in for being corrupt racist assholes.

The problem is solved by holding police accountable, not judging people based on the color of their skin, as has been suggested.
 
Chris Craig said:
They should definitely get to know the people of the communities they patrol in.
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I think you do this by giving them homes in that community. Yes, they are forced to live there, but they get to live rent free. And then you pay them for the appreciate they would have earned if they had purchased that house when they leave.

Of course, this all comes with drastically overhauled system to hold police (or peace keeper, or whatever you want to call them) accountable.
 
Phatguysrule said:
And officially banning people from specific jobs because of the color of their skin would eliminate any progress that has ever been made to eliminate or fight racism.

The suggestion is horrific and ignorant.
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I've been called worse.......
 
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