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jonnyboy said:
Kamala Harris is one of the most unpopular and unqualified people to ever sit in her seat. It has nothing to do with color or sex (the only traits you seem to care about) either. The woman is a total moron.
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Even if that were true, she's still magnitudes better than Donald Trump, who, BTW, is tremendously unpopular himself.
 
jonnyboy said:
Kamala Harris is one of the most unpopular and unqualified people to ever sit in her seat. It has nothing to do with color or sex (the only traits you seem to care about) either. The woman is a total moron. The Democrats need a new ticket badly.
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There is no way she's dummer than Trump. No way in hell.

She'll get 4 votes from my household over Trump. Guaranteed.
 
https://www.motherjones.com/politic...courting-trump-despite-his-anti-labor-record/

Going to be interesting how this shakes out.

My confidence is high it’s just a political ploy by O’Brien to not alienate his more dumb right wing constituents.

I wouldn’t have a problem if he did this with a typical Republican candidate. But, Trump has proven to be the most anti union president in history with weakening the NLRA board.
 
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JFizzleRaider said:
I'm thinking Gavin would have faired better than Harris. No idea if he would have won. But, could have been closer. They should look at him real close in 4 years.
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Maybe. But he also has a reputation as a sellout and being from California doesn’t really resonate with the rust belt voter.
 
Shaboid said:
Should have been an open convention. People want entertainment with their politics these days, 10 floor votes would have had that.
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It would have at least given Dems a tested candidate. Who had a chance to do plenty of debates that the Republicans couldn't block out of fear.

Dems need somebody like Bernie or Pete who is willing and able to debate and destroy any and all comers on policy.

And they'll need to be very likable and persuasive.
 
Bold prediction:

Shapiro wins in 2028.

I can’t think of a better candidate than a popular governor from a swing state that has bipartisan popularity. That’s young, fiesty, has good ideas and smarter than anything the right can trot out there.
 
MickZagger said:
Bold prediction:

Shapiro wins in 2028.

I can’t think of a better candidate than a popular governor from a swing state that has bipartisan popularity. That’s young, fiesty, has good ideas and smarter than anything the right can trot out there.
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He an effective communicator, and I bet he willing to comprise some, to get things done. I also like Rickie Torres. He gets it, imo.
 
Hoopguru said:
He an effective communicator, and I bet he willing to comprise some, to get things done. I also like Rickie Torres. He gets it, imo.
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I like Rickie too. He’s kinda been saying what I’ve been telling some family and friends all along. The far left and the culture war are dooming the Democratic Party
 
Phatguysrule said:
It would have at least given Dems a tested candidate. Who had a chance to do plenty of debates that the Republicans couldn't block out of fear.

Dems need somebody like Bernie or Pete who is willing and able to debate and destroy any and all comers on policy.

And they'll need to be very likable and persuasive.
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Kamala won the debate easily, it didn't matter.

Definitely agree with likable and persuasive, though.

barfo
 
barfo said:
Kamala won the debate easily, it didn't matter.

Definitely agree with likable and persuasive, though.

barfo
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It definitely mattered. Her numbers went way up after that. Trump's went way down.

If she had a bunch of debates against Democrats she would have had an opportunity to get the party behind her.

But then Trump ran away from any more debates. And she lost. Exactly my point.
 
Phatguysrule said:
And then the Trump ran away from any more debates. And she lost. Exactly my point.
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So if we had a better debater, Trump would have done more debates??
I think I'm completely missing your point.

barfo
 
barfo said:
So if we had a better debater, Trump would have done more debates??
I think I'm completely missing your point.

barfo
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No, debates between Democrats. And the best one would come out, ideally. They would then be tested among the Democrats. We would know how Democrats actually respond to them instead of hoping with Harris.

Except, we already knew with Harris. Democrats didn't like her in 2020 and they weren't interested in voting for her in 2024.
 
Phatguysrule said:
No, debates between Democrats. And the best one would come out, ideally. They would then be tested among the Democrats. We would know how Democrats actually respond to them instead of hoping with Harris.

Except, we already knew with Harris. Democrats didn't like her in 2020 and they weren't interested in voting for her in 2024.
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Ok. I do understand now.

The counter-argument, though, is that people who vote in Democratic primaries maybe aren't the people who don't bother to show up for general elections, or who vote for Trump if they do vote.

barfo
 
barfo said:
Ok. I do understand now.

The counter-argument, though, is that people who vote in Democratic primaries maybe aren't the people who don't bother to show up for general elections, or who vote for Trump if they do vote.

barfo
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It's not about them voting it's about them having exposure while being challenged and people seeing them and being comfortable with them.

They weren't comfortable with Kamal Harris. Ever. They never picked her. They rejected her.
 
They can throw a myriad of great candidates out there. The best way to win is to let Trump crash and burn.

In their minds 2017-2021 were the glory years.
 
Phatguysrule said:
It's not about them voting it's about them having exposure while being challenged and people seeing them and being comfortable with them.

They weren't comfortable with Kamal Harris. Ever. They never picked her. They rejected her.
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Well, you'd have to show me that the people who vote in primaries are the ones who didn't vote for Kamala. I suspect that the vast majority of D primary voters did vote, and did vote for Kamala.

Or you could show me that people who don't bother to vote in primaries are heavily influenced by the primaries when they go to vote (or not) in the general. That one is really hard to imagine, I think.

barfo
 
MickZagger said:
I like Rickie too. He’s kinda been saying what I’ve been telling some family and friends all along. The far left and the culture war are dooming the Democratic Party
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Hoopguru said:
Watch for this guy.
5:40MSNBC NewsIs the ‘far left’ to blame for Trump’s win? Why Rep. Ritchie Torres thinks soVideo1 day ago
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The main themes of the left and right change from generation to generation. Right now, the definition of left concerns abortion, transsexuals, and manhatred. In the 70s, the definition was peace, drug legalization, and a more casual lifestyle including looser speech, sex, and long hair.

The long-term definition (now called Communism/Marxism) is that there shouldn't be rich people. That belief has endured for thousands of years, and is somewhat embedded in major religions except Judaism.

The latest iteration of "left" hurts the Democrats, while they run away from the ancient definition to fund their campaigns.
 
Phatguysrule said:
It's not about them voting it's about them having exposure while being challenged and people seeing them and being comfortable with them.

They weren't comfortable with Kamal Harris. Ever. They never picked her. They rejected her.
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Im think that them not having an open convention and how it appeared that Pelosi and Hollywood pushed Joe to resign, which I agreed with. The public knew for some time that he shouldn't run again and he himself said 1 term. And the same people that put pressure on him to resign are on record saying he's A ok, very capable to run again. There was plenty of time for an open convention.
 
barfo said:
Well, you'd have to show me that the people who vote in primaries are the ones who didn't vote for Kamala. I suspect that the vast majority of D primary voters did vote, and did vote for Kamala.

Or you could show me that people who don't bother to vote in primaries are heavily influenced by the primaries when they go to vote (or not) in the general. That one is really hard to imagine, I think.

barfo
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She got 15 million fewer votes than Biden. They didn't like her or they wouldn't have stayed home.

I'm suggesting that we could have found somebody the people actually liked if we actually tried to let the people make the choice.
 
Phatguysrule said:
She got 15 million fewer votes than Biden. They didn't like her or they wouldn't have stayed home.

I'm suggesting that we could have found somebody the people actually liked if we actually tried to let the people make the choice.
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And I'm saying the people who vote in primaries aren't likely to be the ones who stayed home.

And the people who vote in democratic primaries are not representative of the people overall - not a lot of Trump voters, not a lot of low-information voters, not a lot of apolitical voters.

I'm open to be proven wrong about that in this specific case, but generally people who might stay home in a presidential election are even more likely to stay home for primary elections.

barfo
 
All this complexity may be true, in lieu of the simple solution...that the CIA does its job and controls the vote software programs.
 
barfo said:
And I'm saying the people who vote in primaries aren't likely to be the ones who stayed home.

And the people who vote in democratic primaries are not representative of the people overall - not a lot of Trump voters, not a lot of low-information voters, not a lot of apolitical voters.

I'm open to be proven wrong about that in this specific case, but generally people who might stay home in a presidential election are even more likely to stay home for primary elections.

barfo
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I agree that the primaries should be different and more representative of the people, but at least people can see them more and the polls can get a read on how the people respond to the debates.

I think the primaries should honestly be a serious of debates and those who finish higher get additional funding or something.
 
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