OT Alton Sterling

[EL PRESIDENTE]

The police were informed he possibly had a firearm. Until he is cuffed and the weapon is no longer on his person, they have to assume he is a threat.

 

[Denny Crane]

The police were informed he possibly had a firearm. Until he is cuffed and the weapon is no longer on his person, they have to assume he is a threat.

They didn't shoot him on sight, therefore he wasn't a threat.

They shot him after he was subdued, on the ground, on his back.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

They didn't shoot him on sight, therefore he wasn't a threat.

They shot him after he was subdued, on the ground, on his back.

After they thought he was going for his gun.

 

[blue32]

It was pretty clear from the video that I heard "he's got a gun!". His arm was moving in the videos; he was also resisting arrest. Right there, you have three major no-no's.

Then to top it off, he's a rapist, and a prior criminal. (meaning he has a past history, and should be considered dangerous.)

 

[Spud147]

How can people keep denying these police shootings are getting more frequent, that they keep happening to black men, and that it's a problem?

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

How can people keep denying these police shootings are getting more frequent, that they keep happening to black men, and that it's a problem?

The problem is likely an anti-authority attitude and/or resisting arrest and/or some kind of aggressive behavior on behalf of those black men who are shot by police. Otherwise more cops would actually be getting prosecuted. There's no big conspiracy of police officers hunting young black men for sport. Its Occam's Razor, the simplest explanation is usually the correct one. Young black men put themselves in these situations where they are getting shot.

 

[bulls_with_booz]

The problem is likely an anti-authority attitude and/or resisting arrest and/or some kind of aggressive behavior on behalf of those black men who are shot by police. Otherwise more cops would actually be getting prosecuted. There's no big conspiracy of police officers hunting young black men for sport. Its Occam's Razor, the simplest explanation is usually the correct one. Young black men put themselves in these situations where they are getting shot.

Yeah, don't lay on your back with one arm restrained or you'll get shot. Reaching for a gun my ass.

 

[Sedatedfork]

I've never been tackled by a police officer. I honestly can't say how I would react to that. But, what about all of you gun advocates here? Aren't you concerned that if you carry a gun you will get shot just like Alton Sterling? You say he was reaching for his gun with his right hand, well he just got slammed down and he is awkwardly pushed up against a car. I can't imagine it is all that comfortable.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

Yeah, don't lay on your back with one arm restrained or you'll get shot. Reaching for a gun my ass.

He had a gun in his pocket. Which a homeless person called 911 because Alton Sterling brandished at him.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I've never been tackled by a police officer. I honestly can't say how I would react to that. But, what about all of you gun advocates here? Aren't you concerned that if you carry a gun you will get shot just like Alton Sterling? You say he was reaching for his gun with his right hand, well he just got slammed down and he is awkwardly pushed up against a car. I can't imagine it is all that comfortable.

He should not have even had the gun on him.

No one talks about this.

 

[Spud147]

The problem is likely an anti-authority attitude and/or resisting arrest and/or some kind of aggressive behavior on behalf of those black men who are shot by police. Otherwise more cops would actually be getting prosecuted. There's no big conspiracy of police officers hunting young black men for sport. Its Occam's Razor, the simplest explanation is usually the correct one. Young black men put themselves in these situations where they are getting shot.

That's a big assumption but it doesn't take away from the fact this is a problem that needs to change. This is destroying race relations in our country. It can't keep happening!

 

[bulls_with_booz]

If I have a gun on me it doesn't justify a cop shooting me. It wasn't in his hands, another officer was right on the other side of him, I don't care what he had on him or what he was doing beforehand, killing him wasn't justified.

 

[Denny Crane]

I've never been tackled by a police officer. I honestly can't say how I would react to that. But, what about all of you gun advocates here? Aren't you concerned that if you carry a gun you will get shot just like Alton Sterling? You say he was reaching for his gun with his right hand, well he just got slammed down and he is awkwardly pushed up against a car. I can't imagine it is all that comfortable.

I'm concerned I might get shot regardless. And I especially fear for my friends who aren't lily white.

 

[bulls_with_booz]

I'm concerned I might get shot regardless. And I especially fear for my friends who aren't lily white.

It's clear cops are either racially biased or are horribly under trained. You'd think shooting somebody would be a last resort, God forbid they grab his other arm or taser him.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

It's clear cops are either racially biased or are horribly under trained. You'd think shooting somebody would be a last resort, God forbid they grab his other arm or taser him.

Actually it would be the first resort since he had a gun on him and they thought he was trying to get it. That's actually how they are trained if they feel a threat.

 

[Sedatedfork]

He should not have even had the gun on him.

No one talks about this.

so, if he had a license to carry a gun, this changes the situation how exactly?

 

[Minstrel]

Actually it would be the first resort since he had a gun on him and they thought he was trying to get it. That's actually how they are trained if they feel a threat.

An imminent mortal threat. Not a vague, if-several-preventable-steps-happen threat. Even if he was reaching for a gun, which is far from established, there's no way he could have gotten it out and started firing before being restrained. Try applying common sense first, rather than your usual "BRO I'M JUST TRYING TO FIGHT THIS LIBERAL PC GARBAGE" ethos. Bro.

 

[blue32]

They were called there Bc a report of him brandishing a gun.

He resisted arrest because he's a career criminal.

Resisting arrest when a cop thinks you have a gun Bc that's why their there is bad news.

As they were restraining him he was reaching for something.

Does that warrant a shot? IDK. To be determined...

But people saying he is innocent is incorrect.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

so, if he had a license to carry a gun, this changes the situation how exactly?

He would have been required to take a gun safety course. Probably would have been more responsible instead of being all GRAND THEFT AUTO THUG LIFE and not have brandished the gun at a homeless person nor resisted arrest.

 

[bulls_with_booz]

Actually it would be the first resort since he had a gun on him and they thought he was trying to get it. That's actually how they are trained if they feel a threat.

So let me get this straight, an obese black man with one arm behind his back with two officers that are close to his upper body, is such a threat they need to shoot him five times? His hand wasn't close to his gun at all. Let's pretend he did get the gun, which if he did I think it's justified, the odds of him getting a shot off are astronomically low. According to some people, he was about to do this.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

So let me get this straight, an obese black man with one arm behind his back with two officers that are close to his upper body, is such a threat they need to shoot him five times? His hand wasn't close to his gun at all. Let's pretend he did get the gun, which if he did I think it's justified, the odds of him getting a shot off are astronomically low. According to some people, he was about to do this.

Yes. If he is attempting to reach for a firearm, the police are in imminent danger and are allowed to use lethal force.

 

[blue32]

So let me get this straight, an obese black man with one arm behind his back with two officers that are close to his upper body, is such a threat they need to shoot him five times? His hand wasn't close to his gun at all. Let's pretend he did get the gun, which if he did I think it's justified, the odds of him getting a shot off are astronomically low. According to some people, he was about to do this.

Unfortunately that is not how they are trained.

 

[bulls_with_booz]

I've watched the video over and over and I don't see him reaching for his gun. Even from the second angle. It was to me most likely a royal fuck up on the cops fault, nothing race related. If these cops are so useless without a gun and resort to it that early, the bar should be raised.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

An imminent mortal threat. Not a vague, if-several-preventable-steps-happen threat. Even if he was reaching for a gun, which is far from established, there's no way he could have gotten it out and started firing before being restrained. Try applying common sense first, rather than your usual "BRO I'M JUST TRYING TO FIGHT THIS LIBERAL PC GARBAGE" ethos. Bro.

Common sense dictates that if he is reaching for his gun during a struggle/altercation, he is going to use it and the police officers (and the public in general) are in danger. That in by itself is enough for them to use deadly force and is totally justified. You have to stop the threat before it escalates. There's no "liberal PC garbage here", this is pretty cut and dry.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

I've watched the video over and over and I don't see him reaching for his gun. Even from the second angle. It was to me most likely a royal fuck up on the cops fault, nothing race related. If these cops are so useless without a gun and resort to it that early, the bar should be raised.

If they think he's reaching for his gun, that's often enough justification.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

What happened before he was on the ground?

 

[bulls_with_booz]

>if they think

Isn't the same as, you know, him actually reaching for his gun. Black man moves his pinky finger and the cops will say he's reaching for a gun, kek.

 

[EL PRESIDENTE]

>if they think

Isn't the same as, you know, him actually reaching for his gun. Black man moves his pinky finger and the cops will say he's reaching for a gun, kek.

Based on the video it seems like a reasonable assumption. He was not in compliance and his hand/arm was moving. He was not restrained. You can't second guess decisions made in real time.

Look, if you argue and become combative with cops you're going to be in a situation where they will probably shoot you if you get in a situation where they tackle you and one of the cops yells "he's got a gun" while his arm is still free. They can only assume any movements is to reach for the gun and start shooting. Again, he put himself in this situation. You can't "keep it real" with the cops, especially if you've been brandishing your gun at people on the street.

 

[Minstrel]

You have to stop the threat before it escalates.

It's like you don't even know what terms mean. "You need to stop it before it escalates, by escalating it to shooting him." Stopping it before it escalates means restraining his arm, not killing him.

 

[bulls_with_booz]

Until it's proven he was reaching for a gun or some new info comes out, I just don't see it. It must be because I live in Canada and our police don't kill as quickly.