Are we the WORST team in the Northwest Division?

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Based on defense and points differential, yeah probably.
 
The other depressing thing: all the others look like they have a much brighter future (except MAYBE OKC, but Adams is looking really good, and Oladipo and Sabonis look like they have potential to improve).

I think Utah and Minnesota are clearly destined to be the powerhouses of the Division sooner rather than later and our trajectory is downwards, barring some miracle trade or incredibly lucky draft. How much better can Lillard get?
 
Rastapopoulos said:
The other depressing thing: all the others look like they have a much brighter future (except MAYBE OKC, but Adams is looking really good, and Oladipo and Sabonis look like they have potential to improve).

I think Utah and Minnesota are clearly destined to be the powerhouses of the Division sooner rather than later and our trajectory is downwards, barring some miracle trade or incredibly lucky draft. How much better can Lillard get?
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Yeah, that's scary.

We're definitely a victim of our own success. Seems like the last two times we advanced to the 2nd round on suspect performances it backfired on us the following season.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
I think Utah and Minnesota are clearly destined to be the powerhouses of the Division sooner rather than later and our trajectory is downwards, barring some miracle trade or incredibly lucky draft. How much better can Lillard get?
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Clearly destined? How many times have I heard that. Things changed pretty quickly in the NBA.
 
Easy there Chicken Little. Yeah, we're getting blown out by good teams, but last I checked, we're 3-0 against other NW teams. We're 2-0 against DEN. So, I'm pretty surer were at least better than them.

BNM
 
Rastapopoulos said:
The other depressing thing: all the others look like they have a much brighter future (except MAYBE OKC, but Adams is looking really good, and Oladipo and Sabonis look like they have potential to improve).

I think Utah and Minnesota are clearly destined to be the powerhouses of the Division sooner rather than later and our trajectory is downwards, barring some miracle trade or incredibly lucky draft. How much better can Lillard get?
Click to expand...

Minnesota has had a "bright future" for over a decade. They'll screw it up. Utah has some really good players, but I still don't really see a superstar player on that roster.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
How much better can Lillard get?
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He's already pretty damn good.

How many players in the division do you see ever reaching Dame's level in the next 5 years? You need superstars to win. Most of these teams don't have em.

Russ is above Dame. KAT is slightly below and will probably top out around where Dame is now.

UTA has no one with that ceiling -- hell, our 2nd best player will probably end up being better than any of their players. Wiggins is still a few years away-- his shot is not sustainable. DEN has maybe Jamal Murray, but will he ever become a top 10 player in the NBA?

So chill the fuck out. A bad start to the season doesn't mean we should forget that we have a superstar. He's a great foundation to build on.
 
yuyuza1 said:
So chill the fuck out.
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raw
 
Is it a bad sign that my natural inclination was to start at the bottom of all those lists?
 
yuyuza1 said:
So chill the fuck out. A bad start to the season doesn't mean we should forget that we have a superstar. He's a great foundation to build on.
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I'm sure New Orleans fans tell themselves this all the time.
 
Natebishop3 said:
Minnesota has had a "bright future" for over a decade. They'll screw it up. Utah has some really good players, but I still don't really see a superstar player on that roster.
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gotta wonder if Neil "screwed it up" a it by overpaying and deciding to keep Meyers especially and Crabbe, and then overpaying Turner. Would much rather have had a guy like Cole Aldrich for 7 mil per (or Rolo for 12 mil per) who can play some D and Block shots. Meyers is simply a disaster IMO
 
Rastapopoulos said:
I'm sure New Orleans fans tell themselves this all the time.
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They are 2-9.

We are 7-5.

Slight difference there. But yes, in general, a superstar locked into a 5 year contract is a pretty damn good foundation no matter how you slice it.
 
yuyuza1 said:
Russ is above Dame. KAT is slightly below and will probably top out around where Dame is now.
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I would put it this way: when Dame was KAT's age, he was ignored by the national media because he was playing for an obscure school in Utah. KAT is way beyond what Lillard was at his age and will likely continue to be beyond him.

Also: have you looked at Wiggins's scoring recently? He is also younger than Dame was when he was drafted. Granted, he doesn't do much else, but he scores very well, and that's also Lillard's main strength.

Also: a lot of people are very high on Chris Dunn.

yuyuza1 said:
UTA has no one with that ceiling
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How are you measuring this? Would you have ranked Dikembe Mutombo up with Lillard? I would. Gobert may be that good. Utah is going to be a defensive powerhouse for years to come. And they are DEEP. I would rank Rodney Hood about level with CJ, except that he's probably a better defender. And we haven't even mentioned Whitey McSmallforward, whom most Utah fans would probably nominate as their "star".
yuyuza1 said:
Wiggins is still a few years away-- his shot is not sustainable.
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?

yuyuza1 said:
DEN has maybe Jamal Murray, but will he ever become a top 10 player in the NBA?
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I had honestly forgotten about Murray. I was thinking of Jokic, who is looking like a young Pau Gasol. Mudiay is also a beast who came to the NBA very young but is learning fast. Nurkic is easily better than any of our centers, and YOUNG.
 
yuyuza1 said:
Slight difference there. But yes, in general, a superstar locked into a 5 year contract is a pretty damn good foundation no matter how you slice it.
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Kinda makes you wonder why New Orleans has been so sucky and shows no likelihood of improving.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
Also: a lot of people are very high on Chris Dunn.
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A lot more people are calling him a bust - yet a another PG that can't shoot drafted by MIN. Seems to be their specialty.

If you're looking for a 3rd "star" in MIN, Zach LaVine is younger, and far better, than Dunn, but he's not a PG. Until MIN can find a PG that can shoot, they will continue to lose close games, like they did last year and are doing this year. Their first three losses this year were by 4, 3 and 3 points. If it's not a blow out, MIN finds a way to lose. That's the case whether they are playing Ricky Rubio or Kris Dunn. Dunn is young enough he can still get better, but he's not that young. He was a 4-year college player who didn't shoot that great in college, in spite of playing against weak competition.

Rastapopoulos said:
Would you have ranked Dikembe Mutombo up with Lillard? I would. Gobert may be that good.
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Umm, no. Just no.

His third season in the NBA. Mutombo blocked 336 shots. Through 3 seasons, Gobert's career high is 189 BLKs.

Mutombo blocked a total of 833 shots in his first 3 years. In his first 3 years, Gobert blocked 365 shots.

In his 4th season, Mutombo blocked 321 shots (and 332 in his 5th season). If Gobert can stay healthy (a big if) and play all 82 games, he's on a pace to block 178 shots this year.

Dame absolutely abused Gobert in the first game of the season by taking the ball right at him. I don't ever recall seeing a 6'3" PG consistently abuse Mutombo at the rim the way Lillard abused Gobert in that game.

Comparing Gobert to Mutombo is a massive dose of wishful thinking.

Rastapopoulos said:
Mudiay is also a beast who came to the NBA very young but is learning fast.
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Um, no he's not. It's true he was and is still very young, but he had one of the statistically worst rookie seasons in the history of the NBA (for anyone who played significant minutes). And his advanced stats are even worse this year. He is young enough that he may someday be an average NBA PG, but his "progress" is showing he isn't learning anything fast (except how to miss shots and lose games). If he's part of their future core, I'm not worried. In today's NBA, you can't afford to have a guy who can't shoot handling the ball. That's what's been holding MIN back for years, and unless/until Mudiay proves he's at least an average shooter, he will be holding DEN back.

BNM
 
Rastapopoulos said:
Kinda makes you wonder why New Orleans has been so sucky and shows no likelihood of improving.
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Have you seen the rosters they've "built" around Anthony Davis. There has been zero continuity year to year. They are constantly looking for band-aid, quick fix answers and always seem to end up with a horribly imbalanced roster full of glaring holes. It's like they've been in panic mode about losing Davis ever since they drafted him (probably gun shy after losing Chris Paul, they only other superstar they'eve had since moving to NOLA). Rather than surrounding him with other young talent that can grow together, they installed a revolving door on the locker room for guys like Eric Gordon, Ryan Anderson, Robin Lopez, etc, passing through on their way to someplace else.

By panicking, they are doing exactly what they feared the most - pissing away Anthony Davis' career. They need to do a compete reset, tell Davis to be patient (they have him locked up for 5 years) and go with a youth movement. It's not like he's old and it's not like they are winning with their current approach.

Picking up Archie Goodwin was a good step, but signing and hanging onto career retreads in their late 20s, like Lance Stevenson, E'Twuan Moore, Quincy Pondexter and Dante Cunningham aren't doing them any good. As soon as they can, they should try to move Jrue Holiday and Tyreke Evans for younger players and future draft picks. Those guys don't totally suck, which means they have some value. By the time Davis enters his prime, those guys will be well into their 30s. Move them now, while you can get something of value in return.

BNM
 
Boob-No-More said:
A lot more people are calling him a bust - yet a another PG that can't shoot drafted by MIN. Seems to be their specialty.

If you're looking for a 3rd "star" in MIN, Zach LaVine is younger, and far better, than Dunn, but he's not a PG. Until MIN can find a PG that can shoot, they will continue to lose close games, like they did last year and are doing this year. Their first three losses this year were by 4, 3 and 3 points. If it's not a blow out, MIN finds a way to lose. That's the case whether they are playing Ricky Rubio or Kris Dunn. Dunn is young enough he can still get better, but he's not that young. He was a 4-year college player who didn't shoot that great in college, in spite of playing against weak competition.



Umm, no. Just no.

His third season in the NBA. Mutombo blocked 336 shots. Through 3 seasons, Gobert's career high is 189 BLKs.

Mutombo blocked a total of 833 shots in his first 3 years. In his first 3 years, Gobert blocked 365 shots.

In his 4th season, Mutombo blocked 321 shots (and 332 in his 5th season). If Gobert can stay healthy (a big if) and play all 82 games, he's on a pace to block 178 shots this year.

Dame absolutely abused Gobert in the first game of the season by taking the ball right at him. I don't ever recall seeing a 6'3" PG consistently abuse Mutombo at the rim the way Lillard abused Gobert in that game.

Comparing Gobert to Mutombo is a massive dose of wishful thinking.



Um, no he's not. It's true he was and is still very young, but he had one of the statistically worst rookie seasons in the history of the NBA (for anyone who played significant minutes). And his advanced stats are even worse this year. He is young enough that he may someday be an average NBA PG, but his "progress" is showing he isn't learning anything fast (except how to miss shots and lose games). If he's part of their future core, I'm not worried. In today's NBA, you can't afford to have a guy who can't shoot handling the ball. That's what's been holding MIN back for years, and unless/until Mudiay proves he's at least an average shooter, he will be holding DEN back.

BNM
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Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn Rasta!

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Denver fans are really hard on Mudaiy. They're not thrilled with him. Reminds me of how we were with CJ a few years ago.
 
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