Exclusive Around the NBA: February, 2026! (5 Viewers)

[wizenheimer]

Many players still come from poor or modest families. Not millionaires' sons. LeBron and KD specifically referenced grew up poor.
Inclusion of Deni a red flag for me. I love the guy, he's a rising star but not in category of LeBron, KD, Steph Curry who are superstars known to the most casual fans. Why include him? I can only think of one reason and it isn't pretty.

He didn't just mention Deni, he singled him out by saying "especially Deni. I don't know whether it was pretty or ugly....but there was an obvious agenda

Shabazz is commonly a Muslim/Persian name and he made an awkward tweet about the NBA being several degrees away from being for 'poor' people; AND being Zionist. That really didn't make much sense as there have certainly been more Muslim NBA players than Israeli.

I haven't paid that close of attention to this but the only thing I recall Deni saying was that he was distressed about the war and praying for his country. Maybe I missed something but that doesn't seem to be very political to me. Looks like Shabazz decided to merge a couple of his ideological views into an NBA diss

 

[Sheldon Shape]

He didn't just mention Deni, he singled him out by saying "especially Deni. I don't know whether it was pretty or ugly....but there was an obvious agenda

Shabazz is commonly a Muslim/Persian name and he made an awkward tweet about the NBA being several degrees away from being for 'poor' people; AND being Zionist. That really didn't make much sense as there have certainly been more Muslim NBA players than Israeli.

I haven't paid that close of attention to this but the only thing I recall Deni saying was that he was distressed about the war and praying for his country. Maybe I missed something but that doesn't seem to be very political to me. Looks like Shabazz decided to merge a couple of his ideological views into an NBA diss

Deni also said along the lines of, you're not from there so you're not educated enough to talk about what's going on over there which is pretty lazy and stupid to say. People don't need to be there to recognize apartheid and genocide. If he doesn't want to feel insecure about his place, he should spend less time chastising people who criticizing him and more time creating distance from the worst genocider of our lifetime.

 

[e_blazer]

Deni also said along the lines of, you're not from there so you're not educated enough to talk about what's going on over there which is pretty lazy and stupid to say. People don't need to be there to recognize apartheid and genocide. If he doesn't want to feel insecure about his place, he should spend less time chastising people who criticizing him and more time creating distance from the worst genocider of our lifetime.

I think you just proved Deni’s point.

 

[PCmor7]

I think you just proved Deni’s point.

I don't think he did.

It's kind of like someone having kids and then telling other people that don't have children that they aren't allowed to question their parenting, like being able to procreate requires education and permits. It's a simple way to try to deflect criticism, but it isn't a valid way.

 

[wizenheimer]

Deni also said along the lines of, you're not from there so you're not educated enough to talk about what's going on over there which is pretty lazy and stupid to say. People don't need to be there to recognize apartheid and genocide. If he doesn't want to feel insecure about his place, he should spend less time chastising people who criticizing him and more time creating distance from the worst genocider of our lifetime.

that would be kind of dumb if he said that

but...you have to be really young to consider this particular 'war' the "worst genocide of out lifetime". I was alive in the 50's, so:

* Indonesia 1965-66:

The 1965–66 Indonesian mass killings were a violent anti-communist purge following a failed coup, resulting in an estimated 500,000 to over one million deaths, primarily targeting PKI members and sympathizers. Led by the military under Suharto, the purges spanned from October 1965 to March 1966, dismantling the communist party, ousting President Sukarno, and establishing the 30-year "New Order" authoritarian regime

* Nigerian Civil War 1967-70:

The Nigerian government imposed a blockade, resulting in widespread famine and the deaths of an estimated 500,000 to 2 million civilians.

* Bangladesh War of Independence 1971:

Estimates of the death toll from the 1971 Bangladesh War of Independence vary widely, commonly cited between 300,000 and 3,000,000, with many international scholars and sources highlighting the 3 million figure as the official count from Bangladesh. The genocide involved widespread massacres, with some independent estimates ranging from 200,000 to 1.5 million, while Pakistan's official inquiry cited a much lower number. Estimates are 200,000-400,000 women raped

* Burundi - 1072 & 1993 genocides:

in April of 1972, a rebellion broke out in Burundi led by Hutu army officers against the purge by the mainly Tutsi government of President Michombero. In response to the rebellion, the government using youth militias went on a killing spree that led to the death of some 200,000 Hutus over a period of 90 days.
Easily named the “ Genocide against Hutus” it was a turning point in the ethnic divisions that later plunged even the neighboring countries such as Rwanda into a cycle similar to what happened in Burundi.

The problem arose from a group of Hutu members of the gendarmerie who took control of the town of Rumonge near Lake Nyanza and declared a republic called Martyazo . This group went on to kill all Tutsi and Hutus who refused to join their cause. Between 800 and 1,000 people were killed. It was at this point that President Michombero declared martial law and armed his royal Tutsi army who proceeded to regain control of the country but in the process killing hundreds of Hutus.

Again in June 1993, the leading political party FRODEBU with its Hutu candidate Melchoir Ndadaye won the elections and formed the first Hutu government in Burundi. Tensions ensued with gangs of Tutsi and Hutu attacking each other around Bujumbura culminating in the killing of Ndadaye in October of the same year. Radical Hutus and FRODEBU members killed about 25,000 Tutsi in reprisal. In 2002, an inquiry into this violence by the United Nations affirmed that this particular episode in Burundi’s history was indeed a genocide against the Tutsi.

* Cambodia 1975-1979...the Khmer Rouge extermination campaign:

From April 17, 1975, to January 7, 1979, the Khmer Rouge perpetrated one of the greatest crimes of the 20th century. Nearly two million people died under the rule of the fanatical Communist movement, which imposed a ruthless agenda of forced labor, thought control, and mass execution on Cambodia

* Guatemala 1981-1983; counter-insurgency against the Maya people:

In a scorched earth campaign, the military massacred 100,000-250,000 civilians, destroyed at least 440 villages, perpetrated a campaign of systematic rape, and left extensive environmental damage. Villages seen as sympathetic to the guerillas which were not destroyed outright were moved to “model villages” where life was strictly controlled. In the model villages, social and religious traditions were difficult to maintain. Due to the widespread destruction caused by the counterinsurgency campaign, survivors were dependent on the military for basic necessities. Resistance risked the loss of this support or even murder. To further isolate villages from the guerrillas, local men were coerced into joining “civilian defense patrols” that patrolled the area and sometimes participated in massacres. This complicity in atrocities shattered already vulnerable communities.

* Iraq & Turkey jihads against the Kurds:

Tens of thousands to over 300,000 Kurds have been killed by Iraq and Turkey through campaigns, conflicts, and repressions over the last few decades. The Anfal campaign (1988) in Iraq resulted in 50,000–182,000 deaths, while Turkish military operations and the conflict with the PKK have led to over 30,000+ deaths since 1984

* Rwanda Genocide:, 1994:

estimated 800,000 Tutsi deaths

* The Bosnia Genocide:

estimated that 25,000 to 33,000 Bosnians and Croats were murdered. Over 100,000 deaths on both sides. Thousands of women were raped as a policy


human beings are pretty shitty people

 

[e_blazer]

I don't think he did.

It's kind of like someone having kids and then telling other people that don't have children that they aren't allowed to question their parenting, like being able to procreate requires education and permits. It's a simple way to try to deflect criticism, but it isn't a valid way.

I think the point would be that getting questioned about an extremely complicated and emotionally fraught subject that has a wide range of nuances to it, by folks who want to start with Gaza is perhaps not likely to be a discussion that your average guy who wants to just play basketball is going to want to have with every fan who has that axe to grind. The October 7th attack by Hamas that killed 1,200 innocent Israeli civilians and resulted in more than 100 being taken hostage is certainly a relevant point. Then there’s the whole political issue of Israeli politics. Not everyone supports what Netanyahu has done. Deni loves his country, but likely doesn’t want to try to justify everything his government has done anymore than we might want to try to justify everything going on in our country at the moment.

And, BTW, I think Netanyahu likely should face war crime charges.

That’s more than enough political discussion for the main forum.

 

[PCmor7]

I think the point would be that getting questioned about an extremely complicated and emotionally fraught subject that has a wide range of nuances to it, by folks who want to start with Gaza is perhaps not likely to be a discussion that your average guy who wants to just play basketball is going to want to have with every fan who has that axe to grind. The October 7th attack by Hamas that killed 1,200 innocent Israeli civilians and resulted in more than 100 being taken hostage is certainly a relevant point. Then there’s the whole political issue of Israeli politics. Not everyone supports what Netanyahu has done. Deni loves his country, but likely doesn’t want to try to justify everything his government has done anymore than we might want to try to justify everything going on in our country at the moment.

And, BTW, I think Netanyahu likely should face war crime charges.

That’s more than enough political discussion for the main forum.

We could discuss this, but that wasn't the point of my post or the one to which you were responding that I responded to.

And you kind of touch on it.

Deni has more experience on this subject that most people, but that doesn't make him an expert on it, nor does it make it a strong position for him to just dismiss contrary views solely on his being an Israeli citizen. Like my analogy with a parent, being born there or having parents from there only gives one more experience, but not necessarily the ability to think critically or the ability to think objectively to apply that experience. In fact, one could just as easily say he's too close to this and too passionate about the matter to make a dispassionate, impartial analysis of the subject. In effect, he could miss the forest through the trees. He might even be more susceptible to his country's spin on the matter.

Further, to dismiss someone else's view of the subject out of hand just because he's from there weakens the impression that he can give an objective reason why Israel's actions in Gaza were justified. It comes off as defensive. That's why one is perfectly right to say it's a lazy argument.

Now, Deni could absolutely not take the bait and engage, if he doesn't have the time or desire to discuss it with some depth and nuance. In fact, he even could say that. But outright dismissing it if he's going to discuss it to some degree invited scrutiny and criticism. He needs to either learn how to artfully communicate that or to just bite his tongue and restrain his passions to say something like he is the only word on the subject.

What happened on Oct. 7 is moot to this. The numbers are moot. If you want to discuss that separately, that would be a matter best served on the political forum, as you say. I'd absolutely be willing to share my views on it there. But this is simply a critique of effective discourse.

 

[e_blazer]

We could discuss this, but that wasn't the point of my post or the one to which you were responding that I responded to.

And you kind of touch on it.

Deni has more experience on this subject that most people, but that doesn't make him an expert on it, nor does it make it a strong position for him to just dismiss contrary views solely on his being an Israeli citizen. Like my analogy with a parent, being born there or having parents from there only gives one more experience, but not necessarily the ability to think critically or the ability to think objectively to apply that experience. In fact, one could just as easily say he's too close to this and too passionate about the matter to make a dispassionate, impartial analysis of the subject. In effect, he could miss the forest through the trees. He might even be more susceptible to his country's spin on the matter.

Further, to dismiss someone else's view of the subject out of hand just because he's from there weakens the impression that he can give an objective reason why Israel's actions in Gaza were justified. It comes off as defensive. That's why one is perfectly right to say it's a lazy argument.

Now, Deni could absolutely not take the bait and engage, if he doesn't have the time or desire to discuss it with some depth and nuance. In fact, he even could say that. But outright dismissing it if he's going to discuss it to some degree invited scrutiny and criticism. He needs to either learn how to artfully communicate that or to just bite his tongue and restrain his passions to say something like he is the only word on the subject.

What happened on Oct. 7 is moot to this. The numbers are moot. If you want to discuss that separately, that would be a matter best served on the political forum, as you say. I'd absolutely be willing to share my views on it there. But this is simply a critique of effective discourse.

Do you think that the artful ability to discuss geopolitical events is a requirement for all athletes or just those from Israel? I suppose he could simply say he’s an athlete and he doesn’t discuss politics, but it doesn’t seem as though some fans are willing to accept that.

 

[Sheldon Shape]

that would be kind of dumb if he said that

but...you have to be really young to consider this particular 'war' the "worst genocide of out lifetime". I was alive in the 50's, so:

* Indonesia 1965-66:

The 1965–66 Indonesian mass killings were a violent anti-communist purge following a failed coup, resulting in an estimated 500,000 to over one million deaths, primarily targeting PKI members and sympathizers. Led by the military under Suharto, the purges spanned from October 1965 to March 1966, dismantling the communist party, ousting President Sukarno, and establishing the 30-year "New Order" authoritarian regime

* Nigerian Civil War 1967-70:

The Nigerian government imposed a blockade, resulting in widespread famine and the deaths of an estimated 500,000 to 2 million civilians.

* Bangladesh War of Independence 1971:

Estimates of the death toll from the 1971 Bangladesh War of Independence vary widely, commonly cited between 300,000 and 3,000,000, with many international scholars and sources highlighting the 3 million figure as the official count from Bangladesh. The genocide involved widespread massacres, with some independent estimates ranging from 200,000 to 1.5 million, while Pakistan's official inquiry cited a much lower number. Estimates are 200,000-400,000 women raped

* Burundi - 1072 & 1993 genocides:

in April of 1972, a rebellion broke out in Burundi led by Hutu army officers against the purge by the mainly Tutsi government of President Michombero. In response to the rebellion, the government using youth militias went on a killing spree that led to the death of some 200,000 Hutus over a period of 90 days.
Easily named the “ Genocide against Hutus” it was a turning point in the ethnic divisions that later plunged even the neighboring countries such as Rwanda into a cycle similar to what happened in Burundi.

The problem arose from a group of Hutu members of the gendarmerie who took control of the town of Rumonge near Lake Nyanza and declared a republic called Martyazo . This group went on to kill all Tutsi and Hutus who refused to join their cause. Between 800 and 1,000 people were killed. It was at this point that President Michombero declared martial law and armed his royal Tutsi army who proceeded to regain control of the country but in the process killing hundreds of Hutus.

Again in June 1993, the leading political party FRODEBU with its Hutu candidate Melchoir Ndadaye won the elections and formed the first Hutu government in Burundi. Tensions ensued with gangs of Tutsi and Hutu attacking each other around Bujumbura culminating in the killing of Ndadaye in October of the same year. Radical Hutus and FRODEBU members killed about 25,000 Tutsi in reprisal. In 2002, an inquiry into this violence by the United Nations affirmed that this particular episode in Burundi’s history was indeed a genocide against the Tutsi.

* Cambodia 1975-1979...the Khmer Rouge extermination campaign:

From April 17, 1975, to January 7, 1979, the Khmer Rouge perpetrated one of the greatest crimes of the 20th century. Nearly two million people died under the rule of the fanatical Communist movement, which imposed a ruthless agenda of forced labor, thought control, and mass execution on Cambodia

* Guatemala 1981-1983; counter-insurgency against the Maya people:

In a scorched earth campaign, the military massacred 100,000-250,000 civilians, destroyed at least 440 villages, perpetrated a campaign of systematic rape, and left extensive environmental damage. Villages seen as sympathetic to the guerillas which were not destroyed outright were moved to “model villages” where life was strictly controlled. In the model villages, social and religious traditions were difficult to maintain. Due to the widespread destruction caused by the counterinsurgency campaign, survivors were dependent on the military for basic necessities. Resistance risked the loss of this support or even murder. To further isolate villages from the guerrillas, local men were coerced into joining “civilian defense patrols” that patrolled the area and sometimes participated in massacres. This complicity in atrocities shattered already vulnerable communities.

* Iraq & Turkey jihads against the Kurds:

Tens of thousands to over 300,000 Kurds have been killed by Iraq and Turkey through campaigns, conflicts, and repressions over the last few decades. The Anfal campaign (1988) in Iraq resulted in 50,000–182,000 deaths, while Turkish military operations and the conflict with the PKK have led to over 30,000+ deaths since 1984

* Rwanda Genocide:, 1994:

estimated 800,000 Tutsi deaths

* The Bosnia Genocide:

estimated that 25,000 to 33,000 Bosnians and Croats were murdered. Over 100,000 deaths on both sides. Thousands of women were raped as a policy


human beings are pretty shitty people

I agree. I don't think it's a pissing match, but are there worse atrocities? Sure. But this is the first one that's been televised live for us to see on a daily basis. If it doesn't radicalize you, I don't know what would.

 

[Sheldon Shape]

Do you think that the artful ability to discuss geopolitical events is a requirement for all athletes or just those from Israel? I suppose he could simply say he’s an athlete and he doesn’t discuss politics, but it doesn’t seem as though some fans are willing to accept that.

That would be fine if he didn't already start talking about politics and complaining about the criticism. He's making himself to be the victim when there are REAL victims.

 

[Sheldon Shape]

I think you just proved Deni’s point.

I don't think this means what you think it means.

 

[Cugel]

Take it to the political thread people.

 

[Pinwheel1]

"Death to America, death to Israel."

As an American, that very common slogan in the Middle East worries me, but not as much as it would if we were only a few hundred miles away.
So yeah, I agree with Deni when he says most of us don't know what we are talking about. We do not live 24-7 under the threat of annihilation.
The lack of protesters against Hamas over the last couple of years is telling.

Israel is far from innocent, but as long as terrorist groups such as Hamas have power, there is no chance of peace.
I think we can all agree that innocent people always get slaughtered during a war, and it is always sickening. So why start a war when you know it will happen?

I know some will say because they had no choice, but I think the real answer is Hamas has an agenda that doesn't include the welfare of the Palestinians. Proof of that is how many they have executed in the last 10 years.

I am no expert on the Middle East. But I can assure you that most Americans on the internet are not either.