Article on Stotts and Dame in the Athletic

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"Encourage players to be themselves and play freely on court."

And that's the fucking problem. Right there. Sometimes you shouldn't play freely on the court. CJ is the case in point. It's pretty clear that Stotts has zero control over CJ. He does whatever he wants, whenever he wants, and often times to the detriment to our offense and our team. We're also seeing this with Melo and Dame.

We play like we're in a pickup game.
 
"Encourage players to be themselves and play freely on court."

And that's the fucking problem. Right there. Sometimes you shouldn't play freely on the court. CJ is the case in point. It's pretty clear that Stotts has zero control over CJ. He does whatever he wants, whenever he wants, and often times to the detriment to our offense and our team. We're also seeing this with Melo and Dame.

We play like we're in a pickup game.
I absolutely love the player coach method...it's much more interesting than the micro management style of coaching in my view....it's not a problem unless you don't understand it and need to be micromanaged....Stan Van Gundy is one of the most controlling coaches in the league.....he can't keep a job and has never won a ring. You're never going to enjoy the Blazers if you want that style of basketball. I relate it to music....guys get really bored playing the same 3 chords and song arrangements night after night....players need to stretch out to improve or they just become paycheck players. If we can keep a balanced core under Stotts for 3 seasons together we can win a lot of games, maybe a chip or two
 
I absolutely love the player coach method...it's much more interesting than the micro management style of coaching in my view....it's not a problem unless you don't understand it and need to be micromanaged....Stan Van Gundy is one of the most controlling coaches in the league.....he can't keep a job and has never won a ring. You're never going to enjoy the Blazers if you want that style of basketball. I relate it to music....guys get really bored playing the same 3 chords and song arrangements night after night....players need to stretch out to improve or they just become paycheck players. If we can keep a balanced core under Stotts for 3 seasons together we can win a lot of games, maybe a chip or two

I'm sorry but iso ball doesn't win championships.

In the words of the great Steve Snapper Jones, "Ball movement/player movement" is what wins championships. The Spurs did it. They had it down to a science. Denver just schooled us on ball movement/player movement for two games in a row. We tried to out iso them and it didn't work.

Our team doesn't pass the ball. We have a number of ball stoppers on the team. CJ, Melo, Trent, Kanter. These guys get the ball and they don't pass it. The play dies with them. We ranked dead last in assists last year. LAST. Worst in the league. Nobody had fewer assists per game than us. What does that say about our offense?

Our "style" of offense works on blacktop basketball courts. It doesn't work in the NBA.
 
I'm sorry but iso ball doesn't win championships.

In the words of the great Steve Snapper Jones, "Ball movement/player movement" is what wins championships. The Spurs did it. They had it down to a science. Denver just schooled us on ball movement/player movement for two games in a row. We tried to out iso them and it didn't work.

Our team doesn't pass the ball. We have a number of ball stoppers on the team. CJ, Melo, Trent, Kanter. These guys get the ball and they don't pass it. The play dies with them. We ranked dead last in assists last year. LAST. Worst in the league. Nobody had fewer assists per game than us. What does that say about our offense?

Our "style" of offense works on blacktop basketball courts. It doesn't work in the NBA.
Michael Jordan was all ISO ball...Kobe Bryant was all ISO ball.....plenty of ISO players have multiple rings....I like team ball...we don't have the chemistry Denver has with this roster yet...when we do we'll beat them....it won't be with Blevins and Elleby on the court for half the game either...;.I also don't put much stock in stats from "last year"....we had 19 different starting lineups last year and our best defenders out with injuries...moved rotation players mid season and added Melo with no training camp...last year is an anomaly as far as Stotts teams rank
 
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Michael Jordan was all ISO ball...Kobe Bryant was all ISO ball.....plenty of ISO players have multiple rings....I like team ball...we don't have the chemistry Denver has with this roster yet...when we do we'll beat them....it won't be with Blevins and Elleby on the court for half the game either...;.I also don't put much stock in stats from "last year"....we had 19 different starting lineups last year and our best defenders out with injuries...moved rotation players mid season and added Melo with no training camp...last year is an anomaly as far as Stotts teams rank

This is completely false. The Bulls and Lakers ran the triangle offense, which involved an extremely complex system of passing and moving the ball. To call what they did "iso ball" is a an exaggeration.

To highlight the difference - in 96-97 the bulls were second in the league in assists and 6th in assist%.
 
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This is completely false. The Bulls and Lakers ran the triangle offense, which involved an extremely complex system of passing and moving the ball. To call what they did "iso ball" is a an exaggeration.
I'm not arguing but it's not false that Kobe and Michael were ISO players who dribbled the air out of the ball....and won many rings....triangle smiangle...did you watch Michael and Kobe pass that much really? I didn't...I'd say to judge Stott's coaching on last year and this preseason is a stretch but that's why we're not seeing the same thing here which is fine....and I believe in Stott's coaching
 
I'm not arguing but it's not false that Kobe and Michael were ISO players who dribbled the air out of the ball....and won many rings....triangle smiangle...did you watch Michael and Kobe pass that much really? I didn't

Since I added it as an edit:

To highlight the difference - in 96-97 the bulls were second in the league in assists and 6th in assist%.
 
I absolutely love the player coach method...it's much more interesting than the micro management style of coaching in my view....it's not a problem unless you don't understand it and need to be micromanaged....Stan Van Gundy is one of the most controlling coaches in the league.....he can't keep a job and has never won a ring. You're never going to enjoy the Blazers if you want that style of basketball. I relate it to music....guys get really bored playing the same 3 chords and song arrangements night after night....players need to stretch out to improve or they just become paycheck players. If we can keep a balanced core under Stotts for 3 seasons together we can win a lot of games, maybe a chip or two
This is a false dichotomy. There's a vast casim between "do whatever you want" Stotts and "micromanager" Gundy.
 
Since I added it as an edit:

To highlight the difference - in 96-97 the bulls were second in the league in assists and 6th in assist%.
If you pass Michael the ball he scores....same with Kobe....that's a given....to me they are still ISO players and would be in any system
 
This is a false dichotomy. There's a vast casim between "do whatever you want" Stotts and "micromanager" Gundy.
we disagree...especially about Stotts....and Van Gundy is a photonegative of Stotts which is why I picked him to compare....I don't see the falsehood in that comparison but hey
 
You can strike a balance between being a player's coach and a drill sergeant. Too often Stotts gives selected players to0 much freedom to freelance.

In the last two years of LMA's tenure here, his usage skyrocketed while his TS% tanked. He was basically allowed to take fadeaway jumpers every time he touched the ball and our offense clunked in the playoffs.

He's been lucky that that level of freedom has worked for Dame. But Dame is a transcendent player. A perennial MVP candidate who gets better each year. Dame doesn't need structure because he is a top 10 offense by himself. That level of freedom is not deserved by CJ, LMA, Mo Williams and least of all Melo .
 
Michael Jordan was all ISO ball...Kobe Bryant was all ISO ball.....plenty of ISO players have multiple rings....I like team ball...we don't have the chemistry Denver has with this roster yet...when we do we'll beat them....it won't be with Blevins and Elleby on the court for half the game either...;.I also don't put much stock in stats from "last year"....we had 19 different starting lineups last year and our best defenders out with injuries...moved rotation players mid season and added Melo with no training camp...last year is an anomaly as far as Stotts teams rank
This statement is false too.
https://www.teamrankings.com/nba/stat/assists-per-game?date=2015-06-16

'14-'15: #13 (average) *This was the last year of LMA, Batum, Matthews, etc*
'15-'16: #20 (bottom 1/3)
'16-'17: #26 (near last)
'17-'18: #30 (last)
'18-'19: #26 (near last)
'19-'20: #30 (last)

The last 4+ years, Portland has been at the bottom of the league with assists. I think this does show how important it is to have a legitimate second ball-handler/distributor on the team. Ever since loosing Batum, Portland has struggled to keep the ball moving.
 
"Encourage players to be themselves and play freely on court."

And that's the fucking problem. Right there. Sometimes you shouldn't play freely on the court. CJ is the case in point. It's pretty clear that Stotts has zero control over CJ. He does whatever he wants, whenever he wants, and often times to the detriment to our offense and our team. We're also seeing this with Melo and Dame.

We play like we're in a pickup game.
I disagree with this to a point. I think Stotts' coaching style could not just win a championship but many. The thing is that Olshey is also insanely egotistically devoted to those he drafted. If one of these guys were different then they would work together. My choice wouldn't be Stotts changing or being changed out but Olshey changing or being changed out. If Olshey would look at Terry's strengths and weaknesses he could make much better choices for us. Olshey should know at this point that Stotts isn't going to stop giving the green light to guys with talent to score like CJ and Melo even if that hurts the flow of the offense (the Dallas offense used to stand still when Nurk would get the ball at the elbow but they were very successful). So Olshey should move those players.

Olshey made moves this offseason that show that he's starting to get this. He sees that Stotts will be flexible with his defense but won't berate bad defenders, so Olshey went out and got better, flexible defenders. I think Stotts is a very smart basketball guy that is great at building confidence in his players... that's enough to be a multi-championship coach but not if your GM is right next to you singing Kumbaya. One guy has to make the hard decisions. In todays NBA that should be the GM because guys want to play for Stotts, Stotts understands the game and those are hard things to find in combination.

Olshey needs to make the hard but appropriate player moves that Stotts can help Dame process. If Olshey thinks Stotts needs more than personnel help on defense then he should hire a defensive coordinator that is stronger on accountability but still knows that Stotts is in charge. I get your old school attitude that the coach should be in charge because in high school and college programs coaches are the man but in the NBA that's just not the case. So Stotts' approach is brilliant, he just needs a GM that's shrewd to make everything work.
 
This statement is false too.
https://www.teamrankings.com/nba/stat/assists-per-game?date=2015-06-16

'14-'15: #13 (average) *This was the last year of LMA, Batum, Matthews, etc*
'15-'16: #20 (bottom 1/3)
'16-'17: #26 (near last)
'17-'18: #30 (last)
'18-'19: #26 (near last)
'19-'20: #30 (last)

The last 4+ years, Portland has been at the bottom of the league with assists. I think this does show how important it is to have a legitimate second ball-handler/distributor on the team. Ever since loosing Batum, Portland has struggled to keep the ball moving.
citing assist stats has nothing to do with my view that last year was not an accurate reflection of Stotts success in Portland....I was targeting our defensive woes last season and our revolving rotations....roster changes and injuries. Stotts has had winning records without superstar teams...many, many of you folks don't like him...I like him alot. Opinions aren't false..they are opinions. You can highlight them and run out a stat sheet but it has little to do with what I've posted about Stotts and a players coach vs a micromanaging coach like Van Gundy. I've heard every Stotts criticism there is....I'm still a fan cheering for him...you have alot of people who'll agree with you around here though
 
Stotts is a moron. That's the difference between him and a great Coach like Popovich
Yeah I can tell by reading your posts and listening to Stotts that by comparison Stotts is no moron. Just so you don't take that too personally, Stotts is a really really bright individual. His high minded philosophies about personal empowerment and unity might be beyond some in here but that in no way makes him a moron. I realize because he indulges his players that the ball stalls and we don't get as many easy buckets as some in here think we should but his offenses are still very very highly ranked. On defense Stotts will never be the accountability driven coach but he does have good ideas... he just needs the right players to execute them. So Stotts has some weaknesses the biggest of which is accountability (which in my experience managing several hundred different people is the best weakness to have), empowering and teaching are far more important.

The fact is that Olshey is the much more foolish of the two. He just needs to identify the guys that Stotts' approach doesn't work with and move them on... maybe not grossly overpay them (Crabbe and Meyers being good examples of that but we all know some others) and for the record I have no problem with Dame's salary or status with anyone in the organization.
 
"Encourage players to be themselves and play freely on court."

And that's the fucking problem. Right there. Sometimes you shouldn't play freely on the court. CJ is the case in point. It's pretty clear that Stotts has zero control over CJ. He does whatever he wants, whenever he wants, and often times to the detriment to our offense and our team. We're also seeing this with Melo and Dame.

We play like we're in a pickup game.

Playing freely on the court and doing whatever they want are two different things.

A lot of the top coaches are player friendly, free-flowing coaches.

You're right that if there was no accountability at all, that would be very dangerous. Accountability can look like a coach screaming at their players in front of a national televised audience or having a calm, honest discussion behind closed doors. We know Stotts rarely does the first, but nobody here knows about the second part.
 
citing assist stats has nothing to do with my view that last year was not an accurate reflection of Stotts success in Portland....I was targeting our defensive woes last season and our revolving rotations....roster changes and injuries. Stotts has had winning records without superstar teams...many, many of you folks don't like him...I like him alot. Opinions aren't false..they are opinions. You can highlight them and run out a stat sheet but it has little to do with what I've posted about Stotts and a players coach vs a micromanaging coach like Van Gundy. I've heard every Stotts criticism there is....I'm still a fan cheering for him...you have alot of people who'll agree with you around here though
How about you actually read the posts....

The first one was:
Our team doesn't pass the ball. We have a number of ball stoppers on the team. CJ, Melo, Trent, Kanter. These guys get the ball and they don't pass it. The play dies with them. We ranked dead last in assists last year. LAST. Worst in the league. Nobody had fewer assists per game than us. What does that say about our offense?

Then you responded with:
Michael Jordan was all ISO ball...Kobe Bryant was all ISO ball.....plenty of ISO players have multiple rings....I like team ball...we don't have the chemistry Denver has with this roster yet...when we do we'll beat them....it won't be with Blevins and Elleby on the court for half the game either...;.I also don't put much stock in stats from "last year"....we had 19 different starting lineups last year and our best defenders out with injuries...moved rotation players mid season and added Melo with no training camp...last year is an anomaly as far as Stotts teams rank
I was just trying to show you that last year was not an 'anomaly' for a Stott's team. The lack of ball movement has been an on-going issue for several years.

Also, no one said anything about the stagnate offense being an 'accurate reflection of Stotts success'. Also the 'defensive woes' are also not pertinent to the discussion of a stagnant, Iso-heavy offense.

You can like Stotts... Hell, I even like Stotts. But I also realize that he's not someone who can coach this team to a championship level.
 
Playing freely on the court and doing whatever they want are two different things.

A lot of the top coaches are player friendly, free-flowing coaches.

You're right that if there was no accountability at all, that would be very dangerous. Accountability can look like a coach screaming at their players in front of a national televised audience or having a calm, honest discussion behind closed doors. We know Stotts rarely does the first, but nobody here knows about the second part.
The key here is that Accountability should result in a change of behavior (or change in play).... so regardless of how Stott's holds players accountable - we can look at the product to see if it is working.

IMO, things have gradually gotten worse and worse over the years in regards to the basketball fundamentals (making the right play, defensive rotations, etc)
 
There is one category where the Blazers always rate highly - excuses.

I believe it is small market guilt syndrome. Many Blazer fans act as if we don't have the right to expect excellence from the franchise.
 
Actually, Stotts was an academic All-American and IIRC has an MBA. He has the intellectual capacity to be a very good coach, but not the personality.
to me his personality is part of what I like about him and part of what makes him successful...
 
Do all these Stotts critics really think we have world-beating talent and he's the only thing keeping us from multiple championships?
 

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