Trade Avdija to Blazers

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Good trade?

  • Yes

    Votes: 92 86.0%

  • No

    Votes: 4 3.7%

  • Maybe

    Votes: 14 13.1%
  • Total voters
    107
Deni is obviously a rotation level player. Jerami and Ant are plagues blocking our rotation from developing, I would like to start with sending them off before judging anyone else.
 
Deni did a nice job last year with a role that was tailored to his strengths, sorry to say but the lack of system and seat of pants knee jerk substitution patterns that make no sense to this fan are more to blame in my opinion than him being as bad as he has looked.
Chauncey is cooked and everyone knows it but Cronin and the Vulcans. Look at the effort given last night by the team as a whole.
 
blazedanugz said:
i feel like you’re wrong a lot
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Yeah, but I wake up the board with new ways of looking at things. It's healthy for you. A year later, many will say the same, but have long forgotten who said it first.
 
Deni is better than nay small forward we have on the team currently. Kamara is close however.
 
Put Demi in a GSW uniform and he would be an entirely different player. Not an all star or anything but much better. Who HAS been better under Billups? Toumani and Rupert is probably it and the sample size for them is small. Ant, Grant, etc seem stagnant in terms of growth. Nobody is even sniffing, and I mean the faintest of scents, any NBA kudos at seasons end. Even a POTW would be something.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
He played on the worst roster in the NBA last season with a ball hog PG (Poole) and SF that thinks hes an all-star (Kuzma) so there is no adjustment at all.
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he played on the fastest team in the NBA, and coincidentally his most productive/efficient time was when some of those guys were out. if you stick deni in a plodding, halfcourt system, you're gonna have a bad time. if I know that, surely the front office knows this.
 
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Samuel said:
he played on the fastest team in the NBA, and coincidentally his most productive/efficient time was when some of those guys were out. if you stick deni in a plodding, halfcourt system, you're gonna have a bad time. if I know that, surely the front office knows this.
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Are you trying to say the Blazers are a plodding half court team?

We currently rank 7th in the NBA. Getting up and down the court isn't the Blazers problem. In terms of efficiency we have the 29th best offense and 21st ranked defense, those are the issue.

Washington was #1 in pace last season - but if Deni can only excel with a pace that is higher than 7th, that's a pretty bad indicator of his talent.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
Are you trying to say the Blazers are a plodding half court team?

We currently rank 7th in the NBA. Getting up and down the court isn't the Blazers problem. In terms of efficiency we have the 29th best offense and 21st ranked defense, those are the issue.

Washington was #1 in pace last season - but if Deni can only excel with a pace that is higher than 7th, that's a pretty bad indicator of his talent.
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I'm not sure pace tells the full story about fast-break/transition. Teams can generate higher pace by simply shooting the ball sooner in the shot clock in their half court sets

last season, Washington was 2nd in the NBA in fast break points at 17.6 (3rd in fast break efficiency). This season, Portland is 21st in fast break points at 13.8. So the difference is about one extra transition opportunity a half

Washington is actually ahead of their fast break pace of last season. They are averaging 18.2 fast break points a game so far; 0.6 more points than last season. Their fast break efficiency is worse though. So they probably miss Avdija a bit but not a lot

https://www.teamrankings.com/nba/team-stats/

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by the way, it will surprise nobody that the Blazers rank dead last in 3rd Q scoring margin at -10.2. For perspective, Washington was the worst last season at -4.2. Blazers are 8th in the NBA in 2nd Q scoring margin at +2.5
 
wizenheimer said:
I'm not sure pace tells the full story about fast-break/transition. Teams can generate higher pace by simply shooting the ball sooner in the shot clock in their half court sets

last season, Washington was 2nd in the NBA in fast break points at 17.6 (3rd in fast break efficiency). This season, Portland is 21st in fast break points at 13.8. So the difference is about one extra transition opportunity a half

Washington is actually ahead of their fast break pace of last season. They are averaging 18.2 fast break points a game so far; 0.6 more points than last season. Their fast break efficiency is worse though. So they probably miss Avdija a bit but not a lot

https://www.teamrankings.com/nba/team-stats/

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by the way, it will surprise nobody that the Blazers rank dead last in 3rd Q scoring margin at -10.2. For perspective, Washington was the worst last season at -4.2. Blazers are 8th in the NBA in 2nd Q scoring margin at +2.5
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Fair enough, good point on fast breaks.

Perhaps Deni would do better if the Blazers did fast breaks more. Seems something Blazer fans have wanted for decades and we never see it.

But Deni has a low usage (which should lead to efficient shotting) yet is shooting 17% on 3pt... that is so horrific lack of fast breaks can't be the reason. And if so that just means Deni is an extremely limited situational role player. All playoff teams need half court offense, so if he is incapable of providing that he's really incapable of ever being a starting level player.

Deni shooting was something that statistically looked like a major concern when we acquired him. Yes he shot well last season, but that was only one out of his first four years. Now he is shooting bad again, so thats 80% of seasons he's been a poor 3pt shooter. At some point the 80% is more representative than the 20%. Deni is still on a reasonable contract, so I'm fine with him being on the roster. But its just going to really suck looking at that possible lottery pick we have to fork over to Washington for such an irrelevant player if this 80% trend continues.

Can't think of when we gave up a draft pick that could be as high as #2 overall, or even in the lottery? The Roco and Nance picks had much higher protections, as well as Afflalo. Those 3 were all bad trades, but this is much more risky in that it has a Jermaine Oneal type of downside.
 
I listened to Locked On Blazers this morning and Mike was saying that Deni is shooting around 50% on layups so far this season, down almost 20% from where his career numbers have been.

it’s not just his 3 point percentage that’s concerning, he’s not getting it done from anywhere on the court.
 
SheedSoNasty said:
I listened to Locked On Blazers this morning and Mike was saying that Deni is shooting around 50% on layups so far this season, down almost 20% from where his career numbers have been.

it’s not just his 3 point percentage that’s concerning, he’s not getting it done from anywhere on the court.
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That's what happens when there is no spacing and you have two players who just jack the ball indiscriminately every time it touches their hands.

Unfortunately, we need a better coach for these guys to develop it all.
 
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Phatguysrule said:
That's what happens when there is no spacing and you have two players who just jacked the ball and discriminately every time it touches their hands.

Unfortunately, we need a better coach for these guys to develop it all.
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I wish Deni was a lock to be a good starter and the only problem was our big3 or coaching or anything that might be changed in the next year.

Certainly think those could make a difference.... buts its not going to turn a 17% 3pt shooter into a good starter. Yeah sure there might also be a small sample size at play that should improve his percentages some over the season.

But Deni has been a poor shooter now in 80% of his NBA seasons... unfortunately the small sample size most relevant looks like last season when he shot the 3 well.

At least we only gave up two lottery picks for him.
 
One thingI dont like about Chauncey's coaching is he has his young guys just go to a corner and wait, drives me nuts. Shae Sharpe should never just plant himself in a corner. I know they are trying to space the floor but when you don't have shooters...Id rather see better off ball movement especially for guys like Shae, he should be moving constantly for back doors, off screens/dribble drives. He plays better also when allowed to bring the ball upcourt, he got tore in a position to take over a game, like he did last year. Start Shae and Scoot bring Simons off bench.
 
Phatguysrule said:
That's what happens when there is no spacing and you have two players who just jacked the ball and discriminately every time it touches their hands.

Unfortunately, we need a better coach for these guys to develop it all.
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I would say he was in the same exact situation in DC with POOLE and KUZMA.
 
Hoopguru said:
One thingI dont like about Chauncey's coaching is he has his young guys just go to a corner and wait,
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He should make adjustments obviously, but you honestly think in the huddle he’s drawing it up and telling them to do that? I wish people would blame players for more on here.
 
Phatguysrule said:
That's what happens when there is no spacing and you have two players who just jacked the ball and discriminately every time it touches their hands.
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He's bricking open layups and free throws. Team spacing has nothing to do with either of those, but sure, keep vilifying Ant/Grant for Deni's struggles.

Amazingly, as shaky as Deni has looked from the free throw line, he's shooting better than his career average there. He's simply not a good shooter from anywhere. His speed and maneuverability are great, but his touch is a major liability.

I hated the trade at the time.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
I wish Deni was a lock to be a good starter and the only problem was our big3 or coaching or anything that might be changed in the next year.

Certainly think those could make a difference.... buts its not going to turn a 17% 3pt shooter into a good starter. Yeah sure there might also be a small sample size at play that should improve his percentages some over the season.

But Deni has been a poor shooter now in 80% of his NBA seasons... unfortunately the small sample size most relevant looks like last season when he shot the 3 well.

At least we only gave up two lottery picks for him.
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I don't know what he'll turn into. I know we need to get a new coach and be rid of Simons and Grant before we know what we have at all.
 
THE HCP said:
He should make adjustments obviously, but you honestly think in the huddle he’s drawing it up and telling them to do that? I wish people would blame players for more on here.
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Anybody he has had for a year should be doing what he's coaching them to do or he's a shit coach. If it were just one player doing the wrong thing then that could be on the player. That's not the case in this situation.
 
THE HCP said:
I would say he was in the same exact situation in DC with POOLE and KUZMA.
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I haven't watched enough of their games to know how their spacing or ball movement was. I don't think Deni just turned into a shit player because of the weather. I think it's far more likely that he's not a shit player.
 
THE HCP said:
He should make adjustments obviously, but you honestly think in the huddle he’s drawing it up and telling them to do that? I wish people would blame players for more on here.
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agree, Would think if something not working a player would speak up as suggest something else?
 
It’s too early to give up on Deni but unless he turns it around by the break, he’s going to become Victor Claver or Mario Hezonja to me good defenders who can’t throw a basketball in a swimming pool
 
SharpesTriumph said:
Are you trying to say the Blazers are a plodding half court team?

We currently rank 7th in the NBA.
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11th in the NBA in pace. Deni's minutes are also heavily paired with the starters primarily, our slower players Ant, Jerami, and Ayton, who feature slower-than-nba-average pace. he's even lost some of his 3rd/4th shifts to banton et al. we'll see if that changes if he plays off the bench with scoot.

and as someone above mentioned, pace doesn't even tell the whole story—this is about transition and fast break opportunities. we are not a transition team.

SharpesTriumph said:
Getting up and down the court isn't the Blazers problem.
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Deni is best on the break and helping initiate offense or as the 2nd action guy. Right now he's playing in a lot of halfcourt sets as the hot potato 4th or 5th option. The Wizards are a terrible basketball team but we do not play like they do.
 
I'm guessing a revote would look a bit different.

I'll stick with my "Maybe" answer.
 
So far Avdija’s shot has been pretty underwhelming. I like how he pushes, but he needs to make his shots for the trade to be a good one.
 
So Deni is another player who underperforms next to Grant and Simons.

That aught to help their value...
 
Phatguysrule said:
Failing to see what this has to do with Dame?
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Fact: Dame did not play worse alongside Grant and Simons, and he hasn't played better since leaving them.

Everything else is speculation, so your comment that I quoted lacks any substance.
 
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