Batum for MIP?

[Fez Hammersticks]

Chris Sheridan thinks so:

F – Nicolas Batum – SLUC Nancy – Portland Trailblazers

Batum has emerged as a jack-of-all-trades player over the last few years. During his time with Nancy, Batum proved he is ready for a breakout season this year in the NBA. With Brandon Roy and Fernandez no longer in Portland, Batum may be one of the early contenders for the Most Improved Player award this season.

LINK​

 

[LameR]

He averaged 12/5/3 (all rounded) last year. I think he will be an improved player for sure, and have a bigger role for us, but historically players winning that award have a large statistical increase. I don't see him jumping that much in ppg. Maybe 16 or 17, but no more than that IMO.

 

[barfo]

I think he could win it if the Blazers win, and he's seen as the key to that, despite his stats. Long shot, for sure. The other way is if he becomes a starter, which certainly can still happen.

barfo

 

[Kaydow]

I think he could win it if the Blazers win, and he's seen as the key to that, despite his stats. Long shot, for sure. The other way is if he becomes a starter, which certainly can still happen.

barfo

I'm just worried about the minutes as long as Crash is around. I wouldn't be surprised if they move Crash if they can get something decent back in return. It just feels like they have to loosen the reigns with Nic now. He's still young, but it's time to see what he can do with 35-38 minutes/game. I don't think that's going to happen right away with Crash around. But who knows? A trade or injury could open things up. But as it stands today, I'm afraid Nic's numbers may look similar to the Playoff Series with Dallas last year last year (25 minutes, 8 PPG, 7 FGA). I suppose the silver lining is that we don't have to splurge on a contract extension if he's not posting big numbers.

 

[Sinobas]

I'm afraid Batum may be one of those types that always teases us with flashes of great play, and hopes he'll be great due to his physical gifts, but never quite becomes anything more than a tease.

He's been in the league a few years now, he's not a pup. Time to grow up. Are you going to be a star or a role player?

 

[Nikolokolus]

I don't know if Batum is going to be MIP, but the fact that he's been playing competitive ball since the early fall can't hurt his chances; I thought he looked pretty much in mid-season form in those two pre-season games.

 

[jlprk]

He won't get the minutes. We have a much better player ahead of him.

 

[Mediocre Man]

He is going to need some help from Nate.

 

[LOTBfan]

he will continue to play marginally just as he has the last few years, and will continue to be the most over hyped piece of the blazer organization since the lafrentz contract.

remember when rudy had a huge ceiling, and people were calling trying to trade for him, and we though he was going to be a star and never moved him?

how did that work out for us?

 

[Draco]

he will continue to play marginally just as he has the last few years, and will continue to be the most over hyped piece of the blazer organization since the lafrentz contract.

remember when rudy had a huge ceiling, and people were calling trying to trade for him, and we though he was going to be a star and never moved him?

how did that work out for us?

Yup. Also see Miles, Outlaw, Webster. Batum hasn't accomplished more then they did.

 

[Sinobas]

Last night, he looked like the same old Batum.

 

[Pinwheel1]

Last night, he looked like the same old Batum.

Especially with those two clutch 3's

 

[Sinobas]

Especially with those two clutch 3's

Not sure what your point is. He's always been a fair 3pt shooter. But he's not the 2nd coming of Scottie Pippen. Tayshaun Prince maybe...

I hope the Blazers do not over-pay him based on "potential", in the NBA that is usually a recipe for regret. You have your rookie contract to prove what you are.

I do hope retain him though, I like him. But Blazer fans have a history of putting to much hope in a player "developing" into a star, because stars don't usually flock to Portland.

 

[magnifier661]

Not sure what your point is. He's always been a fair 3pt shooter. But he's not the 2nd coming of Scottie Pippen. Tayshaun Prince maybe...

I hope the Blazers do not over-pay him based on "potential", in the NBA that is usually a recipe for regret. You have your rookie contract to prove what you are.

I do hope retain him though, I like him. But Blazer fans have a history of putting to much hope in a player "developing" into a star, because stars don't usually flock to Portland.

Getting Wes Matthew's numbers should be fine, IMO. He may not be as good as Matthews is right now, but he will eventually.

 

[BBert]

The only way Nico gets MIP is if he becomes our no. 2 scoring option, and performs to that level. Not going to happen. Not that he couldn't, under the right circumstances, but these aren't the right circumstances.

 

[Sinobas]

Getting Wes Matthew's numbers should be fine, IMO. He may not be as good as Matthews is right now, but he will eventually.

I think that would be a good deal for Portland too...6-7 mil a year.

 

[magnifier661]

I think that would be a good deal for Portland too...6-7 mil a year.

Yeah because even if he doesn't pan out, it's a contract you can easily move. Some teams may even look at it like we fans do; thinking Wallace maybe interfering with his growth and take a chance on him. What I'm really hoping for is Batum and Wallace to be around 13-15 mil collectively (Batum 6-7, Wallace 7-8). I think that's a perfect salary for both players. And when Wallace finally starts to slow down, they can switch spots and roles.

 

[SantaDora]

Nico looks to me like Aldridge did before Roy went down. Competent, but not assertive enough. He has all the talent in the world. He is so fluid out there and so graceful and it looks like he does not even try. He just needs to be put in a position where it is his team/job to score.

 

[jlprk]

A good coach can bring out players' talents even when they get limited minutes. A bad director needs an actor to break a leg and lose stage time before allowing the understudy to display his ability.

Rewrite your plays, Nate.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Nico looks to me like Aldridge did before Roy went down. Competent, but not assertive enough. He has all the talent in the world. He is so fluid out there and so graceful and it looks like he does not even try. He just needs to be put in a position where it is his team/job to score.

I agree. Anyone who watched him play in the Euroleague saw him step up against good teams - most notably Caja Laboral. And this because it was HIS team.

Suggested trade: Wallace for Varejao.

[Edit: scratch that. I don't think Wallace is the problem. I think they're such different players they can play together (and I swear I witnessed good interaction between them in the preseason). My nominee for the problem is Crawford, just because the ball has to be in his hands for him to be effective. Batum can be effective without the ball, whereas Crawford is pretty much useless (he's NOT a spot-up shooter). So Batum gets the ball taken away from him because of Crawford's narrowness and his versatility.]

 

[magnifier661]

I agree. Anyone who watched him play in the Euroleague saw him step up against good teams - most notably Caja Laboral. And this because it was HIS team.

Suggested trade: Wallace for Varejao.

LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[MickZagger]

Haha Varejao has been effective one year in his career when Lebron drew all the attention. Other than that he's pretty scrubby.

 

[Draco]

I think Wallace will be right there with LaMarcus as our best player the next month of the season. Batum hasn’t proven crap, he’s always been a below average starter for our team, similar to Joel Pryzbilla. Those are players who have value, they perform better then a scrub replacement player, and those guys are a nice luxury to have off the bench. But you don’t want a player at Batum’s historical production to be a key starter.

I’ll believe Batum has improved when I see it on an NBA court. It’s not Nate’s job to maximize Batum’s stats or Batum’s contributions. Nate’s job is to maximize the teams total production. If Batum can play a larger role in a manor that help the team then great, I’ll be excited for him. If he can’t then he isn’t a great player. There are tons of players in the league that can be an acceptable part of the rotation on certain teams in certain situations; they are called role players. Batum has not produced at a level above a role player. It’s ludicrous to jettison our only all-star, who is our best or second best player just to make room for a guy who has never proven he can contribute as much more then a decent bench player or below average starter.

 

[Nikolokolus]

LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I really don't get the joke apparently?

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/player/hollinger/_/id/2419/anderson-varejao

Cleveland was destined to be terrible no matter what, but the wheels really came off once Varejao was lost for the season; Cleveland lost the first 21 games he didn't play, as the Cavs simply had no other player who could defend in the frontcourt effectively, while Varejao does so as well as any player in the league.

For the season Cleveland gave up 3.17 points per 100 possessions less with him on the court, according to basketballvalue.com. Synergy rated him as the league's third most effective center, albeit in a limited number of minutes. Even with a bunch of Cavaliers "helping" him, Varejao held opposing centers to a 13.3 PER according to 82games.com.

The reason why is obvious when you watch him play: Few big men are as nimble laterally as Varejao, and even fewer are as passionate about defense. He's the best big man in the league defending the pick-and-roll and, despite lacking overwhelming strength, is a darned good post defender too. He doesn't block a ton of shots but he takes charges willingly, and he does it all while rarely fouling. His only vulnerability is against physical beast centers like Dwight Howard or Andrew Bynum, who simply overpower him.

Offensively, Varejao's 31-game cameo offered some hope that his midrange jumper might be coming around; he made 22-of-46 from beyond 10 feet. Otherwise it was a fairly typical campaign for him, with high-efficiency shot-making but not high frequency.

LMAO indeed.

 

[magnifier661]

I really don't get the joke apparently?

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/player/hollinger/_/id/2419/anderson-varejao

LMAO indeed.

Well the joke is to think that Side Show Bob is even close to the same value as Wallace. And anyone that thinks they are equal talent is kidding themselves.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Well the joke is to think that Side Show Bob is even close to the same value as Wallace. And anyone that thinks they are equal talent is kidding themselves.

An elite wing defender vs. an elite big man defender both with roughly 15 career PER? You're right, wing defenders are mostly dime a dozen compared to elite defensive big men.

Just in case you don't believe me:
http://www.basketball-reference.com...m=1&p1=varejan01&y1=2012&p2=wallage01&y2=2012

 

[magnifier661]

An elite wing defender vs. an elite big man defender both with roughly 15 career PER? You're right, wing defenders are mostly dime a dozen compared to elite defensive big men.

Just in case you don't believe me:
http://www.basketball-reference.com...m=1&p1=varejan01&y1=2012&p2=wallage01&y2=2012

you can toss all those "per" at me and I will still say NO CHANCE IN HELL!!!!! You offer this to any GM in the league and they would laugh their ass off.

And I was looking at the reference and it's not even close. Wallace has a better per than Side Show Bob

 

[Nikolokolus]

you can toss all those "per" at me and I will still say NO CHANCE IN HELL!!!!! You offer this to any GM in the league and they would laugh their ass off.

And I was looking at the reference and it's not even close. Wallace has a better per than Side Show Bob

Take your damn Blazer goggles off for a second.

 

[magnifier661]

Take your damn Blazer goggles off for a second.

Dude looking at the advanced "PER" it's Wallace at 17.6 to Side Show's 14.8. But if you look at the "TRUE VALUE"; which is actual production; it's not even close. Hell even the rebounding is close, and Bob is a damn big man. This has nothing to do with Beer Goggles. If Wallace was still in Charlotte; I would still LMAO with that idea.

 

[Nikolokolus]

Dude looking at the advanced "PER" it's Wallace at 17.6 to Side Show's 14.8. But if you look at the "TRUE VALUE"; which is actual production; it's not even close. Hell even the rebounding is close, and Bob is a damn big man. This has nothing to do with Beer Goggles. If Wallace was still in Charlotte; I would still LMAO with that idea.

Is "True Value" some new stat I haven't heard of before?

Regardless I'm talking about about roles and wins added. Of course Varejao isn't a volume scorer and the focal point of his team's offense, but given what he does and and just how well he does it (plus factoring age and likely rates of decline in the next 3 or 4 years) I think Varejao would probably fill a greater hole in Portland than the one Wallace would create with his departure ... and the sheer gap in "production" isn't nearly as wide as you portray it -- especially since PER mostly measures offensive output and is highly influenced by usage rate. I'm not even saying Varejao is a better player than GW, I'm only saying that their value on the basketball court is roughly equal, all things considered.