BEATING THE DEAD DREW HORSE

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Messiah717 said:
Given what's expected and needed of him Beltran has failed miserably. A concern on top of that is Young is free falling. That being said Drew continuously being in the lineup is completely ridiculous.
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...what is expected from certain players is not the issue. They have to put the best players on the field based on who's pitching and who's hot, etc...and the fact of the matter is that based on recent streaks, Beltran has been better than Jones at the plate...and for a longer time.
...as far as Young slumping, I don't see the logic behind assuming he won't return to hitting well again while also assuming that Jones won't return to sucking again.
 
yankeesince59 said:
...what is expected from certain players is not the issue. They have to put the best players on the field based on who's pitching and who's hot, etc...and the fact of the matter is that based on recent streaks, Beltran has been better than Jones at the plate...and for a longer time.
...as far as Young slumping, I don't see the logic behind assuming he won't return to hitting well again while also assuming that Jones won't return to sucking again.
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The fact that Drew is still in this lineup on nightly basis they're certainly not doing that. They're pretty much giving themselves 23 outs to play with every game with this useless ass.
 
...I forget the numbers I posted earlier about the BAs of the Yanx' 7-8-9 hitters this year but it was pretty ugly...when you're getting essentially no production from those spots it makes it very difficult to mount any sort of extended rally.

...this also helps to explain why Ellsbury still leads the team with 48 hits but only has 6 RBIs...and 1 of those RBIs was a solo HR.
 
...found it...this year the Yanx 7-8-9 hitters are batting .198 , .193 , .210
 
yankeesince59 said:
...uhhh, as opposed to the savior known as Garrett fucking Jones?...you know, the one whose praises you were singing before the season began.

...what part of "back up 1Bman" don't you understand?

...Bird will better "develop" facing major league pitching vs facing minor league pitching, no?



...your Baseball education is never-ending.
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1). Lol....Show us/ prove to us where I described Jones as a "savior"-like player.
Why would I call a guy (Jones), a "savior" who batted .246 last year with 15 HRs and an OPS of .720 ....who will be used sparingly as a DH, 1b, RF as a "savior"? Huh?

2). Do you actually believe Bird will be better off as a "backup 1b" this year with the Yanks to further his "development" instead of playing full-time in the minors?
You like POLLS, want to "POLL" the board on this Bird issue?

3) Garrett Jones was an acceptable added piece to complete the trade Cashman agreed to make with the Marlins in the Eovaldi deal...along with a young pitcher (Domingo German) who unfortunately and freakishly got injured after the deal.
His age and minor league stats at the time of the trade:
http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=german001dom

You may disagree with the trade ... that's fine with me.
You can call it a BAD trade ... that's fine with me.

Now stop being confrontational with me.
 
And when I said - in post #37 - Jones was an "acceptable" added piece to complete the "Eovaldi trade"..... I'm referring to CASHMAN's line of thinking and just as also I said in post #37........you may disagree with THAT trade and that's fine with me.
You can call it a BAD TRADE, and that's fine with me.

All clear?

Now bug off.
 
I really hope that this is not going to turn into another "My dick is bigger than your dick" debate.

GO YANKEES!
 
Rick2583 said:
I really hope that this is not going to turn into another "My dick is bigger than your dick" debate.

GO YANKEES!
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Nope, I'm done.
But I would gladly welcome YOUR opinion - if you care to offer- regarding whether or not Bird would be better served in his development as this year's backup 1b, or playing everyday in the minors.
 
Honestly right now I think Bird is better off staying in the minors honing his craft rather than only getting a dozen or so ABs every month up in the majors as a backup to Teixeira. That could end up being a moot point as I still believe someone will end up having an injury & we'll see guys like Bird, Judge or Reysnyder. We'll see.
 
Rick2583 said:
Honestly right now I think Bird is better off staying in the minors honing his craft rather than only getting a dozen or so ABs every month up in the majors as a backup to Teixeira. That could end up being a moot point as I still believe someone will end up having an injury & we'll see guys like Bird, Judge or Reysnyder. We'll see.
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I agree and Injuries will pop up.

I'm ready to pull the plug on Drew and it's kinda surprising how a player (Drew), turned 32 yrs in March having a nice career as a starting SS and a solid season just two years ago can fall off the face of the earth with his batting skills.

I have to believe one or two of the following -
The Yanks WILL remove him as the starting 2b in a couple weeks.
Refsnyder is a "butcher" defensively at 2b....including turning the DP?

We'll see....hopefully the kid has been adequate defensively down there and he'll get the call.

If he has been defensively average/adequate and the Yanks don't soon call him up.....then put me near the front of the Cashman bashing parade....for now. Lol
 
blgridesagain said:
1). Lol....Show us/ prove to us where I described Jones as a "savior"-like player.
Why would I call a guy (Jones), a "savior" who batted .246 last year with 15 HRs and an OPS of .720 ....who will be used sparingly as a DH, 1b, RF as a "savior"? Huh?

...it was a figure of speech, dumbass. Are you really denying that you were not pimping Jones before the season began?...don't make me embarrass you with actual links and quotes. This is what you do...you make non committal statements and then play both sides of the fence....you're a complete joke.

2). Do you actually believe Bird will be better off as a "backup 1b" this year with the Yanks to further his "development" instead of playing full-time in the minors?
You like POLLS, want to "POLL" the board on this Bird issue?

...yes, I do...and I've already stated as such. Start a fucking poll if you want but don't be surprised if I take a page out of your manual and proclaim said poll as "silly" simply because I don't agree with it. .....derp.

3) Garrett Jones was an acceptable added piece to complete the trade Cashman agreed to make with the Marlins in the Eovaldi deal...along with a young pitcher (Domingo German) who unfortunately and freakishly got injured after the deal.
His age and minor league stats at the time of the trade:
http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=german001dom

...German has nothing to do with the crux of this topic which whether or not Jones is a better option at 1B vs Bird...plain and simple...but feel free to typically and predictably take it in yet another direction.

You may disagree with the trade ... that's fine with me.
You can call it a BAD trade ... that's fine with me.

...said it about 10 times, yes, I do disagree with the trade... If you can show me how the Yanx are better with Eovaldi, German, and Jones vs Phelps and Prado let's hear it...otherwise, stfu.

Now stop being confrontational with me.

..."confrontational"?...really?...lmao.


And when I said - in post #37 - Jones was an "acceptable" added piece to complete the "Eovaldi trade"..... I'm referring to CASHMAN's line of thinking and just as also I said in post #37........you may disagree with THAT trade and that's fine with me.
You can call it a BAD TRADE, and that's fine with me.

...yeah, it was a bad trade.

All clear?

...crystal.

Now bug off.

..."bug off"?...are you Kookie Ed Byrnes?
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Rick2583 said:
Honestly right now I think Bird is better off staying in the minors honing his craft rather than only getting a dozen or so ABs every month up in the majors as a backup to Teixeira. That could end up being a moot point as I still believe someone will end up having an injury & we'll see guys like Bird, Judge or Reysnyder. We'll see.
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...how many young players come straight from the minors to a starting role?...very very few. No, most ride the pine and get playing time when they can. Bird has already proven he can hit minor league pitching and staying in the minors won't speed up his eventual promotion.
...he can also learn quite a bit being around the veteran players and the art of 1B defense from Tex.
 
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blgridesagain said:
I agree and Injuries will pop up.

I'm ready to pull the plug on Drew and it's kinda surprising how a player (Drew), turned 32 yrs in March having a nice career as a starting SS and a solid season just two years ago can fall off the face of the earth with his batting skills.

I have to believe one or two of the following -
The Yanks WILL remove him as the starting 2b in a couple weeks.
Refsnyder is a "butcher" defensively at 2b....including turning the DP?

We'll see....hopefully the kid has been adequate defensively down there and he'll get the call.

If he has been defensively average/adequate and the Yanks don't soon call him up.....then put me near the front of the Cashman bashing parade....for now. Lol
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...lmao...small steps.
 
yankeesince59 said:
...lmao...small steps.
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No, not "small steps".... I admit, and stand by what I said about Drew (and the Yanks also agreed at that time because they signed him) before the season began....

Maybe with a full ST and starting fresh he can bounce back and have decent numbers.

I was willing, and DID give him a couple of months to see if he " bounces back".
He hasn't, and now the time (my time) has come to get him out of the starting lineup.

I agree,, the Yanks CANNOT afford to carry two weak hitters at the end of the lineup throughout the season.


I'm just hoping that it's not a case of Refsnyder's defense as a 2b being more harmful than Drew's .156 BA. It can't be...can it? Lmao

As for Jones, yes, I could understand how he could be an asset as a LH with some power at the Stadium in his spare role as a backup/part time 1B, DH, RF.

This was already discussed - and I know you did NOT like the trade and I respect your opinion....and I was/ am (remember?), giving it a chance to play out and the young pitcher German - imo- WAS an important ingredient in the trade at the time.

The kid has since come up with arm surgery....I know, tough break.

That's all.

I think we settled this in a nice fashion.....YOU COULD BE CORRECT in calling it a bad trade....I hear ya. And Prado is a GOOD player.
 
...alright, where's the real blg...and what did you do with his body.
 
yankeesince59 said:
...alright, where's the real blg...and what did you do with his body.
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Just to clear things up -
I haven't changed my position on Drew and the Eovaldi/Prado trade.
I thought it wasn't unreasonable to think Drew could rebound with decent numbers after a timely full ST and a fresh start and was willing to give him a couple of months.....
.....just one final thing I wanted to and failed to point out regarding that Eovaldi/Prado trade.....when I say/said the young pitcher German was an important part of the deal....I'm kinda thinking along with Cashman's thought process for finalizing the deal....that kid pitcher German (22yrs old) had excellent SP numbers in the minors and I have a feeling he would NOT have made the trade without German included.
Just my opinion.

Okay, I'm done......wanna close it out?
 
...well of course he would not have done the trade without German, just like he would not have done the trade without Eovaldi or Jones.

...but it has more to do with what the Yanx gave up in that trade (Prado and Phelps), and less about what they got in return.

...and Cashman must be held accountable for this roster...and by Yankee standards, it's simply not a very good one.
 
yankeesince59 said:
...how many young players come straight from the minors to a starting role?...very very few. No, most ride the pine and get playing time when they can. Bird has already proven he can hit minor league pitching and staying in the minors won't speed up his eventual promotion.
...he can also learn quite a bit being around the veteran players and the art of 1B defense from Tex.
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Ron I'd agree with you if the kid could get more ABs by playing in other positions while waiting to take over for Teixeira but his only position has been 1st base. And besides he's not exactly smoking the ball while in Trenton hitting only in the 220's JMO.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=bird--000gre
 
...rick, I'm not talking about now and not basing it on his current numbers in the minors. Of course we'll never know what his ML numbers might be but the kid has got a great stroke and seemed to fit right in and had an exceptional ST...like I said from the beginning of this thread, as far as backup 1Bmen, Bird should have have been on the roster from the beginning of the year because Jones should have never been acquired.

...lemme put it another way, don't you think the Yanx would be in better shape with Prado, Phelps, Greene, and Bird instead of German, DiDi, Eovaldi, and Jones?
 
yankeesince59 said:
...rick, I'm not talking about now and not basing it on his current numbers in the minors. Of course we'll never know what his ML numbers might be but the kid has got a great stroke and seemed to fit right in and had an exceptional ST...like I said from the beginning of this thread, as far as backup 1Bmen, Bird should have have been on the roster from the beginning of the year because Jones should have never been acquired.

...lemme put it another way, don't you think the Yanx would be in better shape with Prado, Phelps, Greene, and Bird instead of German, DiDi, Eovaldi, and Jones?
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Even as badly as Greene is doing I agree the Yankees never should have made that trade.
 
...I don't understand how the kid can be so damned good for 2-3 games and then completely suck for 2-3 games.
 
yankeesince59 said:
...rick, I'm not talking about now and not basing it on his current numbers in the minors. Of course we'll never know what his ML numbers might be but the kid has got a great stroke and seemed to fit right in and had an exceptional ST...like I said from the beginning of this thread, as far as backup 1Bmen, Bird should have have been on the roster from the beginning of the year because Jones should have never been acquired.

...lemme put it another way, don't you think the Yanx would be in better shape with Prado, Phelps, Greene, and Bird instead of German, DiDi, Eovaldi, and Jones?
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If I had a Genie Lamp, I'd reverse that trade in a NY second, not minute........!!!
 
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[QUOTE="Mattingly23NY, post: 3636856, member: 28162"]If I had a Genie Lamp, I'd reverse that trade in a NY second, not minute........!!![/QUOTE]


If you had a genie you'd wish you could go back 50 years to be 25 again & playing CF for the NY Yankees.
 
Rick2583 said:
If you had a genie you'd wish you could go back 50 years to be 25 again & playing CF for the NY Yankees.
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...as a Mantle/Yankees fan, when I was a kid, that was my biggest dream...and I would have played for free.
 
^^^once it was obvious that dream had passed me by I had then hoped maybe my Son would fill that role...but when it became apparent he was gonna be too big to play CF, I thought maybe he'd become a middle linebacker for the Raiders.


... he's a Chef.

...lol...C'est la vie
 
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