Blazers podcast/Greg monroe

[blue9]

And Monroe told DET he didn't want to play for them, which is why he took the one year QO so he could leave this summer. DET wanting or not wanting him doesn't come into play because Monroe doesn't want DET.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Like, say, LMA during the 10/11 - 12/13 seasons? Or Zbo before him?

Aldridge and Randolph have also put up big numbers on good teams - multiple times. Monroe hasn't. My point was, Monroe has never played on a team that's won more than 32 games, so whether, or not, he can put up similar numbers on a good team is an unknown. Perhaps I should have said I'm always leery of players who have put up good numbers EXCLUSIVELY on bad teams.

Aldridge and Randolph both played for teams that won 50+ games early in their careers and many more times since. The big numbers only on bad teams theorem does not apply to them.

But Monroe on the Blazers would be better than Monroe on the Pistons simply by virtue of being on a better team with better teammates.

You don't know that. Was Kevin Love better in CLE than he was in MIN? Was Chris Bosch better in MIA than in TOR? In both places, their teams won more games (thanks to those better teammates), but their individual numbers went WAY down.

Besides, if you remove Aldridge, would Monroe's teammates in POR be that much better than his teammates in DET? Yeah, but not by all that much. Monroe wouldn't be joining LeBron/Wade or LeBron/Irving, he'd be joining Lillard/Batum or Lillard/post ruptured achilles Matthews.

We don't WANT LMA's replacement to replace his scoring - that's not what you want out of a PF.

Really??? So, you lose your leading scorer, the 7th highest scorer in the entire league, and aren't concerned about replacing his scoring? If not his replacement, who is going to replace Aldridge's 23 ppg? Batum? Post injury Matthews? Lopez?

But if his replacement can give us 60-70% of his scoring, while providing good rebounding, setting good screens, and keeping the ball moving on offense, (and hopefully playing good defense), then the rest of the team should be able to make up the remaining 30-40% of LMA's points.

Aldridge averages more rebounds and is a MUCH better defender than Monroe. So you lose 30 - 40% of Aldridge's scoring and expect Lillard, Batum, post injury Matthews and Rolo to make that up, the rebounding is, at best, a wash and the defense gets much worse. This is your plan to "improve" the team? It would certainly improve our odds of getting a lottery pick in 2016 (and beyond).

Again, I wouldn't mind Monroe backing up the 4 and 5 spots, but if he's starting in place of Aldridge, 2016 lottery, here we come!!!

BNM

 

[blue9]

Bosh was clearly a better player in MIA than TOR. Scoring less doesn't make you a worse player if you're playing your role better - he was a better PF in MIA than he was in TOR.
Perhaps the same isn't true for Love.
No one player is going to replace all of LMA's scoring - as I said, if his replacement gives us 60-70% of it the rest of the team can make up the remaining 30-40%. It's not like he scored efficiently - distribute those shots in a more robust offense and we won't miss his scoring at all. Being the 7th highest scoring player in the league doesn't mean much when he took the 3rd most shots in the league.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Bosh was clearly a better player in MIA than TOR. Scoring less doesn't make you a worse player if you're playing your role better - he was a better PF in MIA than he was in TOR.
Perhaps the same isn't true for Love.
No one player is going to replace all of LMA's scoring - as I said, if his replacement gives us 60-70% of it the rest of the team can make up the remaining 30-40%. It's not like he scored efficiently - distribute those shots in a more robust offense and we won't miss his scoring at all. Being the 7th highest scoring player in the league doesn't mean much when he took the 3rd most shots in the league.

You seem to conveniently overlook the impact Aldridge's game has on his teammates' scoring. Aldridge consistently draws double teams, which creates open looks for his teammates. Aldridge also draws his defender out of the paint, creating lanes for his teammates (Lillard and McCollum especially) to drive and score. Monroe may be a more efficient scorer than Aldridge, because he takes most of his shots in the paint, but with Monroe and Lopez both packing the paint on offense, how will it impact Lillard's and McCollum's ability to drive the lane and score? Monroe also won't draw the double teams Aldridge does.

Scoff all you want at the 7th leading scorer in the league, but other teams have to respect Aldridge's 23.4 ppg and that creates more easy opportunities for his teammates that will vanish if you replace him with Greg Monroe and his 15.9 ppg.

And then there is defense... I highly recommend you go to 82games.com and compare Opp Production, Opp Scoring, etc. between Monroe and Aldridge over the last several seasons. One thing you'll notice is that Monroe not only scores a lot less than Aldridge, Monroe's opponent's also score a lot more. So, he scores significantly fewer points, and gives up significantly more points and somehow this would magically make the team better???? Gee, maybe there is a reason Monroe has never played on a team that's won more than 32 games. Monroe has been a starter on four 50-loss teams. Aldridge has been a starter on four 50-win teams. No thanks. I'd prefer to stay with the guy who actually helps his team win games.

BNM

 

[blue9]

Well I'd like Monroe to either play with Leonard who will stretch the defense, or someone like Hibbert who can cover for defensive deficiencies. But I've always maintained that defense is a team game, and DET hasn't had that since Larry Brown left town. With a good coach and the right teammates perhaps Monroe isn't so bad at defense? Nobody thought Meyers would ever be good, and thanks to Kaman he was able to hold his own against Gasol. Also, LMA's defensive ranking is high due to the fact that he never leaves his man to offer help defense - so while it might help his ranking it doesn't help the team when he's giving his teammate's assignments open lay-ups.
With regards to Lillard/McCollum and spacing - I would contend that a good screen would do them better than the threat of a mediocre jump shot. A pick/roll game with Monroe setting the screen and ROLLING to the hoop, with Leonard at the 3-point line, is a heck of a lot better than a pick/pop with LMA shooting a low-percentage jumper that leaves the PG stifled in a double-team. That would be 3 options on one play (Monroe, PG, Leonard) vs 1 (LMA jumper).

 

[BBert]

Good point! Would the Blazers go that far?

No

 

[Boob-No-More]

Well I'd like Monroe to either play with Leonard who will stretch the defense, or someone like Hibbert who can cover for defensive deficiencies. But I've always maintained that defense is a team game, and DET hasn't had that since Larry Brown left town. With a good coach and the right teammates perhaps Monroe isn't so bad at defense? Nobody thought Meyers would ever be good, and thanks to Kaman he was able to hold his own against Gasol. Also, LMA's defensive ranking is high due to the fact that he never leaves his man to offer help defense - so while it might help his ranking it doesn't help the team when he's giving his teammate's assignments open lay-ups.
With regards to Lillard/McCollum and spacing - I would contend that a good screen would do them better than the threat of a mediocre jump shot. A pick/roll game with Monroe setting the screen and ROLLING to the hoop, with Leonard at the 3-point line, is a heck of a lot better than a pick/pop with LMA shooting a low-percentage jumper that leaves the PG stifled in a double-team. That would be 3 options on one play (Monroe, PG, Leonard) vs 1 (LMA jumper).

Based on track record and past/recent success, you honestly think this team would get better by replacing LaMarcus Aldridge with Greg Monroe? Honestly? Really?

I see a lot of conditional statements in your post (we don't have Roy Hibbert, and what makes you think Greg Monroe would play better defense in POR than he did in DET?, etc.), but based on actual, real world results, LaMarcus is easily twice the player Greg Monroe is. Aldridge scores more and gives up fewer points. Aldridge's team wins 50+ games, Monroe's team loses 50+ games.

Neither you, nor Greg Monroe, has given sufficient evidence to convince me bringing in Greg Monroe to replace LaMarcus Aldridge would somehow make POR a better team. I don't see any individual stats, I don't see any team stats (especially wins and losses) to support any of your claims. It's just all postulating and wishing and that don't win ball games. Get back to me when Greg Monroe is the leading scorer and rebounder on a team that wins 50+ games, because that's what your proposing we should give up to get him.

BNM

 

[riverman]

I thought most fans here wanted to get better defensively and Monroe is pretty far away from that..no way I trade for him

 

[Boob-No-More]

I thought most fans here wanted to get better defensively and Monroe is pretty far away from that..no way I trade for him

Yep.

Monroe off the bench = yes.

Monroe starting in place of Aldridge = fuck no.

BNM

 

[BBert]

Knicks are throwing the MAX at Monroe this summer.

That would fit their pattern and practice of ridiculously overpaying.

 

[Draco]

I've been a big fan of Monroe the few times I've watched him and don't blame him for all of his shitty team struggles. He looked good when they cut josh smith and had a healthy PG for a month. He is damn good inside. He's never had the quality of teammates he'd have here even without LaMarcus.

The problem will be the cost to get him; either lose Nic in a sign and trade, lose Wes and Rolo in free agency, or as a fallback option if LaMarcus leaves. Those first two scenarios would be big gambles on Neil Olsheys part. But if he feels that's the player to get I'd trust Neil and be eager to see how he rounds out the roster. One thing I will say is this is the worst Robin has looked as a starting center for the Blazers. That's now 2 years of poor playoff performance so maybe we should be thinking how Monroe fits next to LaMarcus in the starting lineup instead of in place of him.

 

[MickZagger]

Wiggins is the SG Kevin Love. Love might be in Cleveland now, but Wiggins will fill his spot of great stats on a meaningless team with ease.

LOL

Wiggins was a 19 year old rookie. Are you sure you want to close the chapter on what he is capable of?

 

[Draco]

Wiggins already is a good defender and might be 1st team all defense soon. He's nothing like Kevin Love.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

Moose would be a solid option.

I pimped that Monroe/Batum swap last summer.

With Meyers flipping a switch and showing a skillset that is rare for a player his size, do you still go after Monroe?

What impressed me the most from Meyers in the playoffs was his defense. He defended Gasol better than any other big on the roster.

 

[jlprk]

We don't WANT LMA's replacement to replace his scoring - that's not what you want out of a PF.

Exactly. Aldridge hogging the shots pulls Lillard off his shooting rhythm. Lillard will shoot better when he doesn't have to keep Aldridge in his peripheral vision whenever Lillard wants to shoot.

Monroe is the rare type of acquisition which excites me. If we can get talent like him without giving up much, grab it. Worry about whether he starts, or about teaching him defense, later. Just get him first.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Another underrated (or at least underreported) part of Monroe's game is his passing ability; his assist numbers don't reflect it, but he's displayed excellent interior passing ability. That one complaint that many have about Aldridge being unwilling to pass out of contested jump-shots--not an issue with Monroe. In Stotts' "flow" offense, his passing ability would be likely a valuable asset.

 

[dviss1]

Monroe would have been great.....if we would have traded LA for Wiggins or someone like that. Getting Monroe as a consolation prize and letting LA walk for nothing is going to sting. A lot.

I don't foresee us losing LA for nothing. He IMO would accept a sign and trade (to get more money) to another team of his choosing.

 

[Natebishop3]

I don't foresee us losing LA for nothing. He IMO would accept a sign and trade (to get more money) to another team of his choosing.

From what others have said, there isn't an option of getting more money from a sign and trade. It would be for less money and less years even with the sign and trade. He only gets the extra money if he stays in Portland. At least that's what I've been told.

 

[Pinwheel1]

I don't foresee us losing LA for nothing. He IMO would accept a sign and trade (to get more money) to another team of his choosing.

Well we would not get fair value. Maybe Splitter and Diaw?

 

[magnifier661]

I'm still down for Monroe if the dude could defend and play center. He has the post presence to be a solid Center, but he is absolutely terrible on the defensive end. Now if Aldridge somehow accepts swapping defensively at center, it could very well work. I noticed Aldridge has really stepped up his help defense. If Monroe can just make sure that he keeps his man in front of him, Aldridge would be a fine help defender.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Well we would not get fair value. Maybe Splitter and Diaw?

I'd want Splitter and Leonard. They wouldn't do it, but that's my asking price if I'm Neil.

 

[Natebishop3]

I'm still down for Monroe if the dude could defend and play center. He has the post presence to be a solid Center, but he is absolutely terrible on the defensive end. Now if Aldridge somehow accepts swapping defensively at center, it could very well work. I noticed Aldridge has really stepped up his help defense. If Monroe can just make sure that he keeps his man in front of him, Aldridge would be a fine help defender.

I'm just really not that impressed with LA as a defender. For his length, he should really be a much more effective defender, but he's not. In my opinion, it's his defense that will most likely keep him out of the hall.

 

[Draco]

I don't foresee us losing LA for nothing. He IMO would accept a sign and trade (to get more money) to another team of his choosing.

They changed that; players no longer get more from a sign and trade it's the same if he signs with another team outright. He can only get more by staying here.

 

[Draco]

From what others have said, there isn't an option of getting more money from a sign and trade. It would be for less money and less years even with the sign and trade. He only gets the extra money if he stays in Portland. At least that's what I've been told.

Correct; they changed that during the 2011 lockout.

 

[Draco]

I'd want Splitter and Leonard. They wouldn't do it, but that's my asking price if I'm Neil.

Why not demand LeBron? Just as likely as getting Kawhi.

 

[Draco]

I'm just really not that impressed with LA as a defender. For his length, he should really be a much more effective defender, but he's not. In my opinion, it's his defense that will most likely keep him out of the hall.

I'm often very perplexed watching him defend. He will do a great job on smaller players or stretch big men. We've seen him play great down low against a dominant Dwight Howard in single coverages. But then other times he doesn't help when it looks like he could easily effect a shot. Sometimes he swipes at the ball repeatedly for unlikely steals then gets scored on where he could've just stood straight up and forced a difficult shot. I've thought he's just saving energy and pacing himself for 80 games. It feels like he could be a great defender if he stuck to the basic fundamentals more often.

 

[Natebishop3]

I'm often very perplexed watching him defend. He will do a great job on smaller players or stretch big men. We've seen him play great down low against a dominant Dwight Howard in single coverages. But then other times he doesn't help when it looks like he could easily effect a shot. Sometimes he swipes at the ball repeatedly for unlikely steals then gets scored on where he could've just stood straight up and forced a difficult shot. I've thought he's just saving energy and pacing himself for 80 games. It feels like he could be a great defender if he stuck to the basic fundamentals more often.

I just don't see the effort from him. He doesn't get out very well on the pick and roll. As you said, he swipes at the ball a lot, which is lazy in my opinion. He used to get called for it all the time because it's one of the easiest calls to make for an official. Swiping at the ball is extremely obvious, and really not that effective in my opinion. I think he floats on defense.

 

[magnifier661]

I'm just really not that impressed with LA as a defender. For his length, he should really be a much more effective defender, but he's not. In my opinion, it's his defense that will most likely keep him out of the hall.

I think we take his defense for granted, especially during crunch time situations. The reason why we can have a stretch 4 offense in crunch time is just how well Aldridge rebounds, defends and help defends. He can't do it throughout the entire game, but he definitely can be one of the best defenders on the floor for a short stint.

 

[Natebishop3]

I think we take his defense for granted, especially during crunch time situations. The reason why we can have a stretch 4 offense in crunch time is just how well Aldridge rebounds, defends and help defends. He can't do it throughout the entire game, but he definitely can be one of the best defenders on the floor for a short stint.

A short stint is great, but that really just makes it more frustrating because we know he's capable of being a very good defender. He just doesn't do it very often. So, like I said, I think that's what will ultimately keep him out of the hall of fame.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Knicks are throwing the MAX at Monroe this summer.

Then he should sign with the Knicks and be their insanely overpaid version of J.J. Hickson. He'll be a double-double machine, steal rebounds from his teammates and allow anyone he's "guarding" to score 20 points and the Knicks won't understand why they still can't make the playoffs in the incredibly weak Eastern Conference.

If the Knicks are dumb enough to throw max money at Greg Monroe, they will get what they deserve. I'm not saying Monroe sucks, but he's nowhere close to a max contract player. Any team that makes him one is foolish - which why the Knicks will probably do it.

BNM