Politics California To Have Harsher Penalty For Pronoun Violations Than For Knowingly Spreading HIV

[bodyman5000 and 1]

Maris, we have more than one transgendered member of this community. One people know about, you can't give her enough respect to call her by the pronoun she now identifies as? No one is asking you to agree with her decision, just basic respect. You can't or won't do that? Really?

Right or wrong someone could feel like it wasn't something they felt ok with?

That nutjob Kim Davis? Don't like her but I at least understood it.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

He's not arguing if he's right.

Arguing is arguing. Doesn't matter if you think you're right. I argue. And if I hurt someone's feelings in something I post I'm man enough to apologize. Doesn't mean I agree or even feel that I was wrong. Denny said I hurt his feelings. While I love to fuck with him I don't want to inflict pain. That's not my thing. So I said I was sorry.

 

[MARIS61]

http://www.kgw.com/news/crime/man-c...after-threatening-muslim-police-say/455200289



Freedom of speech doesn't protect you from hate crimes.

Constitutionally, it absolutely protects you from prosecution for any possible utterance you can think of.

There are many laws, most of them called hate crime laws, which simply hold no water under Constitutional scrutiny.

 

[MARIS61]

What's dumb is that it isn't even remotely similar. Those are two different crimes by law. Now the HIV infection is one crime. With one max sentence. There is no other crime unless you give someone HIV and then shoot them or something.

THEN they can charge two separate crimes.

If they eventually die from AIDS, as many wounded victims do from stabbings and the like, then a murder charge would be filed, except in batshit-crazy California.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Right or wrong someone could feel like it wasn't something they felt ok with?

That nutjob Kim Davis? Don't like her but I at least understood it.

I didn't know Kim as a member of this community.

 

[Denny Crane]

He's not arguing if he's right.

I wasn't arguing at all. It was a discussion as far as I am concerned. I was trying to understand how this law is going to make some family not look at her funny, or even make her life better, or how she believed that making speech illegal would somehow make the people who are abusive stop being abusive (I think they'd find some other even worse way).

EDIT: Note my use of pronouns.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

What's dumb is that it isn't even remotely similar. Those are two different crimes by law. Now the HIV infection is one crime. With one max sentence. There is no other crime unless you give someone HIV and then shoot them or something.

THEN they can charge two separate crimes.

If someone infected someone with AIDS with the intention to murder them and there was proof of it I would hope a prosecutor would bring charges of attempted murder against them.

 

[Denny Crane]

If someone infected someone with AIDS with the intention to murder them and there was proof of it I would hope a prosecutor would bring charges of attempted murder against them.

It is attempted murder, assault and battery, and likely a few other crimes.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

It is attempted murder, assault and battery, and likely a few other crimes.

But Bodyman is arguing that now the max penalty is only 6 months if a person is convicted of those crimes.

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

But Bodyman is arguing that now the max penalty is only 6 months if a person is convicted of those crimes.

Did you read what the article said. The sponsors says it isn't because HIV isn't a death sentence anymore.

Those crimes can't be charged now because there is a specific penalty for the one and only action committed.

If someone gets HIV like this and for some reason treatment doesn't work I suppose a prosecutor could charge them with whatever they want but you're still missing the entire point as per usual.

Go back and read what I said again.

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

It is attempted murder, assault and battery, and likely a few other crimes.

As I said, even if the DA charges all those the defense can now point to the 6 months max sentence written into law.

As I also said they could have just kept the sentence as it was for the 7 cases quoted or they could have made it worse. But it is California so they made it six months because they're dipshits.

Give the defense all the ammo they want AND advertise that knowingly spreading HIV is only worth 6 months. Then some guy does it on purpose and when he gets charged with attempted murder he'll say "I did it cuz I thought I'd get 6 months"

 

[Denny Crane]

But Bodyman is arguing that now the max penalty is only 6 months if a person is convicted of those crimes.

I think it's still attempted murder whether the person gets HIV from it or not. Certainly the person getting the HIV dose isn't likely to consent to receiving it.

That said, your own article says:

http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/09/c...-violations-than-for-knowingly-spreading-hiv/

California Gov. Jerry Brown signed legislation on Friday lowering the maximum penalty for knowingly infecting or exposing a person to HIV to six months in prison — down from a maximum of eight years. Also last week, Brown signed legislation allowing for penalties of up to one year in jail for health care workers who “willfully and repeatedly” use the “wrong” pronouns to refer to a senior transgender patient.
​

So I find it reasonable to argue (argue means make a case for) the penalty for knowingly infecting... to be less than for the pronoun thing.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Did you read what the article said. The sponsors says it isn't because HIV isn't a death sentence anymore.

Those crimes can't be charged now because there is a specific penalty for the one and only action committed.

If someone gets HIV like this and for some reason treatment doesn't work I suppose a prosecutor could charge them with whatever they want but you're still missing the entire point as per usual.

Go back and read what I said again.

I read the article.

I read what you said.

I'm not missing the point.

If you die from aids from fucking a hooker that's on you. Not on the hooker. (I better clear that up, that is my own conservative opinion. I believe in taking responsibility for one's own actions. Now if my gf ever gave me aids, that means she been sleeping around and I would probably kill her or something really ugly.)

Also go back and read what I have posted. I have nowhere said that I support the change in law. All I have done is post more accurate information and tried to explain it. You're the one who has tried to deal in wild jumps of logic.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

I think it's still attempted murder whether the person gets HIV from it or not. Certainly the person getting the HIV dose isn't likely to consent to receiving it.

That said, your own article says:

http://dailycaller.com/2017/10/09/c...-violations-than-for-knowingly-spreading-hiv/

California Gov. Jerry Brown signed legislation on Friday lowering the maximum penalty for knowingly infecting or exposing a person to HIV to six months in prison — down from a maximum of eight years. Also last week, Brown signed legislation allowing for penalties of up to one year in jail for health care workers who “willfully and repeatedly” use the “wrong” pronouns to refer to a senior transgender patient.
​

So I find it reasonable to argue (argue means make a case for) the penalty for knowingly infecting... to be less than for the pronoun thing.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-targeted-sex-workers/?utm_term=.14528c9d02ce

 

[Denny Crane]

As I said, even if the DA charges all those the defense can now point to the 6 months max sentence written into law.

As I also said they could have just kept the sentence as it was for the 7 cases quoted or they could have made it worse. But it is California so they made it six months because they're dipshits.

Give the defense all the ammo they want AND advertise that knowingly spreading HIV is only worth 6 months. Then some guy does it on purpose and when he gets charged with attempted murder he'll say "I did it cuz I thought I'd get 6 months"

Under this law, the DA can charge someone with abuse (whatever laws cover it), assault, and whatever else they can drum up, as well as the pronoun violation.

Multiple charges.

You see it all the time.

OJ, for example, was charged with 2 counts of murder (one for his wife, one for Ron Goldman).

See "one or more" in the quote below.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminal_charge

 

[Denny Crane]

I read the article.

I read what you said.

I'm not missing the point.

If you die from aids from fucking a hooker that's on you. Not on the hooker.

Also go back and read what I have posted. I have nowhere said that I support the change in law. All I have done is post more accurate information and tried to explain it. You're the one who has tried to deal in wild jumps of logic.

If the hooker knowingly tried to infect you, it's not on you.

 

[noknobs]

Go Blazers!

 

[Denny Crane]

https://www.cdc.gov/hiv/policies/law/states/exposure.html

It should be noted that all states have general criminal laws—such as assault and battery, reckless endangerment, and attempted murder—that can and have been used to prosecute individuals for any of the above-mentioned behaviors.

 

[Denny Crane]

As I said, even if the DA charges all those the defense can now point to the 6 months max sentence written into law.

As I also said they could have just kept the sentence as it was for the 7 cases quoted or they could have made it worse. But it is California so they made it six months because they're dipshits.

Give the defense all the ammo they want AND advertise that knowingly spreading HIV is only worth 6 months. Then some guy does it on purpose and when he gets charged with attempted murder he'll say "I did it cuz I thought I'd get 6 months"

For the one charge, yes. They can't get out of the assault and battery one, which has its own sentencing rules.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

If the hooker knowingly tried to infect you, it's not on you.

If you're fucking a hooker without a condom you get what you get.

If she reaches down and tears off the condom and you still stick your dick in you get what you get.

 

[Denny Crane]

If you're fucking a hooker without a condom you get what you get.

If she reaches down and tears off the condom and you still stick your dick in you get what you get.

It’s assault, attempted murder, etc.

 

[MARIS61]

Maris, we have more than one transgendered member of this community. The one person we know about, you can't give her enough respect to call her by the pronoun she now identifies as? No one is asking you to agree with her decision, just basic respect. You can't or won't do that? Really?

My posts referred to the unConstitutionality of the law, and should not be taken as a statement of personal opinion on transgenders.

My friends and family include many gays and lesbians but I don't know any transgenders personally and am unaware of any on this board. No board members have ever asked me to address them at all, let alone with a specific title. I certainly support their right to make whatever choices and take whatever steps and measures they want to enjoy their lives as long as they are not infringing on the rights of others.

My opposition to laws that infringe on the rights of even one single American, even if she is a bigoted asswipe, specifically helps protect transgenders rights to be treated as equals and have their voices heard.

Either we are all free, or we are all slaves.

 

[MARIS61]

If you're fucking a hooker without a condom you get what you get.

If she reaches down and tears off the condom and you still stick your dick in you get what you get.

So if I go to a country music concert in Vegas it's my fault that I am murdered by a mass murderer?

 

[SlyPokerDog]

So if I go to a country music concert in Vegas it's my fault that I am murdered by a mass murderer?

If you stick your dick in him it is.

 

[MARIS61]

Wiki.

HIV Diagnoses (new diagnoses, regardless of when infection occurred or stage of disease at diagnosis): In 2013, an estimated 47,352 people were diagnosed with HIV infection in the United States. In that same year, an estimated 26,688 people were diagnosed with AIDS.

Deaths: An estimated 13,712 people with an AIDS diagnosis died in 2012, and approximately 658,507 people in the United States with an AIDS diagnosis have died overall. The deaths of persons with an AIDS diagnosis can be due to any cause—that is, the death may or may not be related to AIDS.

With all the safeguards and awareness in America on how to avoid getting AIDS, it is safe to conclude that the majority of new AIDS cases stem from deliberate infections of unsuspecting victims by serial killers. In California they get a pass.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

With all the safeguards and awareness in America on how to avoid getting AIDS, it is safe to conclude that the majority of new AIDS cases stem from deliberate infections of unsuspecting victims by serial killers. In California they get a pass.

Statistics show the vast majority are getting AIDS from being stupid, not evil.

 

[Hobbesarable]

If you're fucking a hooker without a condom you get what you get.

If she reaches down and tears off the condom and you still stick your dick in you get what you get.

That is the Straight up truth. Unprotected sex can bring about some nasty consequences, but in the end it's up to you. That's why it's called your personal responsibility.