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andalusian said:
In 2014, Hyundai was 5th from the bottom in JD Power's dependability survey, in 2017 they were mid-pack and now they seem to be pretty close to the top.

As I said, we can only give you anecdotal info - and both our Kia was and Hyundai now seem to be very good reliability wise. I still do not think they will have the long term (as in, 10+ years) dependability of Toyota which seems to be overbuilt and usually uses a little less recent technology - but they certainly seem to have come a long way.

Since we live in SoCal where all the US design studios for car manufacturers are and I have friends that work at some of them - I am familiar a bit with the industry gossip. About 5 years ago Hyundai / Kia went on a hiring spree and got some of the best designers, engineers and production people from around the industry - and gave them money to do whatever to bring the product up - and you are starting to see that. The old head of the M division in BMW now works for Kia, the head of the old Audi design studios now works for Hyundai.

As I said, my gut feeling is that no-one still is as overbuilt as Toyota / Lexus - but Hyundai over Honda? Nowadays, seems like a good call.
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I hear you and think that is true, Hyundai over Honda? Sure. Honda lost their way years ago, but I am skeptical any company in my lifetime will ever make a car with superior quality than Toyota, and Lexus in particular. Engineering and technology are great and all, but what makes Toyota special is the company culture. Maybe some day that will change, but I don’t foresee that changing in my lifetime.
 
Voodoo said:
I hear you and think that is true, Hyundai over Honda? Sure. Honda lost their way years ago, but I am skeptical any company in my lifetime will ever make a car with superior quality than Toyota, and Lexus in particular. Engineering and technology are great and all, but what makes Toyota special is the company culture. Maybe some day that will change, but I don’t foresee that changing in my lifetime.
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Well, we are on our 2nd Lexus and I agree with you that their quality is outstanding. But, it is not just quality, as I alluded to before - it is their technological conservatism. Toyota rarely gets into the newest tech first, which means that their solutions are often geared to long-term reliability over newest stuff since the stuff has been perfected over longer periods of time - and this helps. In addition, they are very large and require consistency from their parts suppliers - which smaller companies do not often have the ability to do.

For the record, we currently have an old Lexus as our kids high-school car / overland off-roader car.
 
May look at the Lexus UX. It's a little more than I wanted to spend, but for the reasons above it may be worth a look.

I can get it through Costco with no markup.

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EL PRESIDENTE said:
May look at the Lexus UX. It's a little more than I wanted to spend, but for the reasons above it may be worth a look
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Only if you plan to keep it for a very long time. If the plan is 5-6 years at most, there is no real advantage as far as reliability IMHO.
 
andalusian said:
Only if you plan to keep it for a very long time. If the plan is 5-6 years at most, there is no real advantage as far as reliability IMHO.
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I keep my cars forever. I hate the process and won't change as long as I need to. The downer for me is maintenance costs more as does need to use premium gas.

Will likely stick within budget but I'll take a look at them.
 
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I may be able to get a hyundai at employee pricing, but I'm concerned about some of the issues on engine failure and the manufacturers failing to respond to major issues. It's all over their social media posts.

Also the parts and the dealer service network. Toyota, I have like 3 or 4 dealers within 10 miles.
 
EL PRESIDENTE said:
I may be able to get a hyundai at employee pricing, but I'm concerned about some of the issues on engine failure and the manufacturers failing to respond to major issues. It's all over their social media posts.

Also the parts and the dealer service network. Toyota, I have like 3 or 4 dealers within 10 miles.
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Never had a Hyundai or KIA ICE cars, but as I said, our experience with their BEV cars is very good. No idea how this translates to the ICE cars, but a friend had a Niro Hybrid that he kept for 5 years without any issues, but that's just anecdotal evidence.
 
Good quality/convenient service at a reasonable price can be as important as the car investment itself.
Also, check out how many late model cars are for sale by owner used. If particular make & models within a date range are very prevalent it usually not a great sign.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
Kia comes with a 10yr/100,000 warranty.

Also, and I just learned this since we started this 2 days ago, the batteries in hybrids and electric cars are covered under the federal emission control laws. Car manufacturers have to guarantee the batteries for 10 years separate from the warranty.
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...does that really matter if the batteries typically don't last much longer than 10 years though? :dunno: Computer chips are probably designed to short circuit the batteries after 10 years and 1 day :biglaugh:
 
Test drove the Lexus UX. A bit small, the back seat was tiny. Probably won't consider that.

I liked the Honda HRV. That was a fun and useful car. The civic seemed like it sat too low. Honda guys were too pushy and had too many add on accessories.

Test drove the Camry, it was fine. I'll probably end up going with that when one with the configuration I like comes through. Boring car, but I'm not a car person. May do a base RAV4, I saw that that didn't have a markup at one of the dealers I went to as well.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
Smart!



No, they are professionals in this area. You went with a national professional company to avoid these types of problems. They did not get screwed. They are not a victim.



I would wait until you know more.
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Have not been contacted from anyone regarding my vehicle since I last contacted carvana. Going to get in touch with this dude https://phillyconsumerlaw.com/ who has 2 class action lawsuits pending against them and see what they suggest. I'd be satisfied with them just buying it back at what I originally paid, but if I'm in for a bigger payday, why not?!
 
Mrs SPD's Kia Soul is listed for sale on Beaverton Kia's website.

It's a 2016, she bought in 2017. It had 14000 miles on it when she bought it. It now has 89,000 miles. She paid $14k for it.

It's listed for sale for $17,100.

Crazy.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
Mrs PokerDog is buying a new car right now.

What a fucking adventure, lol. Because of the chip shortage, we might be buying the car in Seattle or LA. We're talking to dealers in both.

Best way to buy a car, the Costco Auto Program.

Because of chip shortage, the car she wants has a $5,000 market adjustment. The Costco Auto makes the dealer take that off the price. The Seattle dealer she is talking to the Costco Auto program is $350 below MSRP. The LA is $500 below MSRP.

None of the other auto buying programs gets you close to that.
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Yeah Mrs Hard just did this also.
She didn’t like the wait for delivery though.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
Mrs SPD's Kia Soul is listed for sale on Beaverton Kia's website.

It's a 2016, she bought in 2017. It had 14000 miles on it when she bought it. It now has 89,000 miles. She paid $14k for it.

It's listed for sale for $17,100.

Crazy.
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I bet a few here would buy it just to sniff the passenger seat. :Sly:
 
The best part is that you’re all acting like Sly is married, but really Mrs SPD is just what he calls his right hand.
 
Wife and I cancelled the Costco car we put a refundable deposit on. They called and said it was going to have $1100. ceramic dealer installed and the price was going to need increase $600.
The dealer has already issued my deposit back. I thought I might end up fighting them for it.

Im trying to talk wife into just leasing a car as she only puts about 6500 mile per year. She doesn't want to worry about dings and stuff. I said dont worry, be happy!
 
Hoopguru said:
Wife and I cancelled the Costco car we put a refundable deposit on. They called and said it was going to have $1100. ceramic dealer installed and the price was going to need increase $600.
The dealer has already issued my deposit back. I thought I might end up fighting them for it.

Im trying to talk wife into just leasing a car as she only puts about 6500 mile per year. She doesn't want to worry about dings and stuff. I said dont worry, be happy!
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The dings are where they get you on the lease.
 
Put in a deposit for a camry, probably on the way from mexico right now.
 
Hoopguru said:
Wife and I cancelled the Costco car we put a refundable deposit on. They called and said it was going to have $1100. ceramic dealer installed and the price was going to need increase $600.
The dealer has already issued my deposit back. I thought I might end up fighting them for it.

Im trying to talk wife into just leasing a car as she only puts about 6500 mile per year. She doesn't want to worry about dings and stuff. I said dont worry, be happy!
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I think you'll find that even with the "true coat" the Costco deal is still better.

But...

The car Mrs SPD just got was literally fresh off the boat. It had all of its plastic and foam padding on it and had been just offloaded from the truck. Beaverton Kia was going to put a "true coat" on it but hadn't yet. I was walking around and noticed an orange peel on the paint of all of the new cars. (if you don't know what orange peel on car paint is you should google it.) I looked at the car she was buying and the other two that had just arrived and none of them had the orange peel on them. So I instantly knew they weren't putting their "true coat" on correctly. I pointed it out to the salesperson in the showroom and then loudly to the sales manager. Then wanted me to shut up about the "true coat" but still said they would make sure it was applied correctly. I told them in a half-jokingly manner that I'm a picky SOB and if there is one bit of orange peel on the car I would be bringing it back and having the car buffed out on their dime. Then I said instead of the $1200 for the "true coat" how about I pay you $300 not to put it on.

They said they can't take money for not putting it on but they agreed to no paint protection/"true coat"

If the car is what your wife wants you can offer to pay them for no true coat or just pay the $1200 because I don't think you'll find a better deal in the Portland market.

 
SlyPokerDog said:
I think you'll find that even with the "true coat" the Costco deal is still better.

But...

The car Mrs SPD just got was literally fresh off the boat. It had all of its plastic and foam padding on it and had been just offloaded from the truck. Beaverton Kia was going to put a "true coat" on it but hadn't yet. I was walking around and noticed an orange peel on the paint of all of the new cars. (if you don't know what orange peel on car paint is you should google it.) I looked at the car she was buying and the other two that had just arrived and none of them had the orange peel on them. So I instantly knew they weren't putting their "true coat" on correctly. I pointed it out to the salesperson in the showroom and then loudly to the sales manager. Then wanted me to shut up about the "true coat" but still said they would make sure it was applied correctly. I told them in a half-jokingly manner that I'm a picky SOB and if there is one bit of orange peel on the car I would be bringing it back and having the car buffed out on their dime. Then I said instead of the $1200 for the "true coat" how about I pay you $300 not to put it on.

They said they can't take money for not putting it on but they agreed to no paint protection/"true coat"

If the car is what your wife wants you can offer to pay them for no true coat or just pay the $1200 because I don't think you'll find a better deal in the Portland market.

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Yeah, they also increased the price by $600 mentioned administration fees on top of license.
 
So it sounds like Carvana is going to do a "delayed return" on my vehicle once it get approved by their "Treasury Team". From what they explained to me, they will be purchasing the vehicle back at what I paid. I may not get reimbursed for the interest that I paid on my loan, but this should still net me a few thousand dollars since I was making extra principal payments for the past 16 months.

I did have a full vehicle inspection done at the Nissan dealership, and they didn't uncover any structural damage, but there is nothing anyone can do to get the structural damage that was reported on the CarFax removed. So it's kind of moot.

This has been a real effing hassle, but if I can come out ahead AND stick it to the man, it'll be worth it.
 
andalusian said:
Well, we are on our 2nd Lexus and I agree with you that their quality is outstanding. But, it is not just quality, as I alluded to before - it is their technological conservatism. Toyota rarely gets into the newest tech first, which means that their solutions are often geared to long-term reliability over newest stuff since the stuff has been perfected over longer periods of time - and this helps. In addition, they are very large and require consistency from their parts suppliers - which smaller companies do not often have the ability to do.

For the record, we currently have an old Lexus as our kids high-school car / overland off-roader car.
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Toyota uses proven technology and features that hold up.

That's why they are so reliable and don't have the latest tech (like great fuel mileage).

You get one or the other. Not both.
 
Shaboid said:
So it sounds like Carvana is going to do a "delayed return" on my vehicle once it get approved by their "Treasury Team". From what they explained to me, they will be purchasing the vehicle back at what I paid. I may not get reimbursed for the interest that I paid on my loan, but this should still net me a few thousand dollars since I was making extra principal payments for the past 16 months.

I did have a full vehicle inspection done at the Nissan dealership, and they didn't uncover any structural damage, but there is nothing anyone can do to get the structural damage that was reported on the CarFax removed. So it's kind of moot.

This has been a real effing hassle, but if I can come out ahead AND stick it to the man, it'll be worth it.
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NICE! That's a great outcome for that. If you had purchased it from a local used car dealership it would have been a lot more of a hassle.
 
Currently renting a Hyundai Ioniq hybrid. I kind of like it, its kind of small and hidden. There's a big bar on the rear hatch that blocks part of the view though. I got like 59 mpg on my morning communte. Very no-nonsense, basic but nice interior. I like it better than the Nissan Sentra I was just in.
 
I want the Cadillac LYRIQ YO!

my23-lyriq-gallery-interior-cabin.jpg
 
tlongII said:
It's Cadillac's first all-electric vehicle. I've always had a "thing" for Caddy's. Probably because my dad always drove them.
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I had a 2000 Cadillac Seville STS, fun car to drive. Surprisingly nimble considering how heavy it was. Of the sports sedans I've owned it was my 2nd favorite after my Lexus GS.
 
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