Dammit Glen

[Ranger71]

http://snyrangersblog.com/2013-14/2...le/?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed

 

[Puckmeat]

Crap. I'm on the fence about Boyle, he has his place, but at this point its getting smaller and smaller. Honestly, I think the team would be better off without him, he hasn't produced like he should, and he doesn't play to his size, and I'd rather them free up the cap space to get Stepan signed. However, I don't mind him as much as some here. I like him on the PK, and when he wants to, he's not bad on draws, but that's about as far as it goes. And 1.7 million is too much for a situational player like that. I'm willing to give him a chance under AV, same with Richards, but I just don't see him getting any better.

I really think just about everyone will be better this year without Torts, last season there was nowhere for all the frustration to go, so everyone struggled. I know there is still an overwhelming amount of pressure to perform in New York, but Torts went about it the wrong way, throwing players under the bus and developing a bad reputation as a media sideshow. Without that strain, I'm hoping they can just go out and win some hockey games!

 

[Ranger71]

He's just an extraneous piece at this point, when you factor in an extra 1.5m which is important right now. He can be useful in certain aspects but not enough to warrant being in the lineup most nights, plus he's back to his 5g seasons. They have Moore who is more well rounded and Lindberg I think will be ready by midseason.

 

[Puckmeat]

Extraneous is exactly the right word. That would have saved me a lot of typing, lol.

 

[theProdigy223]

Pyatt is a million times more useless than Boyle. Not even close. If we want to dump someone purely for salary reasons it needs to be him. Boyle has some value on the PK, in the faceoff circle, and in defensive situations. Pyatt brings none of that. Pyatt is 1.5m, there's your money right there.

 

[Puckmeat]

I don't disagree, Prodigy. Either of them could go, and I wouldn't care one whit. Now, if only we could mutate them into an atomic monster, with octagonal shaped bodies that suck blood...

 

[dumpstralmannow]

You should factor in that Sather acting like Boyle is valuable will only help his value when he dumps him. If he came out and said, "I can't wait to get rid of this guy", teams would offer nothing. My problem with Boyle is he's lazy. He plays the regular season like it means nothing. I disagree. It's tough start playoff series 2 games on the road. It hurt the Rangers against Boston even if they had already quit on Torts.

To me, Boyle is a fine 4th line wing if they could dump Pyatt and Stralman to clear up salary. They really should have no problem doing that if they package them together. However, Boyle would be the guy teams want.

 

[theProdigy223]

Yeah I understand that Boyle is more valuable, and since Pyatt is so useless we won't get much back. But if we're looking at this strictly as a salary dump then I don't think the return is all that important. The real value of the move will be the extra space to finally get Stepan done.

I would just like to see a Boyle-Moore-Dorsett 4th line going into the year. If it isn't working Boyle could be a good deadline deal for a team looking for some size going into the playoffs.

 

[Puckmeat]

The problem with getting Boyle for his size is he plays like he's my size (not much bigger than Zucc, taller but lighter), and not a friggin behemoth, like he should. We all know this, and don't think for a second other teams don't, either, ad that will diminish his trade value. The sad truth of all of this is, no team will be perfect, there is always going to be one or two players who are there to fill a roster spot, and give the top 6 or 9 forwards an extra few seconds to rest.

 

[Ranger71]

I don't know, if they could get a 3rd or 4th rounder and let Clark go to work with it, plus dump his salary I'd do it. I can't really imagine there's a bunch of teams calling about him. I think Glen had some bad seafood or something.

 

[dumpstralmannow]

There were actually a ton of teams calling about Boyle at the deadline from what I read and heard. I don't think they will have any problem getting back a 2nd rounder for him. Most teams are very thin on role players. The Rangers are one of the few teams that have an abundance. The odds of a 2nd round pick turning out to be a good NHL player are about 11%. So to me, if you don't have role players, giving up a 2nd rounder for Boyle is really a no brainer for another organization.

 

[Puckmeat]

That 11% kind of bugs me. If its only 11% for a 2nd rounder, what is it for a 1st? How many of those can you name outside of the top 10 picks taht actually do something? Look at players like Daigle, DiPietrio, etc. If we could get a second round pick at the deadline for Boyle, Pyatt, Zucc, Strahlman, Powe, etc I'd be pretty happy with that. Being the NYR, they can't sandbag season after season to get good picks, so any extras we can get would be phenomenal. Even in the dark years of recent memory, we still didn't get high picks, as the Penguins, Edmonton, Colorado, Isles, and Columbus were doing even worse, because even though we were bad, we still went out and played.

Imagine if the New York media and fan base allowed the Rangers a few just God awful seasons to get some #1 picks. I think its something like 6-7 top 10 picks in the last 30 or so years, and only one of them really did anything for us, and that was Brian Leetch. In fact, he's the only one that even played for us for any decent amount of time, our two highest picks, Montoya at 6 and Brendl at 4, never even played a game as a Ranger. Yeah, Lundmark and Malhotra played for a while, and so did Sundstrom, but not for long, and except for Sundstrom, not one played a full season with us.

Our only #1 Pick came in 1965.

 

[Ranger71]

If you're the Rangers you're probably better off with a 2nd than a 1st, for the most part.lol Christian Dube anyone?

 

[Puckmeat]

Yeah, most of our secoind rounders did a lot better, thats why I can't see that 11% applying to the Rangers.

 

[dumpstralmannow]

It's also subjective to what your idea of a good NHL player. To me, Boyle is an average NHL player at best. In the 2009 draft the second round has produced very few good NHL players. I believe a couple of young guys will become very good this year. Still pretty low. 2008 was better. At least 6 guys and Stepan may be the best of the bunch. 2007 about 2. 2010 is too early to tell but it doesn't look promising.

Here were our last few 2nd round picks.

Thomas, Werek, Stepan, Lafleur, Anisimov, Sauer, Cliche, Olver, Byers, Graham and Dubinsky.

We had 4 second round picks in 2004 and Dubinsky was the only one to make it and they traded him. Out of that group if you don't believe Thomas will make it, Stepan, Anisimov, Sauer and Dubinsky were the only good players. 36%. That is much better than the league average but your pick still fails over 1/3 the amount of time.

Which is why I say that fans constantly overrate the rounds of draft picks. There is safety in numbers. When you stock pile lots of picks you obviously have a better chance of finding gems.

 

[Ranger71]

2004 they really whiffed in the 2nd, even after them there were a bunch of really good players.

 

[dumpstralmannow]

However, the stock piled picks. They had two 3rd rounders, picked 2 guys that didn't work but then took Callahan in the 4th round. You could make the case if they didn't have another 3rd rounder, they might have taken one of those 3rd round picks in the 4th round and lost Cally to another team. Thus, why I'm a fan of stock piling picks no matter what round they are in.

 

[dumpstralmannow]

They didn't have a first or second this year but they took 3, high talent, risky 3rd round talents. Even if one turns out to be a 15-20 g, third line guy, the draft is a win.

 

[Ranger71]

Yeah Callahan definately made up for some of it.

 

[Puckmeat]

I am super glad Cally didn't wind up on some other team, that's for sure.