David Lee to Portland?

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LittleAlex said:
The only way getting Lee makes sense would be if other moves came immediately afterwards.

But it isn't clear to me what they would be targeting in that case.

Lee doesn't do anything to take some of the burden off of Roy. Lee doesn't do anything to address the horrific perimeter defense. Lee doesn't make LA or Oden better while on the floor.

In short, Lee doesn't do anything that Portland actually needs. He would be a way for KP to save face. Nothing more, nothing less.

I don't care about wasting Paul Allen's money very much. But signing Lee would have completely wasted this last opportunity for Portland to add a quality, needed piece.

Trading Joel to make room for Lee is absurd. Joel is far more valuable to Portland then Lee ever would be. We need Joel as insurance at center for at least another year. Lee would be a piss poor substitute.

Targeting Hedo didn't thrill me, but I could understand the idea behind it and felt it could work. Lee just makes zero sense no matter how I look at it.
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We didn't care about Paul Allen's money from 1998-2001. However, he cares when we have bad contracts and we're not good enough to win championships. Especially in this economy, things start going wrong and he'll tell KP and crew to start cutting salary and we'll have a starting lineup of Telfair, Dixon, Khryapa, Zach, and Maglore again. Or even worse, he'll finally give up and sell the team, and we'll get an owner like Memphis'.
 
LittleAlex said:
The only way getting Lee makes sense would be if other moves came immediately afterwards.

But it isn't clear to me what they would be targeting in that case.

Lee doesn't do anything to take some of the burden off of Roy. Lee doesn't do anything to address the horrific perimeter defense. Lee doesn't make LA or Oden better while on the floor.

In short, Lee doesn't do anything that Portland actually needs. He would be a way for KP to save face. Nothing more, nothing less.

I don't care about wasting Paul Allen's money very much. But signing Lee would have completely wasted this last opportunity for Portland to add a quality, needed piece.

Trading Joel to make room for Lee is absurd. Joel is far more valuable to Portland then Lee ever would be. We need Joel as insurance at center for at least another year. Lee would be a piss poor substitute.

Targeting Hedo didn't thrill me, but I could understand the idea behind it and felt it could work. Lee just makes zero sense no matter how I look at it.
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I agree. To me David Lee makes NO sense for us. I would rather stand pat than add Lee. But what do I know...
 
Ed O said:
OK. I guess we disagree. Contract length and salary are secondary to winning basketball games. I'd rather have David Lee on my team--at any price--than Bass (who's not a bad player).

I don't think that acquiring David Lee at 5 years, $50m will hamper Portland in any way. The contract would not prevent Portland from re-signing its own players nor from using the MLE as needed, IMO.

Further, I think that Lee's contract would be entirely reasonable given his age and abilities. Portland would be able to trade him relatively easily at any point allowed under the CBA. The Clippers were just able to give away Zach Randolph for an expiring contract, for crying out loud... you think Portland would have any issues getting value for David Lee?

Ed O.
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I agree with you Ed. It come down to the Jordan/Drexler theory. (Although on a much much much smaller scale)
Get the biggest bang for your buck. if there was a PG or SF out there that had close to as much value then sure go with need. But is there? OK you can try for Odom but I think you will waste 10 days for nothing as LA will match it. I say go for Lee or Millsap because they are the best talent available.
 
I believe that Lee would provide the one thing that Lamarcus does not. Rebounding. He would be a great hustle player who would pick up the extra rebound when we need it. With that said, the price tag is a bit high. Having him on the roster would be better than not having him on the roster though. At least it would provide the Blazers another asset to trade.

Speaking of trades. I don't know why everyone wants to move Blake and Pryzbilla. Both of them are excellent back ups on a championship team. I would hope that neither one of them would be starters though.
 
Tince said:
Again, I think our main difference comes from the fact that we simply value Lee differently. I think there are a handful of players left in FA that help us more than him at an equal or less contract.
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Lee is not my top option. I prefer Odom, Marvin Williams and Shawn Marion.

I don't want an inferior PF, though, if we sign a PF. I want to get an asset, in that case, in addition to someone that is going to help us and I believe that Lee is a significantly better asset than Bass, even if he was being paid more than Bass would be.

Ed O.
 
This whole David Lee wants to be a starter issue is off base.

People are forgetting that if David Lee comes here it's because he AGREED to come here. So unless KP lies to him, he should know full and well what the situation is when he gets here.
 
That is true MM. If he WANTS to be here and play backup, then by all means make the offer. I just don't agree that he does.
 
Someone like lee would also give us extra depth if there was an injury. Two years in a row we have lost a player for the season before it even started.

If we lost LMA, Oden, or Pryz we would have Lee. If we lost someone else we could trade Lee for a replacement. Yes this is a worse case scenario, but you have to cover your ass. I hate a season to be over before it starts.
 
I'm just worried we're getting played again so someone can get the contract they want from the team they want to play for.
 
This is absolutely what we need! This addresses the weakest point on our roster. If we can sign David Lee I will be ecstatic!
 
Pinwheel1 said:
I agree with you Ed. It come down to the Jordan/Drexler theory. (Although on a much much much smaller scale)
Get the biggest bang for your buck. if there was a PG or SF out there that had close to as much value then sure go with need. But is there? OK you can try for Odom but I think you will waste 10 days for nothing as LA will match it. I say go for Lee or Millsap because they are the best talent available.
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I disagree. At best we're talking about Zach Randolph/SAR theory. We had two players that were good power forwards, but they were not effective playing outside of their natural position or we didn't have minutes for them outside of their natural position.

We saw SAR and Randolph's value both plummet in this situation. We had two 20/10 guys (before they came here) and just two years later all we could turn one into was Frye. The other player we never ended up getting anything of value for.

I don't want to see that scenario repeat itself.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I'm just worried we're getting played again so someone can get the contract they want from the team they want to play for.
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I don't advocate the Blazers shutting things down on other fronts while they talk to Lee... but if another team pays a lot more for Lee than they otherwise would have, isn't that reason enough for Portland to pursue him (provided the team doesn't miss out on any opportunities)?

The Grizzlies only slightly helped themselves directly by signing Miles, but they helped themselves this summer, potentially, by denying Portland cap space AND they helped themselves a bit in the future by undermining Portland... all at a very low cost to themselves.

Similarly, if Portland can get another team to pay more for Lee (or Odom, or whomever) then it will indirectly help them. It won't help them as much as signing a quality player to a reasonable deal, but it still will help some I believe.

Ed O.
 
Tince said:
I disagree. At best we're talking about Zach Randolph/SAR theory. We had two players that were good power forwards, but they were not effective playing outside of their natural position or we didn't have minutes for them outside of their natural position.

We saw SAR and Randolph's value both plummet in this situation. We had two 20/10 guys (before they came here) and just two years later all we could turn one into was Frye. The other player we never ended up getting anything of value for.

I don't want to see that scenario repeat itself.
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SAR was older, injured, and was a soon to be free agent. Zach was .....zach

Lee is 24. He will not lose value
 
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Pinwheel1 said:
SAR was older, injured, and was a soon to be free agent. Zach was .....zach

Lee is 24. He will mot lose value
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Your comparison was using 2 of the 5 best players in the league. Mine was using two 20/10 PF's. If we could get the best PF in the league for $10 million/year, then I would reconsider my position. Lee is far from the best PF in the league, and I would be very surprised if he ends up having a better career than SAR.

SAR was averaging 20.3ppg and 9.3rpg the season we traded for him, so unless he aged rapidly in the next 3 months, I don't think age was the only factor in his decreasing value.

I think Lee is overvalued today, so I don't know how 10-15mpg game could possibly keep his over-inflated value up. And I really can't see how he would be worthy of being our highest paid player.
 
I think Lee isn't a very good defender- so I don't see a need for him in the team unless he came very cheap (7million or less).

I think we're better off targeting 1) Gerald Wallace in a lopsided trade or 2) Odom as a free agent.

I'm also interested in Sessions, though not as much as I once was because I've heard he's a poor defender.

Fuck Turkyglue. But all the same I wasn't sold on him.
 
Tince said:
SAR was averaging 20.3ppg and 9.3rpg the season we traded for him, so unless he aged rapidly in the next 3 months, I don't think age was the only factor in his decreasing value.

I think Lee is overvalued today, so I don't know how 10-15mpg game could possibly keep his over-inflated value up. And I really can't see how he would be worthy of being our highest paid player.
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I think you are getting "value" and "production" mixed up.

A player isn't only valued based on production. Production is a function of ability and opportunity.

SAR was producing in Atlanta, for sure. His production, predictably, went down... he was getting fewer minutes and then was asked to play the SF spot, for some reason.

Did he lose much value, though? I don't think so. The Blazers gave up Rasheed Wallace, who was then flipped for expiring contracts and a first rounder... but Atlanta also sent Theo, who was a starter in Atlanta. The Blazers couldn't move SAR later, but is that a surprise? They got him very cheaply.

And, let's remember, John Nash was a horrible GM. Maybe a more competent one might have been able to get SOME value from SAR.

Ed O.
 
Ed O said:
I think you are getting "value" and "production" mixed up.

A player isn't only valued based on production. Production is a function of ability and opportunity.

SAR was producing in Atlanta, for sure. His production, predictably, went down... he was getting fewer minutes and then was asked to play the SF spot, for some reason.

Did he lose much value, though? I don't think so. The Blazers gave up Rasheed Wallace, who was then flipped for expiring contracts and a first rounder... but Atlanta also sent Theo, who was a starter in Atlanta. The Blazers couldn't move SAR later, but is that a surprise? They got him very cheaply.

And, let's remember, John Nash was a horrible GM. Maybe a more competent one might have been able to get SOME value from SAR.

Ed O.
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Well, I do believe his value dropped equally with his production. He went from 20/10 with Atlanta to finishing his first season with us at 10/5. His salary dropped from $10 million+ to the MLE. Granted there were other factors, but I bet if he had finished out his contract with the Hawks, he would have got more than the MLE.

Again, I don't think Lee is worth $10 million today, so I don't understand how being put in a situation where he is a backup would raise or maintain his value.
 
wonder if we could get Lee and trade him for another player with Rudy, Bayless, Outlaw... for like a Harris or even a Deron Williams... (lol, I know I know)
 
Tince said:
Your comparison was using 2 of the 5 best players in the league. Mine was using two 20/10 PF's. If we could get the best PF in the league for $10 million/year, then I would reconsider my position. Lee is far from the best PF in the league, and I would be very surprised if he ends up having a better career than SAR.

SAR was averaging 20.3ppg and 9.3rpg the season we traded for him, so unless he aged rapidly in the next 3 months, I don't think age was the only factor in his decreasing value.

I think Lee is overvalued today, so I don't know how 10-15mpg game could possibly keep his over-inflated value up. And I really can't see how he would be worthy of being our highest paid player.
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I laugh when fans think GM's and scouts are so stupid that they don't really know how good or bad a player is because he suddenly is stuck behind a better player.

SAR made 15 million dollars with Portland. A little harder to trade expecially since he was going to be a free agent. A young Lee at 9-10 million would not be as tough. My Drexler/Jordan comparison was used to demonstrate that you do not pass up on the best available player. Lee wouldn't be the highest paid player for too long. Especially if we traded him for a player that helps us more. I am all for waiting to use the cap space. I am just saying that we might not want to pass on obtaing a valuable trading piece. And i am especially against signing a player of lesser talent just because of his position. Then you do waste the cap space.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
I laugh when fans think GM's and scouts are so stupid that they don't really know how good or bad a player is because he suddenly is stuck behind a better player.
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When Lee is outside the Knicks system, stuck hehind LMA, and his agent his demanding a trade, his value will decline. Even if GM's know he is better than a player who only gets 15mpg (which he would be better than), they know that Portland has no power/leverage.

Right now, Lee isn't commanding $10 million in the FA market and it doesn't appear anyone is willing to do a sign and trade. That tells me there is a good chance that most (if not all) of the GM's don't feel he's worth that. Therefore, if we sign him for that much, he'll have to show the rest of the league that he is better than we originally thought. Good luck doing that in Portland.
 
tlongII said:
This is absolutely what we need! This addresses the weakest point on our roster. If we can sign David Lee I will be ecstatic!
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Toughness and hustle? Or were you being sarcastic?
 
Will someone please tell the Blazers that PG is their biggest weakness?
 
Generally speaking, acquiring a long term asset (Lee) for an asset with a short shelf-life (cap space) makes sense.

In this case, keep in mind that we would not be acquiring Lee as a future trading chip. At 5 years/$50 million, we will be stuck with him. Translation: bringing in Lee means trading Joel (a superior defender and better option if Oden gets hurt) or LMA (just plain a superior player.)

Sorry, but I am not feeling it.
 
Brandon Bass! If we were to sign him, he would address the back-up PF position, and there would still be some extra money. Please don't trade Joel, just because his numbers aren't amazing, that does not mean he doesn't have value on the team. He is the mentor for Oden that accepts his role and manages the team along with Roy and LaMarcus.
 
Just putting 1 and 1 together here...What about POR signing David Lee to $9 mil and sending him to Charlotte for Gerald Wallace straight up?

I think POR can sign a guy and trade him, but if I recall that player cannot be traded with other players, and he must be traded for another player straight up? 2nd part I am not sure about...

Wallace makes $9.5 mil next year, if Lee was signed for $9mil it is an easy 1 for 1 swap...

CHA could use Lee and POR could use Wallace, it makes sense, and it allows POR to then deal Outlaw or Webster with\without Blake to deal for a PG or a b\u PF...
 
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Blaze01 said:
Just putting 1 and 1 together here...What about POR signing David Lee to $9 mil and sending him to Charlotte for Gerald Wallace straight up?

I think POR can sign a gut and trade him, but if I recall that player cannot be traded with other players, and he must be traded for another player straight up? 2nd part I am not sure about...

Wallace makes $9.5 mil next year, if Lee was signed for $9mil it is an easy 1 for 1 swap...

CHA could use Lee and POR could use Wallace, it makes sense, and it allows POR to then deal Outlaw or Webster with\without Blake to deal for a PG or a b\u PF...
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That was my thought. It has to be structured a bit differently though. New York has to sign and trade Crash to Charlotte, Wallace is sent to Portland, and then we have to send something to Portland.

The only thing is 1) Lee has to agree to a long term deal with Charlotte and I'm not sure how he feels about that scene and 2) Charlotte doesn't save much in the way of money.
 
Blaze01 said:
Just putting 1 and 1 together here...What about POR signing David Lee to $9 mil and sending him to Charlotte for Gerald Wallace straight up?

I think POR can sign a gut and trade him, but if I recall that player cannot be traded with other players, and he must be traded for another player straight up? 2nd part I am not sure about...

Wallace makes $9.5 mil next year, if Lee was signed for $9mil it is an easy 1 for 1 swap...

CHA could use Lee and POR could use Wallace, it makes sense, and it allows POR to then deal Outlaw or Webster with\without Blake to deal for a PG or a b\u PF...
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The player signed must have prior knowledge of the deal and sign off on it.

If Portland could pull that off, then I don't see why they wouldn't.
 
No, I think POR could sign Lee as a Restricted FA, provided that NY doesn't match, and POR could arrange the contract so that it is most expensive\painful for NY in 2010 to reconsider matching...there have been rumours that NY wouldn't match a contract starting at $9 to $9+ mil per year...and then deal him to CHA straight up for Wallace, so NY wouldn't need to be involved....

As for CHA not saving money, that is true, but they are currently paying both small forwards, Diaw and Wallace $9 mil per and have no real PF to speak of...or center depending on how you look at it....I would think that a Lee\Okafor front court would be better than Okafor\Mohammed...

Or another thought would be POR signing Lee and then flipping Przybilla for Wallace...

Okafor\Przybilla or Okafor\Mohammed, which would you choose? and Przybilla would require fewer years of investment than Lee would in a S&T...


and I think an Oden, Aldridge, Lee frontline would be very effective....

Oden as Center 1, Aldridge as PF 1 and center 2, Lee as PF 2...and then you have guys like Pendergraph (who I think could surprise) as 3rd string, and maybe POR goes after a journeyman center\pf like a Kurt Thomas, Antonio McDyess or Fabricio Oberto...
 
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