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Is your thread title implying that Brian is overseas assassinating someone?

barfo
 
BrianFromWA was last seen:
Today at 1:41 PM
 
BrianFromWA said:
I've read more than a few. They're not American MSM writers. But writers all the same. The American counterpoints actually go far over to the Nozick side on the ethics of it (and it would not surprise me at all if you had a copy of Anarchy, State and Utopia on your nightstand). But rest-of-world? Yeah, not so much.
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I don't suppose a post on the Internet means a thing today.

I was just thinking, about Trump convincing Kim to give up his nucs. It has to happen, but Trump isn't going to get this done with his style alone! Any more than Obama could do it with a grin. Kim has to feel the heat, the inevitable, the eminent Threat so he can see the need with the clarity required. This is the invisible side of the negotiation.
 
I have mixed thoughts on Trumps chances to denuclearize the K peninsula.

On the one hand, after his failure at the G7, Trump needs a victory. And fat boy needs money.

On the other hand, fat boy is unpredictable and unstable. And Trump is a loose cannon.

Also not sure which one has the largest ego.
 
MarAzul said:
I don't suppose a post on the Internet means a thing today.

I was just thinking, about Trump convincing Kim to give up his nucs. It has to happen, but Trump isn't going to get this done with his style alone! Any more than Obama could do it with a grin. Kim has to feel the heat, the inevitable, the eminent Threat so he can see the need with the clarity required. This is the invisible side of the negotiation.
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What’s invisible to you is obvious to the rest of us. Trump in crazier than Kim and Kim knows it. Done deal.
 
oldfisherman said:
I have mixed thoughts on Trumps chances to denuclearize the K peninsula.

On the one hand, after his failure at the G7, Trump needs a victory. And fat boy needs money.

On the other hand, fat boy is unpredictable and unstable. And Trump is a loose cannon.

Also not sure which one has the largest ego.
Click to expand...

Which one is fat boy?
 
Nukes are not the worry and should not be the main/only focus. Sure, I don't want to get nuked but if NK were to launch one we have a very strong chance to shoot it down but also we would nuke that entire country out of existence.

The real threat to us and the entire world is NK's biological weapons program. That is what should keep people up at night. If a country were to launch a biological attack you wouldn't know it happened until after people started getting sick. NK could have someone release a biological agent in Heathrow Airport and over half the world could be exposed before anyone had a clue as to what happened.

Even worse, NK could sell their biological weapon technology like Pakistan sold their nuclear tech, to anyone willing to pay.

Kim has already staged a biological weapon attack on his brother in a foreign country. And while it was spread via touch it was still a biological attack committed in an airport. That truly is a red line.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
Nukes are not the worry and should not be the main/only focus. Sure, I don't want to get nuked but if NK were to launch one we have a very strong chance to shoot it down but also we would nuke that entire country out of existence.

The real threat to us and the entire world is NK's biological weapons program. That is what should keep people up at night. If a country were to launch a biological attack you wouldn't know it happened until after people started getting sick. NK could have someone release a biological agent in Heathrow Airport and over half the world could be exposed before anyone had a clue as to what happened.

Even worse, NK could sell their biological weapon technology like Pakistan sold their nuclear tech, to anyone willing to pay.

Kim has already staged a biological weapon attack on his brother in a foreign country. And while it was spread via touch it was still a biological attack committed in an airport. That truly is a red line.
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Wow, you may have solved several puzzles I have been trying to solve. Great post.

Puzzle #1
What is fat boy really up to? Deception is a tactic he often uses. The nuke issue maybe a smoke screen to divert attention away from his bio agenda.

Puzzle #2
Why does fat boy have more submarines than the UK, Germany, France, Australia, SK and Japan combined?
Maybe his plan is to deliver his bio weapons by sub?
 
What's up, guys?
A) on active duty right now, but stateside.
B) whatever your political calling, I think we can all agree that 1) de-nuclearization of autocratic states is probably a good thing and 2) it's almost always better to gain through diplomatic, informational and economic might than military might.
C) NK submarines are meant more for special forces insertions and could not stand up to a hot-war threat. (They can, however, surprise during peacetime. See the Cheonan incident.) Even the most capable subs they have are built with 1950's technology, no anti-submarine warfare capability, and torpedoes that can only go a couple of miles. So if you wanted to "deliver a bio weapon by sub" to SK, maybe that could work. (Honestly, just using the tunnels across the border would be far easier, but whatever). But to go elsewhere? Really unlikely.
 
BrianFromWA said:
C) NK submarines are meant more for special forces insertions and could not stand up to a hot-war threat. (They can, however, surprise during peacetime. See the Cheonan incident.) Even the most capable subs they have are built with 1950's technology, no anti-submarine warfare capability, and torpedoes that can only go a couple of miles. So if you wanted to "deliver a bio weapon by sub" to SK, maybe that could work. (Honestly, just using the tunnels across the border would be far easier, but whatever). But to go elsewhere? Really unlikely.
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I'm just an old dumb leatherneck. I understand our subs are lightyears ahead of the NK subs. In a sub to sub conventional war the NK subs do not stand a chance. But that many subs in the hands of a crazy boy bothers me.

I am like a dog with two peters trying to figure out what fat boy is really up to with so many subs.

Could the NK subs reach our west coast, and launch drones with bio weapons?
 
oldfisherman said:
I'm just an old dumb leatherneck. I understand our subs are lightyears ahead of the NK subs. In a sub to sub conventional war the NK subs do not stand a chance. But that many subs in the hands of a crazy boy bothers me.

I am like a dog with two peters trying to figure out what fat boy is really up to with so many subs.

Could the NK subs reach our west coast, and launch drones with bio weapons?
Click to expand...

One question to ask here is whether the sub fleet is recently built/acquired? If it is legacy there might not be a plan.

Also a suggestion - might be for spying rather than attacking?

barfo
 
oldfisherman said:
I'm just an old dumb leatherneck.
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As a jarhead myself, I know that's an oxymoron. ;)

I understand our subs are lightyears ahead of the NK subs. In a sub to sub conventional war the NK subs do not stand a chance. But that many subs in the hands of a crazy boy bothers me.
I am like a dog with two peters trying to figure out what fat boy is really up to with so many subs.
Could the NK subs reach our west coast, and launch drones with bio weapons?
Click to expand...
It doesn't have to be sub-to-sub. We wouldn't need to even be in the water, though there are plans for that. I'm saying that NK subs don't stand a chance in anything other than staying near the Korean coast, staying on their batteries for quiet, and slipping guys ashore. Like they got caught doing in 1996 and 2010.

They bought about 6 Romeos in the 70's, iirc, which the Soviets had declared obsolete in the late 50's when they stopped building them. Then NK started trying to make their own and got to around 20. They are the "Yugo" version of an obsolete-in-the-60s technology. And that's for their "advanced" attack subs. The mini-subs are almost only useful for SOF insertion and maaaaaybe minelaying. I don't think a torpedo with enough fuel to go anywhere even fits. If they do use their Sang-Os or the new Simpos for ballistic launch (nuclear, bio or whatever) they will likely be a high enough priority for the Commanders in the area that we know every detail about them, when they take off, where they're going, and would probably eradicate them if they so much as opened their missile hatches.

NK subs likely can't get to Japan. They won't get past the first island chain without attracting notice. As far as launching on the West Coast, they probably wouldn't get the chance.

Edit: You can read up on some open-source stuff at Jane's.
 
barfo said:
One question to ask here is whether the sub fleet is recently built/acquired? If it is legacy there might not be a plan.
Click to expand...
They've been retrofitting, rather than building. But KJU has been taking an interest in them.
Also a suggestion - might be for spying rather than attacking?
barfo
Click to expand...
Could be, but similar to how we think our submarines are the "survivable" part of our Nuclear Triad (because our adversaries know where our military bases, bomber fields and missile silos are, but not where our missile boats are) NK may be thinking that his missile boats are his "strategic survivable assets". He will likely be disappointed.
 
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BrianFromWA said:
He will likely be disappointed.
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I don't think this fellow would risk the possibility. By the look of him, I would wager he enjoys the hell out of living far too much come close to risking the possibility of permanent disappointment.
Perhaps he has met his match in crazy, but more likely he been introduced to reality with sufficient clarity very recently.
 
BrianFromWA said:
They've been retrofitting, rather than building. But KJI has been taking an interest in them.
Click to expand...

I suppose KJI doesn't have much else to occupy himself with, being dead and all...

barfo
 
A NK related question for Brian and anyone w/ military background...

Are the 'war games' that Trump agreed to cancel important, and in what way? Besides signalling strength to our adversaries, are they actually necessary for military readiness? Or is it all for show?

barfo
 
I'd love to see us get out of Korea period...let the S Koreans police their own borders and establish relationships with N Korea....I always thought we were there more for having a base closer to China and Russia than the N Korean state. N Korea must be held accountable for human rights abuse in the end. I don't really trust a dictator who kills his own brother and anyone who he fancies...he killed one of his military guys for falling asleep in a meeting.
 
barfo said:
A NK related question for Brian and anyone w/ military background...

Are the 'war games' that Trump agreed to cancel important, and in what way? Besides signalling strength to our adversaries, are they actually necessary for military readiness? Or is it all for show?

barfo
Click to expand...

War games are to the military what team practice is for the Blazers. A way of testing and improving how the varies players with special skills work together.

That said. Unless Trump plans to go to war with NK, he didn't give up too much.

I look at it as a good will gesture. To make up for the USA prisoners that were returned. A step towards peace, not war.
 
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