Enes Kanter's game is garbage (3 Viewers)

[Haakzilla]

Hmmm, the team has won 5 straight with 4 wins on the road and 4 wins against playoff teams, what thread should I make?

Oh I know, I should make another complaining thread that's bench-related!

...and that heavily focuses on +/-

 

[Orion Bailey]

...and that heavily focuses on +/-

Its because he doesnt watch the games and uses that stat as his only judgement. But then thats enough for him to know more than anyone around here.

Different day, same story.....

Instead of going back into the other thread he created and debating hos stance he kust starts a new thread. No debate. Just statements putting other peoples bbiq down without anything to back himself up.

Yawning over here... mayne cause i just woke up.

So how bout that diamond project?

Sounds like it is slowing gears the last couple weeks?

 

[TBpup]

The bench had very little do with the meltdown in the 4th other than that they were on the floor while CJ was playing some seriously clueless basketball.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Just want to point out that benches are usually worse on the road. So that also means the other teams bench usually plays better at home. Yeah the bench hasn't been very good, but when you're playing on the road you basically just need your bench to play solid enough basketball that it doesn't lead to losses. You need them to take up minutes so guys can stay rested. While they haven't shot well, Hood, Curry or Layman they've kept them in games and haven't had any epic meltdowns. I think that's about all you can hope for at this point.

 

[jlprk]

Sigh.

Hmmm, the team has won 5 straight with 4 wins on the road and 4 wins against playoff teams, what thread should I make? Oh I know, I should make another conplaining thread that's bench-related!

Have a brain, Cy. The thread isn't really about the whole bench, just one player.

 

[Hoopguru]

We are Building A Bench....relax

 

[GrandpaBlaze]

Wonder what the comments will be after the Toronto game. Kanter not going so should see more Collins and Leonard.

What happens if we lose? Do we finally get a reprieve from the department of redundancy department?

What happens if we win? Claims that Kanter really doesn’t make a difference?

Sigh.

Just watching the 2nd team play with Kanter & Hood I feel more comfortable about the team. Even when Leonard played good (for Leonard) I worried. Collins has been inconsistent and largely nonexistent offensively.

I’ll take what we have over what we had.

 

[Hoopguru]

Wonder what the comments will be after the Toronto game. Kanter not going so should see more Collins and Leonard.

What happens if we lose? Do we finally get a reprieve from the department of redundancy department?

What happens if we win? Claims that Kanter really doesn’t make a difference?

Sigh.

Just watching the 2nd team play with Kanter & Hood I feel more comfortable about the team. Even when Leonard played good (for Leonard) I worried. Collins has been inconsistent and largely nonexistent offensively.

I’ll take what we have over what we had.

Grandpa bring forth wisdom! Fresh Air!

 

[tlongII]

The bench had very little do with the meltdown in the 4th other than that they were on the floor while CJ was playing some seriously clueless basketball.

And TBpup with the expected putdown of CJ. At least you're consistent!

 

[James lamphear]

Our bench doing what there supposed to do keep the game closed or gain a little or don't lose little that night. But if you look at it when Dame or CJ in the game with there not going get shots like they do if Turner is in there that night. But I am worried a little on Hood shooting though he a little off lately.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Another possibility: has the bench's "performance" these past few games provided more evidence for the Turner supporters that the second unit performs better with him than without?

 

[TBpup]

And TBpup with the expected putdown of CJ. At least you're consistent!

I notice you didn't say that was incorrect. I've given credit where credit is due to CJ when he is playing well or shooting efficiently. He was terrible in the 4th quarter last night. To ignore that would be unrealistic.

 

[tlongII]

I notice you didn't say that was incorrect. I've given credit where credit is due to CJ when he is playing well or shooting efficiently. He was terrible in the 4th quarter last night. To ignore that would be unrealistic.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but aren't you one of the proponents of breaking up Dame and CJ? That they can't go deep in the playoffs together? That is something I vehemently disagree with.

 

[blue9]

The bench rotation is fucked. Curry/Hood/Kanter is crap. Our 4 off the bench should be Kanter, Collins, Jake, and unfortunately Turner.

 

[julius]

I need to buy a new work bench. My old one is suffering.

 

[TBpup]

I'm not saying you're wrong, but aren't you one of the proponents of breaking up Dame and CJ? That they can't go deep in the playoffs together? That is something I vehemently disagree with.

There are some things Dame+CJ do very well. But perform well in the Playoffs together is not one of them. So yes, for some time I have been an advocate of getting someone to go with Dame who is a better fit all around for the team while they might not be as good of a one-on-one scorer. Also, they are fighting against a historical hill. In the history of the NBA, I can't find 2 ball dominant, smallish guards who don't play defense very well that have had much success. The closest to me is Curry/Ellis and while that was a fun, exciting, scoring duo, they accomplished nothing in the post-season.

Thomas/Dumars is also close in size but Dumars was an All-NBA defender which is something neither Dame or CJ come close to.

I like them both individually both as people and as players, but as a duo, it creates some gaping holes and I also believe, keeps the team from developing a rhythm at times. I would love to be proven wrong, but since CJ became the starting PG, the Blazers are 5-14 in the Playoffs. For as much as they are paid and the percentage of shots they take and the style they play with, that just doesn't seem to be a recipe for success. Yes they need better pieces around them but no matter who is around them, they are still taking a majority of the shots in an often efficient manner.

It's been 4 years. The sample size for me is over.

 

[BoomChakaLaka]

Once again we won the game, but once again our starting five had very good plus-minus numbers and the bench, like in every game since Kanter replaced Zach and Meyers and since Turner's injury, the bench players were all in minuses.
This has become a trend and for us to go as far as we can we need to fix this. Collins and Meyers earned minutes, Kanter even in his best performances I don't think once had a positive plus-minus. We can still win and the starting five is clicking but we're not as dominant as we could be

I must be watching a different channel being up here in Canada! Kanter may we’ll have been the needle-moving piece! 5 quality wins and more...I see a confidence coming over this team!

 

[BonesJones]

This post is so moronic. He liked the Hood pickup, so that's he went blame him and will instead blame Kanter even though...

Hood: 0pts, 0ast, 1reb, 0-5FG (20min)
Curry: 0pts, 0ast, 0reb, 0-4FG (20min)
Kanter: 9pts, 8reb, 1ast 3-6FG (18min)

For someone who only reads box scores, even this take is absolutely terrible.

 

[tlongII]

There are some things Dame+CJ do very well. But perform well in the Playoffs together is not one of them. So yes, for some time I have been an advocate of getting someone to go with Dame who is a better fit all around for the team while they might not be as good of a one-on-one scorer. Also, they are fighting against a historical hill. In the history of the NBA, I can't find 2 ball dominant, smallish guards who don't play defense very well that have had much success. The closest to me is Curry/Ellis and while that was a fun, exciting, scoring duo, they accomplished nothing in the post-season.

Thomas/Dumars is also close in size but Dumars was an All-NBA defender which is something neither Dame or CJ come close to.

I like them both individually both as people and as players, but as a duo, it creates some gaping holes and I also believe, keeps the team from developing a rhythm at times. I would love to be proven wrong, but since CJ became the starting PG, the Blazers are 5-14 in the Playoffs. For as much as they are paid and the percentage of shots they take and the style they play with, that just doesn't seem to be a recipe for success. Yes they need better pieces around them but no matter who is around them, they are still taking a majority of the shots in an often efficient manner.

It's been 4 years. The sample size for me is over.

Yes, I have heard your argument. I believe the issue has always been the complementary players. Nurk's emergence this year makes the size of our guards less important. We have better depth with Kanter and Hood. And Layman has really stepped up his game. The playoffs are always a crap shoot, but I believe we're much better equipped to win in the postseason this season.

 

[tlongII]

Yes, I have heard your argument. I believe the issue has always been the complementary players. Nurk's emergence this year makes the size of our guards less important. We have better depth with Kanter and Hood. And Layman has really stepped up his game. The playoffs are always a crap shoot, but I believe we're much better equipped to win in the postseason this season.

I forgot to mention coaching. If Stotts doesn't learn to adjust in the playoffs we will probably still be in trouble. We do not lack talent though.

 

[TBpup]

Yes, I have heard your argument. I believe the issue has always been the complementary players. Nurk's emergence this year makes the size of our guards less important. We have better depth with Kanter and Hood. And Layman has really stepped up his game. The playoffs are always a crap shoot, but I believe we're much better equipped to win in the postseason this season.

I hope so. But this will be Nurk's 3rd Playoffs with the Blazers albeit he was injured for most of one of them. Kanter has been shown to be easily taken out of Playoff matchups when there is more time for teams to scheme and make adjustments and now that Hood/Kanter have arrived, Jakes shot attempts have plummeted. It hasn't mattered so far who those complimentary players were before. I HOPE things are different this year, but if the Playoffs were to start today, the Blazers would be matched up against Houston.

If they are still decimated by injuries, Portland should win. But if Paul and Capela are back, do you think Portland wins that series? I think they have a better shot this year because the Rockets lost a lot of wing defender ability with Mbah a Moute and Ariza gone....but I'm not sure Vegas would have them as a favorite if the Rockets are healthy.

....and Yes, Stotts is a big part of it. He has enabled Dame/CJ to play the way they do and does not seem to make adjustments well. At 60+ years old, I'm not full of confidence that he suddenly turns over a new leaf.

 

[tlongII]

I hope so. But this will be Nurk's 3rd Playoffs with the Blazers albeit he was injured for most of one of them. Kanter has been shown to be easily taken out of Playoff matchups when there is more time for teams to scheme and make adjustments and now that Hood/Kanter have arrived, Jakes shot attempts have plummeted. It hasn't mattered so far who those complimentary players were before. I HOPE things are different this year, but if the Playoffs were to start today, the Blazers would be matched up against Houston.

If they are still decimated by injuries, Portland should win. But if Paul and Capela are back, do you think Portland wins that series? I think they have a better shot this year because the Rockets lost a lot of wing defender ability with Mbah a Moute and Ariza gone....but I'm not sure Vegas would have them as a favorite if the Rockets are healthy.

....and Yes, Stotts is a big part of it. He has enabled Dame/CJ to play the way they do and does not seem to make adjustments well. At 60+ years old, I'm not full of confidence that he suddenly turns over a new leaf.

I don't think we've seen this Nurk before. I've stated elsewhere that I think he's the best defensive big in the league now. I'm amazed at how effective he is patrolling the paint.

 

[TBpup]

I don't think we've seen this Nurk before. I've stated elsewhere that I think he's the best defensive big in the league now. I'm amazed at how effective he is patrolling the paint.

He is better than last year but IMO, not quite the the level of the Nurk Fever version when he first came here. And as well as he is playing, the style Dame/CJ play will still often limit his touches even when he is having a very good game. I would really like to see them use him more consistently but it still comes in random spurts. Stotts is part of that as well.

 

[Eastoff]

Just want to point out that benches are usually worse on the road. So that also means the other teams bench usually plays better at home. Yeah the bench hasn't been very good, but when you're playing on the road you basically just need your bench to play solid enough basketball that it doesn't lead to losses. You need them to take up minutes so guys can stay rested. While they haven't shot well, Hood, Curry or Layman they've kept them in games and haven't had any epic meltdowns. I think that's about all you can hope for at this point.

I've never heard this before. Interesting

 

[oldmangrouch]

SSDD.

Neither bench was all that impressive last night.

 

[wizenheimer]

Yes, I have heard your argument. I believe the issue has always been the complementary players. Nurk's emergence this year makes the size of our guards less important. We have better depth with Kanter and Hood. And Layman has really stepped up his game. The playoffs are always a crap shoot, but I believe we're much better equipped to win in the postseason this season.

I don't know about being "much better", I think that's a stretch.

But they could be a little better equipped, and tiny edges can make a big difference in a game, and one game can turn a series. Not every playoff team will have a Holiday and Rondo to shut down Dame while AD jumps every screen and pick. That's a start right there. Nurkic has been quite a bit better this season. if he can carry that thru to the playoffs, that changes things for Portland. But that's not guaranteed

last year, Harkless was hurt. If he's healthy, there's a little edge. Layman can be a wild-card for Portland. Kanter might help maintain bench scoring but I worry about his playoff defense; historically, his minutes have been cut way back in the playoffs

but I just don't think Hood-Curry-Turner can change the trajectory of a playoff series

 

[Wizard Mentor]

The world has gone haywire. I'm usually the positive outlook guy to the overall pessimism of the boards.

However, this time I'm agreeing with the OP. Sure, the negative +/- against Boston isn't a big deal. However,
in aggregate, it's huge: we've had a bench negative +/- in ALL FOUR GAMES that Kanter has played. I'm
not blaming Kanter, but this "deep team" that supposedly got deeper has a bench that is getting routinely
outscored. That's troublesome. Lillard and Nurk are having to work too hard. It does not bode well
for the playoffs.

#OptimisticButStillConcerned

 

[BBert]

This thread has aged well.

Too bad the posters haven't.

 

[JoshuaHall]

There are some things Dame+CJ do very well. But perform well in the Playoffs together is not one of them. So yes, for some time I have been an advocate of getting someone to go with Dame who is a better fit all around for the team while they might not be as good of a one-on-one scorer. Also, they are fighting against a historical hill. In the history of the NBA, I can't find 2 ball dominant, smallish guards who don't play defense very well that have had much success. The closest to me is Curry/Ellis and while that was a fun, exciting, scoring duo, they accomplished nothing in the post-season.

Thomas/Dumars is also close in size but Dumars was an All-NBA defender which is something neither Dame or CJ come close to.

I like them both individually both as people and as players, but as a duo, it creates some gaping holes and I also believe, keeps the team from developing a rhythm at times. I would love to be proven wrong, but since CJ became the starting PG, the Blazers are 5-14 in the Playoffs. For as much as they are paid and the percentage of shots they take and the style they play with, that just doesn't seem to be a recipe for success. Yes they need better pieces around them but no matter who is around them, they are still taking a majority of the shots in an often efficient manner.

It's been 4 years. The sample size for me is over.

Don’t entirely disagree. I think they’ve both made strides as defenders... and I think it’s unlikely they are a “winning combo”, but...

I’d rather give them a chance with a decent coach that can, ya know, get them open looks and buy them a least a bit of breathing room in the playoffs. Or make adjustments. Or change rotations. Or slightly change schemes to add a little unexpected flavor.

I’d rather cast aside Stotts than break up Dame and CJ before knowing what they’re capable of under different guidance.

Now, if we had Greg Popovich... yeah, I’d be alllll for the sample size argument.

 

[blue9]

I’d rather cast aside Stotts than break up Dame and CJ before knowing what they’re capable of under different guidance.

EXACTLY.
I fully understand the concerns people have with a Dame/CJ pairing. I have those concerns too. But I absolutely would not want to toss CJ aside until we see them play together under a better coach. Personally I no longer see Dame as a negative defender. So that just leaves CJ and surely we can hide one poor defender. Tony Parker wasn't exactly known for his defense and yet he won Finals MVP.
Blaming our issues on CJ is idiotic, IMO. We have MUCH bigger problems - namely coaching and PF. Start there, and if CJ is the weak link after those fixes then make a move.