OT Fear & Loathing in the post Trump times

[stampedehero]

Express Yourself

 

[stampedehero]

 

[stampedehero]

 

[Cugel]

Let's put it this way, I am prepared to leave the US in the event of a civil war. This country is completely fucked because of no education reform and organised religion.

The US has to be one of the dumbest first world countries if you look at who the elected officials are. My family would vote for a pedophile who found religion over a pro choice candidate, no question. Not hyperbole.

 

[Natebishop3]

Let's put it this way, I am prepared to leave the US in the event of a civil war. This country is completely fucked because of no education reform and organised religion.

The US has to be one of the dumbest first world countries if you look at who the elected officials are. My family would vote for a pedophile who found religion over a pro choice candidate, no question. Not hyperbole.

This is true. But on the flip side people voted for John Kitzhaber while he was actively under investigation and had to immediately step down after winning the election rather than vote for a Republican. The lines are drawn in steel and nobody is willing to cross party lines no matter what. In fact, I think the 2016 election shows that people would rather just not vote at all rather than vote for the other party if they don’t like the candidate.

 

[UncleCliffy'sDaddy]

This is true. But on the flip side people voted for John Kitzhaber while he was actively under investigation and had to immediately step down after winning the election rather than vote for a Republican. The lines are drawn in steel and nobody is willing to cross party lines no matter what. In fact, I think the 2016 election shows that people would rather just not vote at all rather than vote for the other party if they don’t like the candidate.

Unfortunately, it seems like the people who actually have a conscience are the ones who choose not to vote, rather than vote for a candidate they can’t get behind. The people with no conscience seem to gleefully pull the lever for any candidate who will cause the most damage……

 

[Phatguysrule]

Unfortunately, it seems like the people who actually have a conscience are the ones who choose not to vote, rather than vote for a candidate they can’t get behind. The people with no conscience seem to gleefully pull the lever for any candidate who will cause the most damage……

This is the way the system is designed.

Convince thinking people not to vote and the rest are easier to control.

 

[riverman]

I needed a poll option for the Republicans can no longer be trusted to represent the Constitution or democracy....because they can't. The democrats need new younger leadership and both parties need term limits....we need more than two parties competing for office...it's time for a new political landscape.....I also think I'd like leaders who are not eligible for social security already....the job takes more energy than any 70+ year old has to spare......elections from start to end should last 6 weeks tops....not 18 months to two years like they drag out here. We're the only country with such long drawn out election campaigns and it's purely a money grab. Until the GOP holds it's own accountable by majority vote....they have nothing to add to American greatness. I'm tired of voting against candidates and am ready to vote for someone again. I love the land in America but if the republican white privilege authoritarian movement wins again...I'll rethink everything...now I feel I live amongst a fairly unhealthy society that is on the edge of rage too often....if Trump can win an election here....nobody is safe. It may be time for this country to do what the former USSR did and split into smaller countries. I have nothing in common with politics in Florida or Texas. None of this makes me happy at all.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

 

[andalusian]

I needed a poll option for the Republicans can no longer be trusted to represent the Constitution or democracy....because they can't.

Yup

The democrats need new younger leadership and both parties need term limits....

Yup

we need more than two parties competing for office...

Will not make any meaningful difference imho. This is going to cause more division and let cult groups codify their power. At the end of the day, it is just a vertical vs. horizontal selection process. They all result in the same set. It is not a real problem imho - and does not magically solve anything as we have seen in the past in places like Italy or Israel.

I also think I'd like leaders who are not eligible for social security already....the job takes more energy than any 70+ year old has to spare......

This is ageism frankly. Candidates should be evaluated on their merit. I would rather not put any more artificial exclusions.

elections from start to end should last 6 weeks tops....not 18 months to two years like they drag out here.

Not sure 6 weeks is really enough - but I agree that 18-24 months is too long. 3 - 6 months would be much better.

We're the only country with such long drawn out election campaigns and it's purely a money grab. Until the GOP holds it's own accountable by majority vote....they have nothing to add to American greatness. I'm tired of voting against candidates and am ready to vote for someone again. I love the land in America but if the republican white privilege authoritarian movement wins again...I'll rethink everything...now I feel I live amongst a fairly unhealthy society that is on the edge of rage too often....if Trump can win an election here....nobody is safe.

Well, this is the biggest problem in a crux. Land is more important than people because of 18th century thinking. The electoral college and Senate construction are the biggest systematic problem in the US democracy. The elections are not really about "We the people", it is about "We the land representatives".

The secondary problem is costs and campaign financing.

 

[riverman]

Yup



Yup



Will not make any meaningful difference imho. This is going to cause more division and let cult groups codify their power. At the end of the day, it is just a vertical vs. horizontal selection process. They all result in the same set. It is not a real problem imho - and does not magically solve anything as we have seen in the past in places like Italy or Israel.



This is ageism frankly. Candidates should be evaluated on their merit. I would rather not put any more artificial exclusions.



Not sure 6 weeks is really enough - but I agree that 18-24 months is too long. 3 - 6 months would be much better.



Well, this is the biggest problem in a crux. Land is more important than people because of 18th century thinking. The electoral college and Senate construction are the biggest systematic problem in the US democracy. The elections are not really about "We the people", it is about "We the land representatives".

The secondary problem is costs and campaign financing.

I'm a senior citizen so speaking about people my age being to be a world leader with the pressure and losing sleep, etc....is a young person's arena....I'm speaking from experience....I love elderly people so it's not a slight upon my generation...it's my observation that old folks need sleep and should be enjoying senior years without the pressure cooker of political responsibility.....in essence I agree that merits are important for the job....having a body that can function well at 3 am during a disaster call is part of that merit in my view...there are physical constraints to being my age...you can't join the military at 70 plus years of age either because of those same constraints. I'm going to assume you're not retirement age but I'm speaking from that age now. I wouldn't want the Blazers to sign Scott Brooks to play point guard either....but that to me is not ageism....it's common sense

 

[stampedehero]

Unfortunately, it seems like the people who actually have a conscience are the ones who choose not to vote, rather than vote for a candidate they can’t get behind. The people with no conscience seem to gleefully pull the lever for any candidate who will cause the most damage……

Then you get that old argument that "It's a wasted vote or Vote as your life depended upon it.

 

[stampedehero]

I'm a senior citizen so speaking about people my age being to be a world leader with the pressure and losing sleep, etc....is a young person's arena....I'm speaking from experience....I love elderly people so it's not a slight upon my generation...it's my observation that old folks need sleep and should be enjoying senior years without the pressure cooker of political responsibility.....in essence I agree that merits are important for the job....having a body that can function well at 3 am during a disaster call is part of that merit in my view...there are physical constraints to being my age...you can't join the military at 70 plus years of age either because of those same constraints. I'm going to assume you're not retirement age but I'm speaking from that age now.

Old Dudes are Good Dudes........... In Politics, I prefer younger candidates.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Demand more from the political party that you support. The lesser of two evils argument is dumb.

 

[riverman]

Demand more from the political party that you support. The lesser of two evils argument is dumb.

If the party you support has no seat in the campaign debates or air time in the media.....the two evils nullify that party. Voting for Gary Johnson against Hillary and Trump didn't end well for me even if I felt he would have made the best candidate......last election I couldn't bring myself to do that because.....the vote required the lesser of two evils whether it's dumb or not...at least it helped boot Trump and I can live with that choice

 

[stampedehero]

I needed a poll option for the Republicans can no longer be trusted to represent the Constitution or democracy....because they can't. The democrats need new younger leadership and both parties need term limits....we need more than two parties competing for office...it's time for a new political landscape.....I also think I'd like leaders who are not eligible for social security already....the job takes more energy than any 70+ year old has to spare......elections from start to end should last 6 weeks tops....not 18 months to two years like they drag out here. We're the only country with such long drawn out election campaigns and it's purely a money grab. Until the GOP holds it's own accountable by majority vote....they have nothing to add to American greatness. I'm tired of voting against candidates and am ready to vote for someone again. I love the land in America but if the republican white privilege authoritarian movement wins again...I'll rethink everything...now I feel I live amongst a fairly unhealthy society that is on the edge of rage too often....if Trump can win an election here....nobody is safe. It may be time for this country to do what the former USSR did and split into smaller countries. I have nothing in common with politics in Florida or Texas. None of this makes me happy at all.

You have it!

 

[Pinwheel1]

We definitely need more than two options. Politics should not be like sports. Being a die-hard sports fan for our team, and hating every other team is what we do, and we enjoy it.

But why do we do this with politics? I don't think it is wise to be a die-hard fan of any one party. We can certainly lean one way or the other, but why register with either party? Make them work for all our votes. Personally, I believe we can be more objective, and not take everything so personally, if we separated ourselves from a political party. We need to be able to call our leaders out, but we tend to be silent when it is "our team" doing something stupid.

I call it the Kobe syndrome. If you are a Laker fan he was a god. If not......he was a rapist. The extremes are off the charts and you can't really change anyone's mind.

Most politicians will tout the party line no matter what just to stay in power.....whether they believe what they are saying or not. If their party is in power "everything is great" If their party is not in power then we have become the worst country in the world. Count how many times a Nazi Germany comparison comes up during elections. It is so fucking annoying to watch the hypocrisy of both parties.

"Meet the new boss, same as the old boss". Yet we continue to be fooled again.

 

[stampedehero]

 

[Phatguysrule]

Demand more from the political party that you support. The lesser of two evils argument is dumb.

What if I have trouble supporting either party? I hate more about both than I like about either. My solution has been to vote 3rd party for the candidate who I agree the most with. At least then my vote is going on record and they can see what I supported.

But I was terrified to do that in the last presidential election. I really don't like Biden, and never did. He's done pretty much exactly what I thought he (or frankly, Hillary before him) would do. He's making the swing democrats apathetic, and will now give power back to republicans. But I had to vote for Biden. I couldn't in good conscience vote for a 3rd party for fear of our country literally being destroyed by extreme ignorance and greed.

That's the only time I've ever used the "lesser of two evils" method. It sucked. But it literally felt necessary.

 

[stampedehero]

What if I have trouble supporting either party? I hate more about both than I like about either. My solution has been to vote 3rd party for the candidate who I agree the most with. At least then my vote is going on record and they can see what I supported.

But I was terrified to do that in the last presidential election. I really don't like Biden, and never did. He's done pretty much exactly what I thought he (or frankly, Hillary before him) would do. He's making the swing democrats apathetic, and will now give power back to republicans. But I had to vote for Biden. I couldn't in good conscience vote for a 3rd party for fear of our country literally being destroyed by extreme ignorance and greed.

That's the only time I've ever used the "lesser of two evils" method. It sucked. But it literally felt necessary.

I also voted for the lesser of two evils in '16 and '20. I am interested in what the Libertarians' point of view, at this time .

 

[stampedehero]

Demand more from the political party that you support. The lesser of two evils argument is dumb.

We may demand more, but isn't that futile for the general public, considering the actions of the party are based on majority and campaign dollar rule. We are just "ants on a plate".

 

[riverman]

I also voted for the lesser of two evils in '16 and '20. I am interested in what the Libertarians' point of view, at this time .

I'm not affiliating myself with a party anymore...I'll vote for the person I feel is the best choice when possible but as of today, I'll probably never vote for a Republican in my lifetime...lost trust and lack of integrity abound in that party...the fact that they still haven't distanced themselves from the Big Lie is the clincher. Biden was my last choice amongst the dem candidates but hey...sometimes you have to put on the grass skirt and eat the bowl of worms or get voted off the island!

 

[stampedehero]

I'm not affiliating myself with a party anymore...I'll vote for the person I feel is the best choice when possible but as of today, I'll probably never vote for a Republican in my lifetime...lost trust and lack of integrity abound in that party...the fact that they still haven't distanced themselves from the Big Lie is the clincher.

 

[ABM]

I'll vote for the person I feel is the best choice when possible but as of today, I'll probably never vote for a Democrat in my lifetime...lost trust and lack of integrity abound in that party...the fact that they still haven't distanced themselves from the Swamp is the clincher.

 

[noknobs]

I'll probably never vote for a Democrat in my lifetime...lost trust and lack of integrity abound in that party...

lol

 

[Pinwheel1]

80 % of what the Libertarians stand for...... I agree with. But much like with the Democrats and Republicans, there is always something in the other 20% of their platform, that I just can't get on board with. I have voted for them a couple of times since 1980 solely for the purpose of supporting any 3rd party. I live in CA so my vote on a presidential election is useless. This state goes blue no matter what.

 

[UncleCliffy'sDaddy]

I'll vote for the person I feel is the best choice when possible but as of today, I'll probably never vote for a Democrat in my lifetime...lost trust and lack of integrity abound in that party...the fact that they still haven't distanced themselves from the Swamp is the clincher.

Ooooohh, good one! I always admire an original thinker……….

 

[Shaboid]

Having lived in both a Democratic stronghold state and a swing state, I absolutely prefer the former. Florida between 2018 and 2020 was an absolute nuthouse, wild that's it's only gotten more crazy since I left.

 

[ABM]

Ooooohh, good one! I always admire an original thinker……….

DC is interchangeable either way

 

[riverman]

DC is interchangeable either way

Jan 6th...hardly the same either way...your party challenged a fair election, incited a mob and people died on capitol hill over it....that guilt is on one party and one party only...accountability is your only choice if you cherish equality and justice and integrity...that MAGA army is the swamp...pointy hats, snake dancing and talking in tongues swamp