FINDING A PF: Number 1 offseason priority

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Portland really needs a backup center so we never have to see Ed Davis or Meyers Leonard try to play center again.
 
GDiama said:
While I agree that he is better than this year's Davis-who was really garbage this year, I don't think he is much better than last year's Davis which still isn't really enough. There are many great per 36 guys but there is a reason teams are not trusting them with bigger roles. Per36 stats can be deceiving and for guys like KOQ they mostly come playing against reserves. Such examples are Henson, B.Wright etc.

Of course he is more versatile than these, he is better, but still I don't think he is good enough. I'm really not sure if I'd give up Vonleh (although he seems a lost bet) for him. He won't make any real difference and I'm sure even if Vonleh doesn't become really valuable he can easily be as good as KOQ in 2 years.

And from all these guys I'd still prefer Aminu who I think would be better to back up the 4 if we find our future PF in this draft and he is locked in a friendly contract for 2 more years. KOQ would be just a one year player as I believe he will reject his player option summer of 2018 and then we will not have any cap space to sign him back or if we do it can cost more than Aminu.
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I view O'Quinn as a one year filler while we develop our PF of the Future. If we like him and he opts out after 2017-18, we would have leg up on re-signing him of we can move one, or two of our bloated contracts. The reason he doesn't get more minutes in NY is because he has Prozingas and now Henangomez ahead of him. They have their PF of the Future and we don't.

I never suggested we give up Vonleh to get O'Quinn (I suggested the CLE pick + Ezeli's non-guaranteed contract for O'Quinn + filler). We've seen improvement in Vonleh since Nurkic has arrived. I think O'Quinn would be another player that could push Vonleh and help him improve.

O'Quinn can back up the 5, and do it well. Aminu can't. Unless you think Meyers Leonard can morph into a solid back up center, then that's another need to be addressed. O'Quinn is better than any PF we currently have on the roster and he's also better than any back up center we have. He's limited, but efficient, offensively (hence the 2015-16 Ed Davis comparison), but an absolute beast defensively and an elite rim protector (hence the healthy Festus Ezeli comparsion). He addresses multiple needs, is cheap and was supposedly available at the trade deadline.

The title of this thread isn't "FINDING Our PF of the Future: Number 1 offseason priority", it's "FINDING A PF: Number 1 offseason priority". That's why I brought up O'Quinn.

BNM
 
Blazinaway said:
he's an RFA I believe which puts him out of reach unless we trade
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Yes but it seems like the Celtics are maybe not giving him enough credit, I don't think he's starting for them. But I guess you're right, they have a good enough coach/front-office to appreciate what they have in him
 
I think Olshey will pick up two SF/PF draft picks and play one, package the other. Miles Bridges from Michigan State 16ppg, 8 reb and .481 FG%. Johnathan Motley from Baylor 17ppg ,9 reb ,.490 FG%
 
I wish Markkanen could do anything basketball related in addition to his elite shooting skills. He would make a great PF on this roster. Remove his shooting, and he makes Meyers Leonard look good.

Markkanen is probably the best shooter in the draft at any position. But he is a 7’er that can not defend his grandmother or block a shot. We drafted that exact same PF, (but 6’ 9”) a few years ago, Luke Babbitt.

Markkanen is not a starting caliber NBA PF, he is a one trick pony. And when his shot is not falling, he will lose you games. He could be a spark plug off of the bench, but that is his ceiling. When I hear he maybe the next Dirk and DX has him going #7, it makes me wonder at how overrated the rest of this draft is. This draft is very weak in bigs. Look elsewhere for our PF help.

Disclaimer:
My draft predictions/opinions are 100% wrong about 50% the time, which is still better than most GMs & expert mock draft makers.
 
When you can upgrade your team with a better player you try to do it but we don't know how Olshey feel about these guys.
 
I don't know that Philly will trade Saric. Covington could be had for relatively cheap. I was talking up Marvin Williams this summer. He would fit really well next to Nurkic. I'd love to be able to trade for him. Not sure what the Hornets would ask for in return. Ibaka of course would be awesome, but hes not going to be cheap this summer and the Blazers won't be able to afford him. Kyle O'Quinn really? Wouldn't touch either of the Morris twins with a ten foot poll. Not no, but hell no on Randle. Amir Johnson would be good alongside Nurk. I have always liked Olynyk, but isn't he more of a center? He would be a good choice for backup center, as well would Larry Sanders. We have picks to make a trade happen. Hopefully Olshey can trick someone into taking Leonard. We could also just draft some new prospect or keep our faith in Vonleh who has begun to come out of his shell, though either of those options would not accelerate our timetable. Dame and Cj aren't getting younger, There is a window Olshey is going to have to jump through sooner or later before it closes.
 
oldfisherman said:
I wish Markkanen could do anything basketball related in addition to his elite shooting skills. He would make a great PF on this roster. Remove his shooting, and he makes Meyers Leonard look good.

Markkanen is probably the best shooter in the draft at any position. But he is a 7’er that can not defend his grandmother or block a shot. We drafted that exact same PF, (but 6’ 9”) a few years ago, Luke Babbitt.

Markkanen is not a starting caliber NBA PF, he is a one trick pony. And when his shot is not falling, he will lose you games. He could be a spark plug off of the bench, but that is his ceiling. When I hear he maybe the next Dirk and DX has him going #7, it makes me wonder at how overrated the rest of this draft is. This draft is very weak in bigs. Look elsewhere for our PF help.

Disclaimer:
My draft predictions/opinions are 100% wrong about 50% the time, which is still better than most GMs & expert mock draft makers.
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Markkanen to me is another Channing frye. He'll be a solid big that spaces the court but I doubt he's ever going to be a center piece of a team like porzingis. Not someone I'd draft in the top 12. Hartenstein is the better bet imo.
 
Chris Craig said:
I don't know that Philly will trade Saric. Covington could be had for relatively cheap. I was talking up Marvin Williams this summer. He would fit really well next to Nurkic. I'd love to be able to trade for him. Not sure what the Hornets would ask for in return. Ibaka of course would be awesome, but hes not going to be cheap this summer and the Blazers won't be able to afford him. Kyle O'Quinn really? Wouldn't touch either of the Morris twins with a ten foot poll. Not no, but hell no on Randle. Amir Johnson would be good alongside Nurk. I have always liked Olynyk, but isn't he more of a center? He would be a good choice for backup center, as well would Larry Sanders. We have picks to make a trade happen. Hopefully Olshey can trick someone into taking Leonard. We could also just draft some new prospect or keep our faith in Vonleh who has begun to come out of his shell, though either of those options would not accelerate our timetable. Dame and Cj aren't getting younger, There is a window Olshey is going to have to jump through sooner or later before it closes.
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Amir Jonson over Kyle O'Quinn??? No way. Johnson is three years older and a below average rebounder for his position (12.8 TRB%). He is currently making over 3x as much as O'Quinn and will be a UFA this summer.

In addition to being 3 years younger, O'Quinn is an elite level rebounder (19.4 TRB%) and an elite rim protector (6.8 BLK%) and a better passer (14.8 AST%). He's bigger and stronger, on a cheap contract and locked up for an additional season.

Here's how they compare. Tell me why, exactly you prefer Johnson. Yes, he does make an occasional 3, but it's less than once every 3 games. He's not exactly a floor spacer.

If we just want a 6'9" guy who can hit an occasional 3-pointer, we should just keep Aminu. He's also 3 years younger than Amir Johnson, hits 3x as many 3-pointers, is a better rebounder, a better defender and locked up on a very reasonable contract for two more years - his contract actually goes down over the next two seasons.

Ask yourself this, would you be willing to pay serious luxury tax penalties for Amir Johnson for the length of his contract, including repeater penalties? Because that's what it would take to sign him. O'Quinn and Aminu are both younger and cheaper and locked up longer. O'Quinn is way better and Aminu is a better fit.

BNM
 
Scalma said:
Markkanen to me is another Channing frye. He'll be a solid big that spaces the court but I doubt he's ever going to be a center piece of a team like porzingis. Not someone I'd draft in the top 12. Hartenstein is the better bet imo.
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I assume you mean post injury Channing Frye, because before his injury, he was a fucking stud. He didn't really add the 3-pointer until after he left the Blazers and went to PHO (he made a total of 20 three pointers in his first 4 seasons, an average of 5 per season).

Go back and watch some video from his rookie year, before his injury. You will be amazed. I promise. If not for the injury, he probably would have finished 2nd in ROY voting to CP3. He was that good.

BNM
 
Amir Johnson is not the answer and neither is Channing Frye. We need someone who's really great
 
my guess is Vonleh will continue to start next season, and then we will draft someone to push him (the only way I see another scenario is if we shed Crabbes salary.) I'm already expecting Leonard to be traded. I see Davis as a mid season dump if he shows he's healthy. So the way I see it, we'll be drafting at least 2 bigs. How about a Hartenstein, Patton haul?
 
Scalma said:
my guess is Vonleh will continue to start next season, and then we will draft someone to push him (the only way I see another scenario is if we shed Crabbes salary.) I'm already expecting Leonard to be traded. I see Davis as a mid season dump if he shows he's healthy. So the way I see it, we'll be drafting at least 2 bigs. How about a Hartenstein, Patton haul?
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What about a Bam and Rabb haul? That would still likely leave us with the Cleveland pick to take a Crabbe replacement (for the future).
 
BlazerDuckSeahawkFan94 said:
What about a Bam and Rabb haul? That would still likely leave us with the Cleveland pick to take a Crabbe replacement (for the future).
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I don't really like either for us. Bam has a better chance to make it, but is too similar to Vonleh and Rabb has some serious issues guarding space/pnr and doesn't look like he'll be strong enough to hold up at 5. Doesn't have much stretch potential either.

I've said it already, but our "pf of the future" is probably not in this draft. The only guy that projects to be a down the road starter at PF is Jonathan Isaac, but that's like 4+ years from now after he bulks up and is probably out of our reach if we are being realistic. Miles Bridges could be one too, but he'd be the smallest (by height/wingspan) 4 in the NBA, but just might have the strength+athleticism combo to make it work defensively.

Outside of those 2, you've got a boom or bust type in Isaiah Hartenstein and some will throw Williams and Giles in this mix, but they are 90-95% likely to be straight 5's in today's NBA.

Then you've got Leaf and Lydon who's likely upside is situational stretch PF's who are negatives defensively and aren't dynamic enough scorers to make up for it.

John Collins is probably the wild card in this group. Has a nice strength/atheticism/coordination combination that should work at the PF position, but he plays like a center offensively and doesn't play much defense so I struggle to see how becomes a starter unless he develops more of a face-up game+shoots 3's.
 
JDC said:
I don't really like either for us. Bam has a better chance to make it, but is too similar to Vonleh and Rabb has some serious issues guarding space/pnr and doesn't look like he'll be strong enough to hold up at 5. Doesn't have much stretch potential either.

I've said it already, but our "pf of the future" is probably not in this draft. The only guy that projects to be a down the road starter at PF is Jonathan Isaac, but that's like 4+ years from now after he bulks up and is probably out of our reach if we are being realistic. Miles Bridges could be one too, but he'd be the smallest (by height/wingspan) 4 in the NBA, but just might have the strength+athleticism combo to make it work defensively.

Outside of those 2, you've got a boom or bust type in Isaiah Hartenstein and some will throw Williams and Giles in this mix, but they are 90-95% likely to be straight 5's in today's NBA.

Then you've got Leaf and Lydon who's likely upside is situational stretch PF's who are negatives defensively and aren't dynamic enough scorers to make up for it.

John Collins is probably the wild card in this group. Has a nice strength/atheticism/coordination combination that should work at the PF position, but he plays like a center offensively and doesn't play much defense so I struggle to see how becomes a starter unless he develops more of a face-up game+shoots 3's.
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Caleb Swanigan.
He's the guy.

Terrific rebounder. Very good shot. Very good passer for his position. Body is very similar to Vonleh... but I think Caleb has a little quicker twitch & has it between the ears better.
 
Honestly I think the front court could be okay. It may be far too optimistic, but I think a four man rotation of the following would be alright:

Vonleh/Nurkic (starters)
Davis (sans 10 pounds and able to guard the 4)/Leonard

You know what I like about it, all 4 should be able to set nasty screens. And that was the thing I hated most about Plumlee's game. Now Leonard doesn't do it well all the time yet, but that should be the key to the guy staying in the league. Dame/CJ could be great running their defenders into him out on the three point line, and how many teams have that luxury? Ed is a great offensive rebounder so the pairing would be alright.

I really think the piece that's missing is a elite perimeter defender who can space the floor on offense, and if there was any way to get a guy like Avery Bradley, I think that's the ticket. Really, I know it doesn't work contract wise, but theoretically if you had an Avery Bradley type and Crabbe/Aminu were out, then Harkless/Turner could guard the big swingmen instead of chasing guys on the perimeter. This rotation would be nice IMO.

Lillard/Bradley
McCollum/Bradley
Harkless/Turner
Vonleh/Leonard
Nurkic/Davis

Obviously you want to fill it out with vets and young guys, but it sure looks balanced to me IF (and big if) Vonleh and Leonard get serviceable and dependable.
 
I think Faried would be a good PF on this team. He'd be a rich-man's Noah Vonleh. I wonder if we could pry him away from Denver for Leonard and one of our 1st round picks?
 
dviss1 said:
Those 2 players are literally nothing alike.
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Not true, they have a similar skillset, build, and athletic ability. Faried just has a bigger motor and is a better finisher than Noah. Actually, probably everyone in the league is a better finisher than Noah.
 
Sinobas said:
I think Faried would be a good PF on this team. He'd be a rich-man's Noah Vonleh. I wonder if we could pry him away from Denver for Leonard and one of our 1st round picks?
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Faried is way too limited offensively IMO to make sense for POR, especially his mid-long range shooting
 
Sinobas said:
Not true, they have a similar skillset, build, and athletic ability. Faried just has a bigger motor and is a better finisher than Noah. Actually, probably everyone in the league is a better finisher than Noah.
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No they don't.

Athleticism: faried is a superior athlete and much more explosive.

Skill set: Vonleh can post up and shoot. Faried does neither. Faried plays above the rim, Vonleh plays below it.
 
Scalma said:
No they don't.

Athleticism: faried is a superior athlete and much more explosive.

Skill set: Vonleh can post up and shoot. Faried does neither. Faried plays above the rim, Vonleh plays below it.
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Vonleh is a good athlete, he just plays too passively. He has a 37 inch vertical and a 31 inch no step vert, both of which are better than Faried. Their 3/4 court sprint and lane agility tests were identical.

As far as shooting, Faried is a better mid range shooter at this point by a long shot. He hits 42% of his mid range shots from 10-16 this year and Vonleh is actually shooting a dismal 13%, though I think he is capable of being much better in that catagory, he is certainly a better 3pt shooter than Faried.
 
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