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BlazerCaravan

Hug a Bigot... to Death
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We have three starters above 20 PER.

This is a big deal; most championship caliber teams have three starters at 20+ per, with one at about 24 or higher. Right now, Dame is sitting at 23.7 for the season but since Nurkic has come along, he's been much much better. CJ as well.

We don't have the bench of a champion but we are seeing something start to coalesce. It's very exciting and the stats are bearing that out.
 
We have three starters above 20 PER.

This is a big deal; most championship caliber teams have three starters at 20+ per, with one at about 24 or higher. Right now, Dame is sitting at 23.7 for the season but since Nurkic has come along, he's been much much better. CJ as well.

We don't have the bench of a champion but we are seeing something start to coalesce. It's very exciting and the stats are bearing that out.
3 first round picks can really bolster the bench
 
I personally don't think we use them (maybe we keep one?); I think we use them to sweeten trades of our bench pieces to others for more talented vets.

I don't know, I'm not sure trading young assets under cheap, long term control for a couple quick fixes is the right move. I do agree we need more vets however.
 
We have three starters above 20 PER.

This is a big deal; most championship caliber teams have three starters at 20+ per, with one at about 24 or higher. Right now, Dame is sitting at 23.7 for the season but since Nurkic has come along, he's been much much better. CJ as well.

We don't have the bench of a champion but we are seeing something start to coalesce. It's very exciting and the stats are bearing that out.

Our Bench is paid too much, obviously, but the players I think are not as bad as some.
We have Crabbe, Aminu and Turner as our core bench and honestly that isn't too bad. One has been a starter over half his career and the other two are fringe starters on some teams. Add Davis as a backup big and I think it is above average.
With that said, I think we need to dump a salary or two and use our picks to try to really nail a solid back up center and back up SG or SF (Crabbe would fill the other spot) with great D.
 
I personally don't think we use them (maybe we keep one?); I think we use them to sweeten trades of our bench pieces to others for more talented vets.

Are you talking about bench players with large contracts? If this is the case then I am not sold that a mid-late first round draft pick is going to be the deal maker. IMO either they are going to want the player or not. (ET or Crabbe) Not sure the Memphis or Cleveland pick is enough of a incentive.

Same with the next tier (Harkless or Leonard) I say this because they all have 3 years left on their contracts. One year would be a different story.

But if you are talking Aminu or Davis you may be right. Both are decent players with good contracts. A pick could be the difference.
 
I don't know, I'm not sure trading young assets under cheap, long term control for a couple quick fixes is the right move. I do agree we need more vets however.
Agreed. We need to continue to develop one more season in the hopes of getting a couple good vets to sign for the Vet Min or MLE next summer. Trading for vets on large contracts is a good way to make what we're building blow up in our faces. All of our money is going to be tied up in Dame, CJ, Crabbe/Turner, and Nurk...and maybe Vonleh (?). We can't afford to make a big time trade - we need to make use of Rookie salaries and Vet Min salaries.
 
Are you talking about bench players with large contracts? If this is the case then I am not sold that a mid-late first round draft pick is going to be the deal maker. IMO either they are going to want the player or not. (ET or Crabbe) Not sure the Memphis or Cleveland pick is enough of a incentive.

Same with the next tier (Harkless or Leonard) I say this because they all have 3 years left on their contracts. One year would be a different story.

But if you are talking Aminu or Davis you may be right. Both are decent players with good contracts. A pick could be the difference.
Yeah Aminu and Davis are definitely who I mean.... we got a good Aminu game but I'm not sure he thinks he's a bench guy. And Davis may never be the same.
 
Yeah Aminu and Davis are definitely who I mean.... we got a good Aminu game but I'm not sure he thinks he's a bench guy. And Davis may never be the same.
This summer I hope we trade both of them, plus Turner. If we can also send out Meyers thought would be the cherry on top.
 
For the first time in forever?
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You're trippin. Aminu plays well of the bench... Your hate for him is going a lil' too far.
Naw, I just don't like mediocre players without any upside. If you don't have any potential for improvement you better be damn good (Dame, CJ). And if you're mediocre you better have some potential upside (Vonleh). I don't see any point in wasting minutes on mediocre players that don't have any potential to become a lot better. Aminu and Ed are both mediocre players who have hit their ceilings.
 
I don't hate him except when he dribbles but I'm worried he'll want to start.

I think he has accepted that starting is not in his future. He certainly should anyways.

My biggest frustration with Aminu is when he takes the 3. Sure I realize he makes some big shots, but nonetheless.....in crunch time, when the game is on the line and you have Dame, CJ, and Nurk on the floor.......don't fucking shoot from deep. I love Terry but he gives everyone too much free reign to shoot when they are wide open. Players need to know their role.

Aminu did it again last night with 2 minutes left and Denver was making one last charge. I know a lot of you have a problem with Dame and CJ and their hero ball moments, but I still want my best offensive players taking the shots down the stretch. And now with Nurk in the mix, our 5th option on the floor should only shoot it when he has a high percentage shot.

Aminu can be good role player off the bench with some better instructions from the coach. I realize it is tough when they leave him wide open, but there is a reason why they do.
 
Naw, I just don't like mediocre players without any upside. If you don't have any potential for improvement you better be damn good (Dame, CJ). And if you're mediocre you better have some potential upside (Vonleh). I don't see any point in wasting minutes on mediocre players that don't have any potential to become a lot better. Aminu and Ed are both mediocre players who have hit their ceilings.

I disagree.
 
Not just that but I was reading on other forums and apparently, the Blazers are playing at a 60 win season pace since Nurkic arrived, having 14 wins and 5 losses.

Would've been more too if it weren't for that Washington game.
 
Are you talking about bench players with large contracts? If this is the case then I am not sold that a mid-late first round draft pick is going to be the deal maker. IMO either they are going to want the player or not. (ET or Crabbe) Not sure the Memphis or Cleveland pick is enough of a incentive.

Same with the next tier (Harkless or Leonard) I say this because they all have 3 years left on their contracts. One year would be a different story.

But if you are talking Aminu or Davis you may be right. Both are decent players with good contracts. A pick could be the difference.
I'm just going to debunk the notion that getting rid of these contracts will be hard.

Brooklyn would probably give their BOS pick for Crabbe, thinking that they could turn him into a 16ppg scorer on 45/40/90 shooting. They need anything they can get.

They'd also give an asset for Harkless, who is a local product (from Queens), and who's 23 with unfulfilled potential and who's $9M isn't a problem.

If we're really set on shedding salary, we could easily trade Harkless, Crabbe, and Leonard to Brooklyn for one of their first round picks (25th?) and a cheap player like Kilpatrick. This would be a great deal for them as they have way too much cap space and won't attract free agents in the next few years, because they can't improve their team via their own draft picks. And because they don't have their own draft picks is why they would jump at the chance to take on 2 young, proven players for a late pick. We really could trade away $36M and get a pick back by dealing with Brooklyn.

We could then turn around and trade a 1st, Turner, Davis, and Ezeli to Sacremento. Sacremento doesn't have their 2019 first (unprotected to Philadelphia) so we should trade our lottery protected 2019 first. They'll also have a shit ton of cap space with no power in the free agent market. Therefore, adding 2 rotation players to get a little better makes sense, even if those players are overpaid. Adding a pick in a year with which they have none makes sense for them as well. And since their trading nothing in return, it makes all the sense in the world for Divac. Sacremento is the best destination to offload Turner and Davis by just giving them a draft pick.

With that, we would've shed $62M or so in salary, and swap out our 2019 1st (which should be lower than 20 in a less-talented draft) for the 25th pick.
So with that, we'd probably have the 15th, 19th, 25th, and 26th picks.
So hypothetically, we could take Justin Jackson 15th, trade 19th and 26th for 16th and take Justin Patton, and take Caleb Swanigan 25th.

So we would have this lineup with $38M or so in capspace ($45M if we traded Aminu somewhere along the way).
We'd have 5 good young prospects in Nurkic, Vonleh, Patton, Swanigan, and Jackson, with tons of flexibility.


Lillard / McCollum
McCollum / Kilpatrick
Jackson / ?
Aminu / Vonleh / Swanigan
Nurkic / Patton

There will be ways to offload our contracts without giving up a higher amount of picks, because Brooklyn and Sacremento are in very weird positions.

That would put us into play for someone like Millsap, Ibaka, Hayward, or even Griffin (If Paul leaves, as Olshey did draft Griffin). It'd be unlikely that we'd land any of those, but we'd be in play with a more formidable appearing team than last year (since we have a core of 3 good players instead of 2).

But if not, it puts us into a position for a package of 2 to 3 of the following players:

Wings: Thabo Sefelosha, Tyreke Evans, Danilo Gallinari, JJ Redick, Tony Allen
Forwards: James Johnson, Ersan Ilyasova, Taj Gibson, Amir Johnson, Patrick Patterson, Zach Randolph
Centers: Mason Plumlee, Andrew Bogut, Kelly Olynyk

Our hands are not tied at all. We have flexibility. We can really do whatever we want to do this summer.
 
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We have three starters above 20 PER.

This is a big deal; most championship caliber teams have three starters at 20+ per, with one at about 24 or higher. Right now, Dame is sitting at 23.7 for the season but since Nurkic has come along, he's been much much better. CJ as well.

We don't have the bench of a champion but we are seeing something start to coalesce. It's very exciting and the stats are bearing that out.
First:::: Well written. I see Vonleh, Crabbe and Turner coming on & improving themselves due to the Nurk effect as is they were part of an equation. ohmlsawwheel.gif
 

I'm just going to debunk the notion that getting rid of these contracts will be hard.

I agree. I have been saying this since July. Certain teams will gladly take our players, but if they don't want them....a draft pick will NOT sway them.

Now if we were getting an excellent players back in return......then the picks might be an incentive.

I agree about the Nets. When is the date we can trade Crabbe to them? (if we want) Is it the 1 year anniversary of him signing the offer sheet? They need help
 
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I agree. I have been saying this since July. Certain teams will gladly take our players, but if they don't want them....a draft pick will NOT sway them.

Now if we were getting an excellent players back in return......then the picks might be an incentive.

I agree about the Nets. When is the date we can trade Crabbe to them? (if we want) Is it the 1 year anniversary of him signing the offer sheet? They need help
we'd likely get a verbal agreement with Brooklyn on a Crabbe trade before free agency started. This would allow us to come to verbal agreements with free agents that would become final once we were actually able to trade Crabbe.

I might have misunderstood your first post. I thought that you were saying that we needed to trade a first-round pick to get teams to take on those guys. But I definitely agree that if they don't want them in the first place a late first won't help
 
I'm just going to debunk the notion that getting rid of these contracts will be hard.

Brooklyn would probably give their BOS pick for Crabbe, thinking that they could turn him into a 16ppg scorer on 45/40/90 shooting. They need anything they can get.

They'd also give an asset for Harkless, who is a local product (from Queens), and who's 23 with unfulfilled potential and who's $9M isn't a problem.

If we're really set on shedding salary, we could easily trade Harkless, Crabbe, and Leonard to Brooklyn for one of their first round picks (25th?) and a cheap player like Kilpatrick. This would be a great deal for them as they have way too much cap space and won't attract free agents in the next few years, because they can't improve their team via their own draft picks. And because they don't have their own draft picks is why they would jump at the chance to take on 2 young, proven players for a late pick. We really could trade away $36M and get a pick back by dealing with Brooklyn.

We could then turn around and trade a 1st, Turner, Davis, and Ezeli to Sacremento. Sacremento doesn't have their 2019 first (unprotected to Philadelphia) so we should trade our lottery protected 2019 first. They'll also have a shit ton of cap space with no power in the free agent market. Therefore, adding 2 rotation players to get a little better makes sense, even if those players are overpaid. Adding a pick in a year with which they have none makes sense for them as well. And since their trading nothing in return, it makes all the sense in the world for Divac. Sacremento is the best destination to offload Turner and Davis by just giving them a draft pick.

With that, we would've shed $62M or so in salary, and swap out our 2019 1st (which should be lower than 20 in a less-talented draft) for the 25th pick.
So with that, we'd probably have the 15th, 19th, 25th, and 26th picks.
So hypothetically, we could take Justin Jackson 15th, trade 19th and 26th for 16th and take Justin Patton, and take Caleb Swanigan 25th.

So we would have this lineup with $38M or so in capspace ($45M if we traded Aminu somewhere along the way).
We'd have 5 good young prospects in Nurkic, Vonleh, Patton, Swanigan, and Jackson, with tons of flexibility.


Lillard / McCollum
McCollum / Kilpatrick
Jackson / ?
Aminu / Vonleh / Swanigan
Nurkic / Patton

There will be ways to offload our contracts without giving up a higher amount of picks, because Brooklyn and Sacremento are in very weird positions.

That would put us into play for someone like Millsap, Ibaka, Hayward, or even Griffin (If Paul leaves, as Olshey did draft Griffin). It'd be unlikely that we'd land any of those, but we'd be in play with a more formidable appearing team than last year (since we have a core of 3 good players instead of 2).

But if not, it puts us into a position for a package of 2 to 3 of the following players:

Wings: Thabo Sefelosha, Tyreke Evans, Danilo Gallinari, JJ Redick, Tony Allen
Forwards: James Johnson, Ersan Ilyasova, Taj Gibson, Amir Johnson, Patrick Patterson, Zach Randolph
Centers: Mason Plumlee, Andrew Bogut, Kelly Olynyk

Our hands are not tied at all. We have flexibility. We can really do whatever we want to do this summer.
You're delusional if you think these are realistic.

I'm not going to argue the point, but we'll see this summer just how tradeable Crabbe, Turner, & Meyers are.
 
You're delusional if you think these are realistic.

I'm not going to argue the point, but we'll see this summer just how tradeable Crabbe, Turner, & Meyers are.
LMAO.

The Nets wanted to give Crabbe that contract. They have all the cap in the world, so Leonard wouldn't matter much. They'd easily trade a pick for Harkless.

The Kings have some bad contracts, but still have some cap space to get rewarded for taking on contracts. They won't be able to sign anyone so getting Turner and a pick makes sense for them.

How am I delusional? I specifically brought up certain situations and many reasons why those guys will be tradeable. Instead of discussing anything in the most, you deviously came back with: "You're delusional, because they're not tradeable". You have no logic backing that up.

Crabbe is very tradeable. Harkless well be wanted. Those two are valuable enough that a team won't care about Meyers $9M. Then attach a pick with Turner. Simple. Why isn't that realistic?
 
One thing i'v been doing when approcahing if we can trade Turner ect is looking at there contracts and reducing it to the value of a contract in 2015 because I keep having to remind myself that these contracts are they way they are because of the inflated cap and I keep looking at it through the cap before it balooned,so if I can't keep myself from looking at ti through the lens of how we have veiwed contracts the last 5 years I need to readjust how I view them.
Turner 3/54m 17% of cap
Crabbe 3/56 17% of cap
Harkless 3/31 10% of cap
Meyers Leonard 3/31 10% of cap
103m is the projected cap

if we reduce these contracts to what they would be 2015 70m cap FA we get
Turner at 3/36
Crabbe 3/36
Harkless 3/21
Meyers 3/21
Heck even Woj said other teams have interested in Crabbe/Harkless/Meyers and it wouldn't' be hard at all to move them. Looking at the contracts through a different lens doesn't make me hate these contracts, although a lot of that might have to do with the fact they all drop down to 3 year deals. A lot of teams in the league would love to have a lights out shooter like Crabbe as their starting 2 guard, Harkless is 23 and shows flashes of huge potential on a contract that teams can easily talk themsleves into thinking he could end up being a steal, same for even Meyers since he shoots above average from the 3p line allows teams to talk themselves into him because of how 3p orientated the league has become. The only contract that doesn't seem easily moved would be Turner because he has a higher salary and teams aren't going to be begging us to take him off our hands because he is a bad 3p shooter and needs the ball in his hands and with how many good guards their are in the league every team has an above average guard who they want handling the ball.
There is no way you can convince me that Harkless/Crabbe are negative contracts, Meyers is but I don't think he is a such a horrible contract that we need to unload a 1st rounder to move him. Turner I think we would need to unload a 1st rounder to move.
 
I wish we were a 5th or 6th seed this year; facing Golden State will probably cut their playoff run shorter than it deserved to be.
They underachieved all year until Nurk arived. They also didn't play any defense until he got here. They don't "deserve" anything.
 

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