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As a Christian I am offended by the use of the word pride in this forum.

There, now use a generic word cause I bitched about it :)

Kidding. I find it sad we have to have special days and months for people. I think it further divides the citizens of the United States. I mean that as support.
 
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/25/san-francisco-gay-pride-corporate-orlando-shooting

Too straight, white and corporate: why some queer people are skipping SF Pride

Disaffected by the annual parade, members of San Francisco’s LGBT community are choosing alternative events to celebrate identity and solidarity with Orlando


San Francisco resident Katy Birnbaum is eager to gather with other queer people on Pride weekend, especially after such a violent attack against LGBT people in Orlando. But when roughly a million people pack into downtown on Sunday for one of the largest, most high-profile Pride parades in the world, Birnbaum won’t be standing in the crowd.

“It just feels like a big Miller Lite tent,” said Birnbaum, 31. “With the corporate floats … it’s co-opting queer identity as a way to make money.”

Instead of attending the formal SF Pride events on Sunday, Birnbaum will be going to an intimate LGBT film festival in a community space six miles south of city hall in an area known as the Bayview – one of the only remaining black neighborhoods in the city.

Birnbaum, who helped organize the all-day film event, is one of many LGBT people in the Bay Area who plans to skip the mainstream Pride festivities in the northern California city known internationally as a mecca for gay people.

While queer people said it’s important to come out on Pride as a way to stand up to the violence in Orlando and discriminatory laws across the country, some said the San Francisco parade has become too corporate, straight and white to feel like an appropriate setting to show LGBT solidarity.
 
Denny Crane said:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/25/san-francisco-gay-pride-corporate-orlando-shooting

Too straight, white and corporate: why some queer people are skipping SF Pride

Disaffected by the annual parade, members of San Francisco’s LGBT community are choosing alternative events to celebrate identity and solidarity with Orlando


San Francisco resident Katy Birnbaum is eager to gather with other queer people on Pride weekend, especially after such a violent attack against LGBT people in Orlando. But when roughly a million people pack into downtown on Sunday for one of the largest, most high-profile Pride parades in the world, Birnbaum won’t be standing in the crowd.

“It just feels like a big Miller Lite tent,” said Birnbaum, 31. “With the corporate floats … it’s co-opting queer identity as a way to make money.”

Instead of attending the formal SF Pride events on Sunday, Birnbaum will be going to an intimate LGBT film festival in a community space six miles south of city hall in an area known as the Bayview – one of the only remaining black neighborhoods in the city.

Birnbaum, who helped organize the all-day film event, is one of many LGBT people in the Bay Area who plans to skip the mainstream Pride festivities in the northern California city known internationally as a mecca for gay people.

While queer people said it’s important to come out on Pride as a way to stand up to the violence in Orlando and discriminatory laws across the country, some said the San Francisco parade has become too corporate, straight and white to feel like an appropriate setting to show LGBT solidarity.
Click to expand...
:huh::unsure:
 
Denny Crane said:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/25/san-francisco-gay-pride-corporate-orlando-shooting

Too straight, white and corporate: why some queer people are skipping SF Pride

Disaffected by the annual parade, members of San Francisco’s LGBT community are choosing alternative events to celebrate identity and solidarity with Orlando


San Francisco resident Katy Birnbaum is eager to gather with other queer people on Pride weekend, especially after such a violent attack against LGBT people in Orlando. But when roughly a million people pack into downtown on Sunday for one of the largest, most high-profile Pride parades in the world, Birnbaum won’t be standing in the crowd.

“It just feels like a big Miller Lite tent,” said Birnbaum, 31. “With the corporate floats … it’s co-opting queer identity as a way to make money.”

Instead of attending the formal SF Pride events on Sunday, Birnbaum will be going to an intimate LGBT film festival in a community space six miles south of city hall in an area known as the Bayview – one of the only remaining black neighborhoods in the city.

Birnbaum, who helped organize the all-day film event, is one of many LGBT people in the Bay Area who plans to skip the mainstream Pride festivities in the northern California city known internationally as a mecca for gay people.

While queer people said it’s important to come out on Pride as a way to stand up to the violence in Orlando and discriminatory laws across the country, some said the San Francisco parade has become too corporate, straight and white to feel like an appropriate setting to show LGBT solidarity.
Click to expand...

Translation: they are cracking down on public fucking
 
Denny Crane said:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jun/25/san-francisco-gay-pride-corporate-orlando-shooting

Too straight, white and corporate: why some queer people are skipping SF Pride

Disaffected by the annual parade, members of San Francisco’s LGBT community are choosing alternative events to celebrate identity and solidarity with Orlando


San Francisco resident Katy Birnbaum is eager to gather with other queer people on Pride weekend, especially after such a violent attack against LGBT people in Orlando. But when roughly a million people pack into downtown on Sunday for one of the largest, most high-profile Pride parades in the world, Birnbaum won’t be standing in the crowd.

“It just feels like a big Miller Lite tent,” said Birnbaum, 31. “With the corporate floats … it’s co-opting queer identity as a way to make money.”

Instead of attending the formal SF Pride events on Sunday, Birnbaum will be going to an intimate LGBT film festival in a community space six miles south of city hall in an area known as the Bayview – one of the only remaining black neighborhoods in the city.

Birnbaum, who helped organize the all-day film event, is one of many LGBT people in the Bay Area who plans to skip the mainstream Pride festivities in the northern California city known internationally as a mecca for gay people.

While queer people said it’s important to come out on Pride as a way to stand up to the violence in Orlando and discriminatory laws across the country, some said the San Francisco parade has become too corporate, straight and white to feel like an appropriate setting to show LGBT solidarity.
Click to expand...
Tl;dr we are go8ng to fight bigotry with bigotry! (No hetero) ew a straightgot get outta here straighty before we flick our wrists at you and intentionally lisp!
 
:cheers:


Whether I'm right or whether I'm wrong
Whether I find a place in this world or never belong
I gotta be me, I've gotta be me
What else can I be but what I am

I want to live, not merely survive
And I won't give up this dream
Of life that keeps me alive
I gotta be me, I gotta be me
The dream that I see makes me what I am

That far away prize, a world of success
Is waiting for me if I heed the call
I won't settle down, won't settle for less
As long as there's a chance that I can have it all

I'll go it alone, that's how it must be
I can't be right for somebody else
If I'm not right for me
I gotta be free, I've gotta be free
Daring to try, to do it or die
I've gotta be me

Songwriters
WALTER MARKS

Published by
Lyrics © Warner/Chappell Music, Inc.


Read more: Sammy Davis Jr. - I've Gotta Be Me Lyrics | MetroLyrics
 
Denny Crane said:
More like it's become a commercialized event, lost the meaning of what it's supposed to be.
Click to expand...
Yeah but they say "too straight." You want acceptance but being associated with straight people repulses you? You dont see the irony here?
 
Wow, seems while I was away people who never went to Pride decided what is wrong with it!

First - Saturday at Hillary Clinton table. Signed up a ton of potential volunteers, now all those sign in sheets have to be transcribed into computers, sigh. Met interesting people. A man told me he had campaigned for her in 2008, then joined the Air Force. Recently got out and is back in civilian life ready to campaign again. Welcome home and thank you for your service. A man said in very careful English, pointing to Hillary button, "I am from Korea. May I have one of those?" A naked man purchased a Hillary button. I did not ask him what he is pinning it to. A woman commented that the men who show up in the altogether are never the hunky ones. Obviously, hunky men can get attention without disrobing. Sunday the Parade. Other times contingents I've participated in have been near the back so we arrived at 10 AM and stood around until 12 or later waiting to join. But the Hillary for America contingent was tapped to escort Gavin Newsom and were right up front, started walking before 10:30 and arrived so early at Civic Center I wondered where everyone was! Newsom is the most popular politician in the San Francisco gay/lesbian/bi/transgender community by a mile; it's not close. He does not need to disrobe to be cheered! More security than in past years, for fairly obvious reasons.

Best T-shirt: Make America Gay Again
Runners up: Straight Outta the Closet; Buns Not Guns (the illustration was NOT a bakery)

A big We are Orlando contingent with posters of the victims. I just read that survivors of the Boston Marathon bombing traveled to Orlando to visit survivors of the Pulse massacre.

Denny, you copied/pasted an article quoting someone saying the march is too corporate which I guess means, something? I know you are not anti-corporate, so what is the point? She is wrong. I was marching before it was even called Pride. In 1971 when I was 16 there were no corporate sponsors, no gay cops, the only religious organization was the gay Metropolitan Community Church and even the most liberal politicians would not come near us. The fact that all those people are now there is a sign of our strength that they have been pulled in. We always said "we are everywhere" which was true be we were also mostly in the closet. It's a testament to our success as a movement that the Parade has become a major urban event. I agree that corporations with lousy labor and environmental records do not get a pass because they put a rainbow on their logo one week of the year, and if you are getting your head blown off it hardly matters if the cop is gay or straight. But this is not a protest march; we do those and will continue to. It's a Parade. It's our whole community. Being gay is not some priesthood to be limited to those who pass some arcane purity test. We are everywhere and everyone.

MarAzul said gay equality is "appropriating", grabbing something we have no right to. You know, if you say we gays no right to equality, someone might call you a homophobe. MarAzul loves to issue pronouncements about things he knows nothing about and once again is absurdly wrong saying a Pride Parade divides us. You'd have a hard time finding a greater example of unity than Pride. People from all over the world come to SF for Pride. Every ethnicity, color, gender, sexual orientation, age. Veterans, drag queens, professionals, leather fanciers, techies, students, faith communities (I saw Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist and Wiccan), bikers, vegans, nudists, politicians, unions, grandparents, even Republicans. Aside from some snarky comments, all getting along for this one day. There are no fistfights at Pride. Is there any other venue where you can cram a million people into a small space, with blocked streets you can't cross, sidewalks so congested getting from Point A to Point B is an acrobatic feat, transit crammed to the seams, loud music, insufficient sanitary facilities despite the City's best efforts, and have virtually no crime and only a few minor injuries (sprained ankles, heat stroke)?
 
I am not "anti corporate" because it is a voluntary association, the liability protection is a must if you want to raise capital, they provide ~25% of the jobs in the country, and their success means good things for the 99%'s retirement plans.

But I am against special favors by government for specific corporations.

The article is what the article is. A number of gay people don't like the Pride thing because it's become commercialized. Even if corporations are involved, the whole thing is voluntary association. It's not like government brought in the corporations and passed a law including a mandate you had to go.
 
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crandc said:
MarAzul said gay equality is "appropriating", grabbing something we have no right to.
Click to expand...

Actually my lady, you didn't do the appropriating. The SC did it for you. The definition of the word marriage has been a man and a woman (sometime women) for thousands of years. The four major religions all have the same understanding of marriage.

The SC of the United States is supreme in judging US law. In my view, the justices did not restrain themselves and exceeded there authority when they change the meaning of the word marriage to be something else. It appears they took it upon themselves to override the teaching of all the prophets of all religions that have spoke to the subject in the last 5000 years. That would be appropriation from the followers and supporters of those religions, to change the meaning of the word,
that has religious meaning and value to them. A vast majority of the people, many of whom don't mind or even care if you join to together however you wish, but it is not the same as the covenant of a man and a woman before their God.
Our Constitution gives us religious liberty and the government has no place in that field, but they just stepped in (the SC), and changed the meaning of one of the institutions that has stood since ancient times.

You were not deprived of equal justice in any way, unless you think you need the tax break. Well I don't really know if congress intended to give the gay the married tax break. They probably would not do it today if it came up. I think they intended to encourage the traditional family as the foundation of our society. Perhaps that could be viewed as unjust, I don't know.
 
Religious definitions of marriage, my gentleman, are up to those religions. They can and do decide what is a covenant before their god and many include same sex couples. We do not have a religious government in the United States. The law is not based on any prophets. We do have a Constitution that explicitly states equal protection under the law. Law is based on that Constitution and not on any religious text. There are about 1500 federal rights and responsibilities related to marriage, as well as rights granted by states. Not being married absolutely denied equal justice, my gentleman. Being married takes nothing from the followers of any prophets. They can still believe as they choose. The majority in the USA choose to support marriage equality, in fact, my gentleman.

The legal definition of marriage has changed multiple times including in the United States where at one time, not that long ago, marriage meant the woman lost all control over her property because by law it all belonged to the man. Where wages were paid to the man when a whole family worked. Where rape of a wife was legal because she was the man's property. So was beating a wife. The woman as property is very old indeed. Being old is not necessarily being good.

"the gay"? Is that some kind of new syndrome?

If you can't defend your position that Pride is divisive, change the subject and pretend that US law is based on prophecy.
This horse has left the stable, MarAzul. You can't unmarry us, my gentleman.
 
BlazerCaravan said:
Look up the term "appropriation" which might help you here.
Click to expand...

Ugh... that's exactly what I thought when I read, "it’s co-opting queer identity as a way to make money". Seriously?!?

It reminded me of an article about a college campus where African American students had successfully sued to get their own meeting spaces and menu items because the place had basically become too inclusive.

I get to the point where I want to yell, "WTF do you want from me?!?"

I'm pro-human being. That doesn't mean I'm going to understand anyone else's struggles (born with, acquired, related to, etc. whatever they may be) but if you want me to understand "Your Thing" at least show up and try to explain it to me!!! It's just divisive and, while there may be some truth to it, it just makes people like me (a middle aged white woman who doesn't qualify for any kind of Pride Day) feel like there is really no hope of resolution at all... why should I care if you don't?
 
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crandc said:
Spud, you qualify for Pride as an ally.
Click to expand...

Thank you crandc... but do you get what I mean? The very fact that it has been "appropriated" by corporate America means that the message IS getting through. It's like everything the Pride cause wanted but now this guy is going, "You're doing it wrong." It's very frustrating for me, I feel like that guy is judging ME and the whole point of the thing is acceptance.
 
Nope, not judging you. Pride has not been appropriated, it has become what, mainstream? Like I said, we have no purity test.

Screw anyone who thinks they can judge you.
 
crandc said:
Nope, not judging you. Pride has not been appropriated, it has become what, mainstream? Like I said, we have no purity test.

Screw anyone who thinks they can judge you.
Click to expand...

Exactly, mainstream is the perfect word... not too corporate, too white, etc.

I get what the man is saying, the meaning has definitely changed a lot over the years. But if we just look at Orlando alone, there's an obvious need for outreach in places that corporate America can't or doesn't reach. But at least Corporate America is onboard. It could be (and has been in very recent history) much worse. Good and bad, they're going to wring every penny out of it they can because... greed.
 
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Denny Crane said:
I wouldn't hesitate to show up as an ally, FWIW.
Click to expand...

This made me giggle because I remember a time not to long ago where the biggest insult one man could throw at another man was to accuse him of being gay. We're having this discussion about the Pride movement becoming too corporate and I'm picturing the attorney Denny Crane. Who instantly turns into Captain Kirk marching in the parade. I do remember Captain Kirk being very open minded when it came to dating.
 
So show up, Denny! No one is stopping you. We don't do DNA testing for the gay gene at the doors of BART trains.

Sadly, Spud, accusing someone of being gay is still an insult among straight dudes - go to any sporting event and you'll hear it in the crowd.
 
Spud147 said:
This made me giggle because I remember a time not to long ago where the biggest insult one man could throw at another man was to accuse him of being gay. We're having this discussion about the Pride movement becoming too corporate and I'm picturing the attorney Denny Crane. Who instantly turns into Captain Kirk marching in the parade. I do remember Captain Kirk being very open minded when it came to dating.
Click to expand...
Denny Crane married Alan Shore in the last episode of Boston Legal. The ceremony was performed by Antonin Scalia. The two weren't gay, it was a marriage of financial convenience...

I don't have an opinion about the "too corporate" angle. It was gay people who seemed to have an issue with it.

I lived 15 years in the Bay Area, thru 1999. It was tolerant of gay people back then. I'm not sure why have a pride parade there. Have it in Alabama or Arkansas, or getter yet, N. Carolina. I would still show up in support.
 
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