Has your opinion of Hendo changed?

[PDXFonz]

Right. Because they had the same surgery. The same contract. Etc. Easier to view Wesley as a shell of himself and Hendo still having potential with this team.

Apples to Oranges. Both players have an equal chance of contributing to their respectful teams in my opinion. I can't help but feel that the rose colored glasses might be clouding judgement on this one. I'm not saying that Wes will live up to his contract, or that he will even be the player he used to be. I'm just saying it sounds ludicrous to claim that Henderson could turn it around after struggling, but Wes cannot.

I have an aching feeling that had we re-signed Wes to a favorable contract he would not be "done" as Nate has claimed on multiple occasions.

 

[Natebishop3]

I find this extremely hypocritical coming from the person who keeps saying that Wesley Matthews is done.

One is coming off minor hip surgery, and the other is coming off a torn Achilles.

One also just signed a max contract, while the other is in his final year and is making 6 million.

We also have CJ starting, while the Mavs have........... Raymond Felton?

Wes was 3-12 and 0-8 from three last night.

 

[PDXFonz]

One is coming off minor hip surgery, and the other is coming off a torn Achilles.

One also just signed a max contract, while the other is in his final year and is making 6 million.

We also have CJ starting, while the Mavs have........... Raymond Felton?

Wes was 3-12 and 0-8 from three last night.

The contract he signed should carry no weight as to whether or not he can contribute for his team.

 

[Natebishop3]

Apples to Oranges. Both players have an equal chance of contributing to their respectful teams in my opinion. I can't help but feel that the rose colored glasses might be clouding judgement on this one. I'm not saying that Wes will live up to his contract, or that he will even be the player he used to be. I'm just saying it sounds ludicrous to claim that Henderson could turn it around after struggling, but Wes cannot.

I have an aching feeling that had we re-signed Wes to a favorable contract he would not be "done" as Nate has claimed on multiple occasions.

If we had signed Wes to a contract anywhere near what he's currently making, I would be furious right now. Hendo was contract filler. It's not rose colored glasses, it's no colored glasses. I couldn't care less about him. He's an afterthought. If he plays well, great, if he doesn't... I don't care. He's most likely gone after this season, while Wes would have been here for 4 more years.

 

[Natebishop3]

The contract he signed should carry no weight as to whether or not he can contribute for his team.

The contract makes a HUGE difference. Do you think the Mavs are thrilled with the production of their max player? We view the player through the lens of how much they're making and what their role is on the team. Wes was signed to be a major contributor. Has he been? He's averaging 10 ppg, 1.5 assists, 2 rebounds with a PER of 8.95. He's shooting 33% from the floor and 31% from three. He's fucking horrible right now. And if there wasn't a long history of players falling off drastically from torn achilles, you might have a leg to stand on, but you don't.

 

[PDXFonz]

The contract makes a HUGE difference. Do you think the Mavs are thrilled with the production of their max player? We view the player through the lens of how much they're making and what their role is on the team. Wes was signed to be a major contributor. Has he been? He's averaging 10 ppg, 1.5 assists, 2 rebounds with a PER of 8.95. He's shooting 33% from the floor and 31% from three. He's fucking horrible right now. And if there wasn't a long history of players falling off drastically from torn achilles, you might have a leg to stand on, but you don't.

I think Wesley Matthews is going to go 0-8 last night if he makes 12 million less than he is actually making. Do you think he would be playing better/worse on a smaller/larger contract?

You are not differentiating production from expectations.

 

[riverman]

I've watched more Mavs ball than any other non Blazer squad and in my view...Wes is the most overpaid role player in the league right now. He had one good 20pt game but everything else has been underwhelming..looks slow on the court and has no lift ..seems to have lost his lateral speed. Cuban said one of the riskiest moves he's made was the Wes contract. I like Wes but it's not looking great for him so far

 

[Natebishop3]

I think Wesley Matthews is going to go 0-8 last night if he makes 12 million less than he is actually making. Do you think he would be playing better/worse on a smaller/larger contract?

You are not differentiating production from expectations.

His production is shit. He's playing 28 minutes per game and he's not producing what a starting shooting guard should be producing. You could start just about anyone and they would produce SOMETHING, but minutes in the NBA are finite and Wes is not living up to what a starting shooting guard should produce in the NBA. What makes you think he'll improve? Show me an example of a guy around his age coming back from that kind of injury and being as good as he was?

 

[PDXFonz]

His production is shit. He's playing 28 minutes per game and he's not producing what a starting shooting guard should be producing. You could start just about anyone and they would produce SOMETHING, but minutes in the NBA are finite and Wes is not living up to what a starting shooting guard should produce in the NBA. What makes you think he'll improve? Show me an example of a guy around his age coming back from that kind of injury and being as good as he was?

There were also questions as to whether or not he would be ready to go this early. There were talks that he wouldn't even be out on the court until Christmas time. I am also Lockean in the sense that I don't believe you can look at other players coming off an Achilles injury to say this is how Wes will be by the end of the season, or two years from now. Sure you can get an idea of how difficult is coming off of that injury, but all players are different. What riverman said below is spot on, but I think Wes can find his shooting touch and still be an effective offensive player in the league. His all around game will likely never be the same, but that's not to say he can't still be a successful NBA player.

I've watched more Mavs ball than any other non Blazer squad and in my view...Wes is the most overpaid role player in the league right now. He had one good 20pt game but everything else has been underwhelming..looks slow on the court and has no lift ..seems to have lost his lateral speed. Cuban said one of the riskiest moves he's made was the Wes contract. I like Wes but it's not looking great for him so far

I agree right now it doesn't look good. But I think he's having to learn what its like without as much rise on his shots, and that is part of why his shooting % is atrocious. I think with time Wes will get his shot back, and can still be an excellent floor spacer. That being said, I don't think you would ever want to pay anyone as much as they are paying Wes with his current upside. But again the fact that the Mavs overpaid doesn't take away from the fact that he can still contribute for an NBA team.

 

[BlazerCaravan]

I think Wesley Matthews is going to go 0-8 last night if he makes 12 million less than he is actually making. Do you think he would be playing better/worse on a smaller/larger contract

He would play the same and people would be less upset because the production per million would be higher. Better value if he's cheaper.

 

[Natebishop3]

He would play the same and people would be less upset because the production per million would be higher. Better value if he's cheaper.

At his current production he shouldn't be getting minutes at all. If he wasn't making max money, I don't think they'd be force feeding him playing time.

 

[PDXFonz]

Question for you guys then. Do you think the way Wes is playing right now is how he will perform for the rest of his career, or do you think he will improve his play as the year goes on?

Do you think this is how Henderson will play for the rest of his career, or will he improve his play as the year goes on?

 

[Natebishop3]

Question for you guys then. Do you think the way Wes is playing right now is how he will perform for the rest of his career, or do you think he will improve his play as the year goes on?

Do you think this is how Henderson will play for the rest of his career, or will he improve his play as the year goes on?

I am supremely confident that Henderson will once again be a solid rotation player. Maybe not here but somewhere.

I am not confident that Wes will ever again be the player that he was. He might be a shooter again but I am very confident that Wes will never live up to that contract.


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[PDXFonz]

I am supremely confident that Henderson will once again be a solid rotation player. Maybe not here but somewhere.

I am not confident that Wes will ever again be the player that he was. He might be a shooter again but I am very confident that Wes will never live up to that contract.


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Say they both are maxing the same contract of IDK 38/4, who would you take Wes or Henderson?

 

[Natebishop3]

Say they both are maxing the same contract of IDK 38/4, who would you take Wes or Henderson?

Can't I take neither? I didn't want Wes and I don't think hendo has much of a future here. With that said, if I was Dallas right now I would rather have hendo.


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[maxiep]

He's a temporary piece, not part of our future. CJ is best suited as a 6th man off the bench. We need a bigger, better shooting guard (meaning a better overall game, not a better shooter than CJ) to play in front of him.

All I care about is what we can get in trade value for Henderson. This season is about figuring out what pieces are going to be part of our rebuild and which pieces we will cast away. Lillard is the cornerstone. Right now, perhaps only Aminu is starting quality, and not particularly high on that list either. Everyone else is bench quality or a few years away from being a consistent starter on a deep playoff team.

 

[Draco]

The contract makes a HUGE difference. Do you think the Mavs are thrilled with the production of their max player? We view the player through the lens of how much they're making and what their role is on the team. Wes was signed to be a major contributor. Has he been? He's averaging 10 ppg, 1.5 assists, 2 rebounds with a PER of 8.95. He's shooting 33% from the floor and 31% from three. He's fucking horrible right now. And if there wasn't a long history of players falling off drastically from torn achilles, you might have a leg to stand on, but you don't.

Wes has been a big contributor. He's been the leader of their defense for a team that is ranked 12th in the league. 12th might not sound impressive but when you have Dirk anchoring an offense and Raymond Felton starting at SG (alongside Wes not in his place as you mistakenly believe) its an accomplisment. Wes obviously is shooting terrible but I'd be ecstatic if Hendo was giving us Wes' contributions on the court right now. Wes also suffered his injury months before Brandon Jennings who isn't even on the court so its very possible Wes will make improvements down the line.

Wes may well have been a bad contract for us to hand out but its very early to make any absolute determinations. Damian struggled with his shot for 4 months of NBA basketball before finally regaining his touch shouldn't we give Wes more than 3 weeks with the most devastating injury in the sport?

 

[Natebishop3]

Wes has been a big contributor. He's been the leader of their defense for a team that is ranked 12th in the league. 12th might not sound impressive but when you have Dirk anchoring an offense and Raymond Felton starting at SG (alongside Wes not in his place as you mistakenly believe) its an accomplisment. Wes obviously is shooting terrible but I'd be ecstatic if Hendo was giving us Wes' contributions on the court right now. Wes also suffered his injury months before Brandon Jennings who isn't even on the court so its very possible Wes will make improvements down the line.

Wes may well have been a bad contract for us to hand out but its very early to make any absolute determinations. Damian struggled with his shot for 4 months of NBA basketball before finally regaining his touch shouldn't we give Wes more than 3 weeks with the most devastating injury in the sport?

Felton didn't start last night. Parsons is back.


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[Draco]

His production is shit. He's playing 28 minutes per game and he's not producing what a starting shooting guard should be producing. You could start just about anyone and they would produce SOMETHING, but minutes in the NBA are finite and Wes is not living up to what a starting shooting guard should produce in the NBA. What makes you think he'll improve? Show me an example of a guy around his age coming back from that kind of injury and being as good as he was?

Dominique Wilkins

In the NFL Terrell Suggs.

 

[maxiep]

Felton didn't start last night. Parsons is back.


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That move makes the Mavs much prettier.

 

[Draco]

Wesley Matthews is really struggling from threes this year; he's shooting 31.1%

Gerald Henderson is shooting 30.8%...... for his career.

 

[Natebishop3]

Wesley Matthews is really struggling from threes this year; he's shooting 31.1%

Gerald Henderson is shooting 30.8%...... for his career.

Different type of guard though. Hendo isn't a shooter. Wes is supposed to be a shooter.


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[Draco]

Different type of guard though. Hendo isn't a shooter. Wes is supposed to be a shooter.


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Worse defending poorer shooter? Yes I'd call him different; and inferior.

Wes may be overpaid but saying you'd rather have Hendo regardless of contract going forward is a joke. Hendo has less value than nothing making $6 million per year on an expiring deal.

 

[maxiep]

I was amazed that Dallas gave Wes that much money. If we weren't going to come close to paying him half that for all the intangibles he would have brought to this team, that should have been a huge red flag for everyone else.

That being said, if there is going to be someone completely undeserving of his contract that deserves every penny, it's Wes. What a quality guy and what a great story he is. When the Mavs come to town, I hope the fans give him a standing O.

 

[Natebishop3]

Worse defending poorer shooter? Yes I'd call him different; and inferior.

Wes may be overpaid but saying you'd rather have Hendo regardless of contract going forward is a joke. Hendo has less value than nothing making $6 million per year on an expiring deal.

Did you look at Wes' numbers this year? The mavs are actually trying to make the playoffs. I said I would rather have neither of them so don't put words in my mouth.


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[PDXFonz]

Did you look at Wes' numbers this year? The mavs are actually trying to make the playoffs. I said I would rather have neither of them so don't put words in my mouth.


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You said if you were Dallas you would rather have Hendo... Does that mean if you were Portland you would rather have Wes? Or you would rather have Hendo? What if you were Nate Bishop and are choosing which player you would rather have on the team you route for? Sorry but I'm not going to let you take the "neither" cop-out.

I myself wouldn't have to think twice, if the contract is the same I'm taking wes 100/100 times, even with his current slump.

 

[PDXFonz]

Also at 9-4 I'm not sure Cuban is sweating it right now...

 

[Draco]

You said if you were Dallas you would rather have Hendo... Does that mean if you were Portland you would rather have Wes? Or you would rather have Hendo? What if you were Nate Bishop and are choosing which player you would rather have on the team you route for? Sorry but I'm not going to let you take the "neither" cop-out.

I myself wouldn't have to think twice, if the contract is the same I'm taking wes 100/100 times, even with his current slump.

Exactly I didn't put anything in his mouth even if he wanted me to.

 

[Natebishop3]

You said if you were Dallas you would rather have Hendo... Does that mean if you were Portland you would rather have Wes? Or you would rather have Hendo? What if you were Nate Bishop and are choosing which player you would rather have on the team you route for? Sorry but I'm not going to let you take the "neither" cop-out.

I myself wouldn't have to think twice, if the contract is the same I'm taking wes 100/100 times, even with his current slump.

If I'm Dallas, and I'm trying to win while I've got Dirk, then yes... I would want Hendo. I think he could actually contribute now. Wes is a complete question mark. It's no guarantee that he'll ever return to form. How many more years does Dirk have at a high level? That's without considering the contract.

The question about whether I'd want Hendo or Wes on my team if they had the same contract is stupid, because this team can't really use either of them. CJ has proven why we didn't want to keep Wes. Hendo is in the final year of his contract. The scenario wouldn't exist. Is Wes supposed to sit on our bench and be a mascot?

 

[PDXFonz]

Exactly I didn't put anything in his mouth even if he wanted me to.

HAHAHA