Hey, Trump voters! Insult free, attempt-at-dialog thread

[Denny Crane]

First of all, this is part of the "us against the elites" bullshit. It also implies that there are no Democrats in "flyover country". Who do you think is in the unions? Which, incidentally, have been targeted by legislation is at least two of the states that went to Trump: Wisconsin and Michigan.

Also: the real divide is urban vs. rural. Salt Lake City has a Democratic mayor, ferchrissakes. Austin is one of the hipsterest cities in America. It's interesting that the rural voters seem to be the ones most opposed to Muslims and immigrants, when the only ones of either that they see are the farmworkers they happily underpay. Whereas the big cities teaming with diversity, and the ACTUAL SUBJECT OF TERRORIST ATTACKS are not hiding under their beds and demanding draconian measures. Never has rural America "loved" NY so much as in 9/11, and yet it seems to think it has a better idea of what's good for NYC than the citizens of NYC.

The unions supported Trump, at least the rank and file.

I think you are projecting on people in the rural areas. They don't have a better idea of what's good for NYC, they just don't want NYC imposing shit on them because NYC (and democrats) know better.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

It's easy enough to get a reasonable estimate. Go look at the membership of the alt right forums at 4chan and stormfront.

im sorry, we must be talking about two different things. active marching KKK members alone is between 5k and 8k by most estimates. stormfront has over 300k registered members.

i mean, are you only talking about unabashed admitted racists? i thought we were talking about the alt-right.

 

[magnifier661]

do you buy things made outside of america?

I sure did. Government globalism of nation building intervention, allowing other countries to manipulate their currency to price compete and open borders to allow cheap labor to gouge the working class, strict regulations and taxation to push out small and large businesses is not something I buy into. I would be more than happy to pay a little more to help our economy.

 

[magnifier661]

george bush crushed him in every category.

That's 100% false.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

I sure did.

so you dont anymore?

 

[magnifier661]

Re Muslims:

Forgive my laziness - I'm using a clip from the Daily Show, which is (obviously) very anti-Trump. But it does collect a lot of things that he said about Muslims, and a report from Fox News (traitoress Megyn Kelley, but still) about how Trump plans a Muslim registry. Are you okay with this, Trump voters? I genuinely want to know.

I'm okay with keeping America safe. We are all registered already brother. We have Social Security, credit reports and a drivers license.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

That's 100% false.

oh, i was just going off of dennys graph. it showed george bush crushing trump in every minority category.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

oh, i was just going off of dennys graph. it showed george bush crushing trump in every minority category.

The Pope even voted for Trump.

 

[magnifier661]

First of all, this is part of the "us against the elites" bullshit. It also implies that there are no Democrats in "flyover country". Who do you think is in the unions? Which, incidentally, have been targeted by legislation is at least two of the states that went to Trump: Wisconsin and Michigan.

Also: the real divide is urban vs. rural. Salt Lake City has a Democratic mayor, ferchrissakes. Austin is one of the hipsterest cities in America. It's interesting that the rural voters seem to be the ones most opposed to Muslims and immigrants, when the only ones of either that they see are the farmworkers they happily underpay. Whereas the big cities teaming with diversity, and the ACTUAL SUBJECT OF TERRORIST ATTACKS are not hiding under their beds and demanding draconian measures. Never has rural America "loved" NY so much as in 9/11, and yet it seems to think it has a better idea of what's good for NYC than the citizens of NYC.

That "fly over country" used to be democrats. The majority of farmers back in the 60's and before were democrats. The democrats used to be for the working man. It's not the case now

 

[magnifier661]

so you dont anymore?

Of course I do. I always try to buy American when I can, just like I buy local from my city. I think you assume I'm a isolationist. It's a common mistake for many that don't understand Americanism.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

Of course I do.

You say you shop American "when you can". When can you not?

 

[Denny Crane]

im sorry, we must be talking about two different things. active marching KKK members alone is between 5k and 8k by most estimates. stormfront has over 300k registered members.

i mean, are you only talking about unabashed admitted racists? i thought we were talking about the alt-right.

http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/11/16/you-are-still-crying-wolf/

 

[blue32]

What this sounds like is that you didn't disapprove of the statement, you just thought it might hurt him (because of the "politically correct"). Would you be okay if, now it obviously wasn't campaign suicide (well, at least in areas of the country where there are practically no Muslims, which seems to be where he was most popular), he actually carried out that policy? Or do you see something wrong with screening people by their religion?

The statement didn't bug me, because I knew what he was talking about. And no I do not see a problem screening people that come from Terrorist areas. I can't be anymore blunt. That religion does not mix with America and the Western world.

I missed this pivot. When you say "terrorist areas" do you mean Syria and Libya or do you include France, given the terrorist attacks they've had there? Also, it's pretty hard to narrow it down, isn't it? After all, Canada is letting in a lot of Syrians - couldn't they just come through Canada? If you really believe Isis is such a threat that a "shutdown" is necessary, doesn't his original policy make the most sense?

I will leave that up to the intelligence agencies and the new CIA director he just promoted.

But then, in all seriousness, he wouldn't be Donald Trump! He doesn't do "eloquent" - and isn't that his appeal?

Eloquent, meaning in a way to talk to the god damn liberal special snowflakes who get butt-hurt any chance they can. Again, I appreciate his matter of fact tone, but obviously lots of people would rather have it drawn in a cartoon for them.

Or do you mean "less easy to interpret as racist"?

If you want dialogue no need to race bait.

Would you like him to speak directly to the KKK and say "hey - you misunderstood me as much as those PC guys - I'm not your friend"? Or are you happy with him keeping quiet and accepting their support because, hey, it's votes?

Pass. Race baiting.

Who's the "we" here? Again - see the KKK and the various White Nationalist movements. They really seem to be taking him literally. Are they just getting their news from the MSM?

Go ask them if you want to know so much about the KKK. You seem fixated on them.

What are the major policies for you? Will you be mad if he doesn't build a wall, or was that just a metaphor for beefed up border security?

I've already answered this question in many other threads. And I've already explained how I felt about campaign promises and reality, earlier in this thread.

 

[magnifier661]

You say you shop American "when you can". When can you not?

I like German cars. I pay a premium to have that car. I even pay luxury tax to own one. My taste in American cars is snobby but I do own a Cadillac Escallade.

Here is an example of gov regulations and taxation on food goods. Local fisherman catch fish. That fish is shipped to China to process and shipped back to the U.S. It's cheaper for these companies to do this, which has destroyed the food processing companies in America.

 

[MarAzul]

When can you not?

You are kidding?

 

[riverman]

I like German cars. I pay a premium to have that car. I even pay luxury tax to own one. My taste in American cars is snobby but I do own a Cadillac Escallade.

Here is an example of gov regulations and taxation on food goods. Local fisherman catch fish. That fish is shipped to China to process and shipped back to the U.S. It's cheaper for these companies to do this, which has destroyed the food processing companies in America.

I just read an article about this...said removing the pin bones from salmon in the US costs a dollar a pound and 20cents a pound in China...American canneries pay 11 bucks and hour and Chinese 1-2 dollars per hour...they said they ship seafood there and will soon do the same with chicken to open up the Chinese market for US beef....we buy local seafood here in Oregon from fishermen who grew up fishing here....most Asian seafood my wife buys are farmed or from New Zealand...I'd also like to see our Port Orford Cedar and heartwoods sold to americans instead of selling for top dollar to Japanese and Korean factories...I live near a mill and always feel we have to pick through poor grade lumber to buy retail here in the middle of the industry

 

[magnifier661]

I just read an article about this...said removing the pin bones from salmon in the US costs a dollar a pound and 20cents a pound in China...American canneries pay 11 bucks and hour and Chinese 1-2 dollars per hour...they said they ship seafood there and will soon do the same with chicken to open up the Chinese market for US beef....we buy local seafood here in Oregon from fishermen who grew up fishing here....most Asian seafood my wife buys are farmed or from New Zealand...I'd also like to see our Port Orford Cedar and heartwoods sold to americans instead of selling for top dollar to Japanese and Korean factories...I live near a mill and always feel we have to pick through poor grade lumber to buy retail here in the middle of the industry

Yes, the fishing industry took a major hit. That's really awesome of you to buy locally. You are a true patriot.

 

[riverman]

Yes, the fishing industry took a major hit. That's really awesome of you to buy locally. You are a true patriot.

I'm actually learning to fish from my son who is really becoming a good fisherman....just bought him a freezer for his bday and he's filling it up with salmon..here's the biggest bass I caught this year

 

[SlyPokerDog]

I just read an article about this...said removing the pin bones from salmon in the US costs a dollar a pound and 20cents a pound in China...American canneries pay 11 bucks and hour and Chinese 1-2 dollars per hour...they said they ship seafood there and will soon do the same with chicken to open up the Chinese market for US beef....we buy local seafood here in Oregon from fishermen who grew up fishing here....most Asian seafood my wife buys are farmed or from New Zealand...I'd also like to see our Port Orford Cedar and heartwoods sold to americans instead of selling for top dollar to Japanese and Korean factories...I live near a mill and always feel we have to pick through poor grade lumber to buy retail here in the middle of the industry

We're already doing that with chicken.

 

[MarAzul]

I'd also like to see our Port Orford Cedar and heartwoods sold to americans instead of selling for top dollar to Japanese and Korean factories

This rubs me the wrong way too. But I am not sure what the heck to do about it.
About 10 years ago, I went log buying for Port Orford Cedar to supply the construction of one of my designs. There is almost no use for the wood domestically, but the price of the logs is sky high.
One fine clear 32 foot butt log went for 35 thousand dollars. It was ideal for my use and only available to me where it was before it was moved to the docks for shipment to Japan. The logs are accumulated until a ship load is on hand, then shipped out, about once a month. These tree only grow here on the South Coast of Oregon and on the Island of Hokkaido.

We pretty much use them for the same purpose, spiritually. They build Shinto Temples, I think they are superb for Wooden boats.

 

[riverman]

We're already doing that with chicken.

must have been an old article....chicken factories in asia are gross

 

[SlyPokerDog]

must have been an old article....chicken factories in asia are gross

I have no problem with this being done, we are shipping beef to Mexico and chicken to China for processing. What I have a huge problem with is these don't have to be labeled as being processed out of the country.

Label it and let the consumer decide.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/11/16/you-are-still-crying-wolf/

View attachment 10858

View attachment 10859

Again, we are talking about two different things.

Or are you saying that kkk members and storefront members comprise the entirety of the alt right?

 

[3RA1N1AC]

This rubs me the wrong way too. But I am not sure what the heck to do about it.
About 10 years ago, I went log buying for Port Orford Cedar to supply the construction of one of my designs. There is almost no use for the wood domestically, but the price of the logs is sky high.
One fine clear 32 foot butt log went for 35 thousand dollars. It was ideal for my use and only available to me where it was before it was moved to the docks for shipment to Japan. The logs are accumulated until a ship load is on hand, then shipped out, about once a month. These tree only grow here on the South Coast of Oregon and on the Island of Hokkaido.

We pretty much use them for the same purpose, spiritually. They build Shinto Temples, I think they are superb for Wooden boats.

Should Japanese people not be able to purchase American goods? Should American corporations not be able to sell goods for the highest price possible?

 

[3RA1N1AC]

I just read an article about this...said removing the pin bones from salmon in the US costs a dollar a pound and 20cents a pound in China...American canneries pay 11 bucks and hour and Chinese 1-2 dollars per hour...they said they ship seafood there and will soon do the same with chicken to open up the Chinese market for US beef....we buy local seafood here in Oregon from fishermen who grew up fishing here....most Asian seafood my wife buys are farmed or from New Zealand...I'd also like to see our Port Orford Cedar and heartwoods sold to americans instead of selling for top dollar to Japanese and Korean factories...I live near a mill and always feel we have to pick through poor grade lumber to buy retail here in the middle of the industry

Should products sold in America only come from America? Should corporations not be able to maximize their profits via cheaper production?

 

[MarAzul]

I have no problem with this being done

I do. I think it is extremely unwise as a nation to lose control of your food supply.

 

[riverman]

I do. I think it is extremely unwise as a nation to lose control of your food supply.

Drift net fishing in Asia worries me more when it comes to the food supply than processing plants...those mile long steel nets that don't discriminate when harvesting from the ocean...that is something that hurts our food supply

 

[MarAzul]

Should Japanese people not be able to purchase American goods?

Should American corporations not be able to sell goods for the highest price possible?

Absolutely is the answer to your first question. But I also think it is really foolish as a nation to sell your raw resources unless you weigh the decision carefully.
Thus why I said, I do not know what to do about it in the case of Port Orford Cedar. The Japanese are willing to pay very high prices for the logs for their use in spiritual things, making the price so high it is impractical to use the wood locally for lessor value item. Even Boats! Very few people will pay the price needed to cover the cost.

 

[MarAzul]

Drift net fishing in Asia worries me more when it comes to the food supply than processing plants...those mile long steel nets that don't discriminate when harvesting from the ocean...that is something that hurts our food supply

I totally agree. It is also dangerous to smaller vessel at sea. This practice should be banned by International treaty and enforced by the US Navy and the Navies of signatory nations.

 

[Jade Falcon]

Nothing has turned me off on Trump as of yet. I'll just let him do what he does, and I'll let you know if I disagree with it.

Pretty much this. I didn't buy into the whole "boogieman" argument from the Liberal Media. Instead, I did my research (when I felt like it), and listened objectively to what he was saying, vs what the media was saying he said. And I concluded probably 90% of the media's talking points are full of bullshit.

So he didn't say much that turned me off from wanting him to be president. I don't personally agree that he was the best choice for a Republican America, but I've warmed up to him in the weeks since; especially seeing as how much hate and chaos the Left is causing right now. I also didn't agree with how he ran his campaign at times (even though it worked).

I'm also realistic on much of what he says: I don't personally believe that he seriously believes half of what he says. But I'll give him points on determination, as well as the benefit of the doubt.

So maybe having a bombastic asshole is going to be good for this country. A "slap in the face" if you will, towards all of the PC Safe Space Triggered "let me lecture you about your white privilege" elitist crowd. A sign that they need to change. And that will DEFINITELY be good for America.

The Republican Party, as well as Conservative Politics in general, are both changing drastically. It's time for the Left to do the same.

In as far as "what would piss me off that he would do"? Hmmm....if he fails on half of his talking points because of laziness, or because he just doesn't give a shit, I'll be angry about that. Bring back jobs (or make it possible to start them up here by eliminating regulations in DC), open up the pipelines here in the US so that the midwest can have good paying jobs, make peace with Russia, kill ISIS entirely (and without giving quarter to the enemy), reaffirm ties with our allies, stop giving our money to countries that hate us, tear up the Iran agreement, fix the inner cities (or at least put things in place that will help start the process), and continue to reach out a hand to Democrats and Liberals around the country. Even if they hate us....which they do.

If he accomplishes even half of that in the next 4 years, I'll be ecstatic.