High usage scoring PGs who don't play defense

[blazerkor]

I wasn't questioning if Billups was doing different things on offense, I was questioning what part of the results were better. From the gate, our offensive rating was down, and it only got worse. Injuries in the 2nd half of the year are the likely cause of the decline, but the offense was never as good or better than it has been in the previous decade.

He had half a Dame and we'd never seen Stotts's system have to deal with that... being without Dame altogether might have been a better gauge but that's not how it went down, plus even if we were healthy there was going to be a learning curve. So, I guess it's still an unknown unless you've watched a ton of basketball in your life and realize that it's just a far more sustainable brand of basketball than what we've been watching for the previous nine seasons.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

sure, there might not be one, or at least not a good one. But he has been around the NBA for 25 years, so there is some reason for hope. Unless of course, as it seems sometimes, some of you guys won't be satisfied till we all agree there is no hope

View attachment 47488

nothing personal FH...just having some fun

Hope in Eternal.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

Pretty obvious he wants to push the ball and allow more than just Dame to bring it up. Motion offense is also apparent.

The last coach wanted that as well but we have Dame and that is not who Dame is. Lets see how this all works out because what you watched this last season will not be what you see next year. I can almost guarantee that.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

I took issue with the word "better" and the data doesn't back that up.

Sophisticated is not something I worry about because that can be good or bad. I want the offense to produce as well as the last system and see the defensive results be much better. Last season, the results on offense were way worse and the defense was no better (yes, injuries contributed).

Personnel as well. Even at the beginning they were running different players and trying to push defense. No more Melo.

 

[wizenheimer]

Hope in Eternal.

you must not be married

 

[Fairly-Hard]

you must not be married

Second marriage probably two time loser.

 

[Tince]

He had half a Dame and we'd never seen Stotts's system have to deal with that... being without Dame altogether might have been a better gauge but that's not how it went down, plus even if we were healthy there was going to be a learning curve. So, I guess it's still an unknown unless you've watched a ton of basketball in your life and realize that it's just a far more sustainable brand of basketball than what we've been watching for the previous nine seasons.

How do we know what Dame's percentage was last year vs the year before?

I worked for Synergy, so I'm guessing the hours I've watched basketball is in the 99th percentile based on your criteria. However, I dont' think that makes me an expert and/or unable to have serious bias, which is why I try to stay away from rating the beauty or sustainability of an offense and stick to the measurable facts.

Want to wager the Blazers will finish better (league ranking) in offensive percentage this year than they did the last three seasons under Stotts? Should be an easy win for you if your theory is true. I'll take the other side. Deal?

 

[Tince]

Personnel as well. Even at the beginning they were running different players and trying to push defense. No more Melo.

Yeah, I think personnel is a huge factor. Not as much scheme.

 

[blazerkor]

How do we know what Dame's percentage was last year vs the year before?

I worked for Synergy, so I'm guessing the hours I've watched basketball is in the 99th percentile based on your criteria. However, I dont' think that makes me an expert and/or unable to have serious bias, which is why I try to stay away from rating the beauty or sustainability of an offense and stick to the measurable facts.

Want to wager the Blazers will finish better (league ranking) in offensive percentage this year than they did the last three seasons under Stotts? Should be an easy win for you if your theory is true. I'll take the other side. Deal?

I'll wait until we actually have a team to decide on that one. We traded away the team that Stotts had for cap room to re-sign players we already had bird rights to and a TPE that we don't have the draft capital to utilize. So if Cronin can pull a rabbit out of his hat and put a decent team around Dame, I definitely think we'll have a better offense than we did under Stotts and I know that's saying a lot.

 

[Tince]

I'll wait until we actually have a team to decide on that one. We traded away the team that Stotts had for cap room to re-sign players we already had bird rights to and a TPE that we don't have the draft capital to utilize. So if Cronin can pull a rabbit out of his hat and put a decent team around Dame, I definitely think we'll have a better offense than we did under Stotts and I know that's saying a lot.

Sounds like we're more or less on the same page.

What we know is when you compare the offensive #'s in the 2020-21 season after the Powell trade, with the #'s in the 2021-22 before all the injuries, the offense was significantly worse. It is possible eventually we'll have a better supporting cast around Dame than we've had the last 5+ years, but given the major rebuild, that will take some time.

I'm actually guessing Billups never has a top 3 offense in his tenure. Again, I hope I'm wrong, because I'm rooting for him to be a major improvement.

 

[wizenheimer]

Sounds like we're more or less on the same page.

What we know is when you compare the offensive #'s in the 2020-21 season after the Powell trade, with the #'s in the 2021-22 before all the injuries, the offense was significantly worse. It is possible eventually we'll have a better supporting cast around Dame than we've had the last 5+ years, but given the major rebuild, that will take some time.

I'm actually guessing Billups never has a top 3 offense in his tenure. Again, I hope I'm wrong, because I'm rooting for him to be a major improvement.

it's pretty worthless to have the 2nd ranked offense when your defense is ranked 29th (2020-21)

what matters is the differential. Last season, Blazers were 2nd in offense but 12th in differential. And they certainly looked no better than about the 12th best team in the playoffs

look at the top-10 teams in differential this season:



all 8 teams playing in the conference semi-finals were in the top-10. And that tracks about the same every season

also:



only 5 of the top-11 teams in offense made it past the first round

maybe this is more a result than predictive; more follow than lead. Still, it's obvious that a team needs to have some balance between offense and defense to climb the ladder to contention

 

[Mediocre Man]

it's pretty worthless to have the 2nd ranked offense when your defense is ranked 29th (2020-21)

what matters is the differential. Last season, Blazers were 2nd in offense but 12th in differential. And they certainly looked no better than about the 12th best team in the playoffs

look at the top-10 teams in differential this season:

View attachment 47501

all 8 teams playing in the conference semi-finals were in the top-10. And that tracks about the same every season

also:

View attachment 47502

only 5 of the top-11 teams in offense made it past the first round

maybe this is more a result than predictive; more follow than lead. Still, it's obvious that a team needs to have some balance between offense and defense to climb the ladder to contention

Thank you for saying so well what I’ve been blabbering about for so long.

well done

 

[wizenheimer]

Thank you for saying so well what I’ve been blabbering about for so long.

well done

well, right there is your problem....you should never blabber, you should only babble

 

[Mediocre Man]

well, right there is your problem....you should never blabber, you should only babble

Now you can go fuck yourself.

 

[wizenheimer]

Now you can go fuck yourself.

on my way

 

[Tince]

it's pretty worthless to have the 2nd ranked offense when your defense is ranked 29th (2020-21)

what matters is the differential. Last season, Blazers were 2nd in offense but 12th in differential. And they certainly looked no better than about the 12th best team in the playoffs

look at the top-10 teams in differential this season:

View attachment 47501

all 8 teams playing in the conference semi-finals were in the top-10. And that tracks about the same every season

also:

View attachment 47502

only 5 of the top-11 teams in offense made it past the first round

maybe this is more a result than predictive; more follow than lead. Still, it's obvious that a team needs to have some balance between offense and defense to climb the ladder to contention

I agree with you that differential is more important than offensive rating. However, the original post I was responding to was claiming our offense under Billups was better and more sophisticated, which is why I kept my response to offensive data.

 

[wizenheimer]

I agree with you that differential is more important than offensive rating. However, the original post I was responding to was claiming out offense under Billups was better and more sophisticated, which is why I kept my response to offensive data.

understood, but I have more trouble sticking to any subject than my son did when he was eight

 

[YamTastic]

Dame plays great defense when the refs aren't fucking us over. Back in 2016- or so, I did a 30-year analysis of the Blazers and we've always been the most-called-against team in the league; there was one really great run a few years ago when we got more calls than our opponents by a tiny margin, then Detroit's coach complained and it was right back to being the butt of the league's reffing. I don't know who pissed off the NBA, but refs have had it out for us literally for 30 years or more.