How would you gameplan against this Blazers team?

[Further]

Assuming that the Blazers continue to play this new style where so many people are incorporated, and decision making is spread, I would hate to be designing a gameplan against the Blazers. If you try to slow it down, then Roy and perhaps Oden become more of a threat. If you try to stop any particular play like LMA or Oden, then you open tons of holes the other players will take advantage of. If you try to Zone, Blake, Rudy, Outlaw and Rudy will kill you. If you try and guard the perimeter, Oden, LMA, Bayless, Miller and Roy will kill you.

And even on offense, where would you attack. If you stay on the perimeter, you get low quality shots, but if you go inside you face Oden, Joel and LMA.

This is a very balanced team, and that makes it very hard to gameplan.

 

[andalusian]

The way to try and exploit this team is with quick-guards attacking the rim and trying to get the bigs into foul trouble.

The Blazers seem to do a better job of loading on the other team's quick players in the last couple of games - but it is still a question if they can continue to consistently do it.

 

[Further]

The way to try and exploit this team is with quick-guards attacking the rim and trying to get the bigs into foul trouble.

The Blazers seem to do a better job of loading on the other team's quick players in the last couple of games - but it is still a question if they can continue to consistently do it.

I agree that this is certainly one thing teams should try, but this can't be the extent of a gameplan. For one thing, sometimes refs don't comply. For another, if you do this too much, then the D can just collapse. And if you don't have a speedy player like Brooks or Parker, then you won't be able to get much done. Another thing is that even if this strategy does work, the Blazers would have several quarters before any real damage is done. Also, With Joel as BU for Oden, and Howard and Outlaw also playing BU for LMA, there are a ton of fouls you have to get against a bunch of different lineups, and this is very difficult.

I am just saying that although I think teams should try this strategy, they will often have to backup and go to plan B. And then what?

 

[hasoos]

There are certain defensive switches you can trick the Blazers into to get a big switched on to a small/faster type of player. I would look for those in film and work to exploit those weaknesses.

 

[andalusian]

I am just saying that although I think teams should try this strategy, they will often have to backup and go to plan B. And then what?

Look, the Blazers are a good team - and that's why most of us expect them to win a lot this year - but, there are ways to drop them. Will probably not happen often - but this is still this team's #1 issue. Attack the rim - be it with a quick and fast PG or with a strong wing (as 'Melo did to us and to a lesser extent - Joe Johnson).

When Batum is fully back - our perimeter defense will take another notch up, I suspect - until that time - this is option 1 to attack the Blazers.

 

[Further]

Look, the Blazers are a good team - and that's why most of us expect them to win a lot this year - but, there are ways to drop them. Will probably not happen often - but this is still this team's #1 issue. Attack the rim - be it with a quick and fast PG or with a strong wing (as 'Melo did to us and to a lesser extent - Joe Johnson).

When Batum is fully back - our perimeter defense will take another notch up, I suspect - until that time - this is option 1 to attack the Blazers.

I agree. But this can't be the extent of a gameplan. I am not saying the Blazers are always going to win, but that due to the style and spread around talent, they are a very hard team to plan for. Certain teams, be they good or bad, are easy to gameplan for. Like the Cavs. They are a great team, and you are going to have a hard time winning against them, but there are really two gameplans you go with against them. Stop LeBron, or Stop everyone else. executing that plan is something different.

 

[andalusian]

On defense I would try to play the passing lanes to stop the fast breaks - and would dare Miller to shoot the long ball. If he hits it - it's going to be a long night. If not - you can overload the post and try to double Roy/Oden.

 

[Further]

On defense I would try to play the passing lanes to stop the fast breaks - and would dare Miller to shoot the long ball. If he hits it - it's going to be a long night. If not - you can overload the post and try to double Roy/Oden.

Good thoughts on daring Miller. Overloading the post is going to be really hit or miss since this is a really good shooting team, not to mention that LMA is be open all night if this is the strategy you take, and the Blazers will be getting a lot of the O rebounds when the long ball misses.

 

[Mediocre Man]

The Blazers give up a lot of wide open 3's with Blake still.

I would start by penetrating into Oden, and forcing the refs to call some fouls. Once he is out of the game I would simply drive and dish to open shooters. SA did that, but just missed wide open shots.

On defense I would box and 1 the Blazers. Having the 1 ghost Roy. I would also send in someone to slap Aldridge around early to throw him off of his game. Make Miller shoot.

 

[Minstrel]

and would dare Miller to shoot the long ball. If he hits it - it's going to be a long night. If not - you can overload the post and try to double Roy/Oden.

This is not as effective as it sounds. If you leave Miller entirely (to go double someone else), he'd going to attack the rim or pull up for a mid-range jumper...something he's been quite at good at hitting in his career.

If you simply play off him, you're inviting him to pick you apart with his passing. Point guards love being able to survey the court and make passes without on-ball pressure. One of the keys to slowing down a good passing point guard is to pressure him with tight defense. Pippen's much-celebrated defense of Magic Johnson, in the 1991 Finals, was not so much a matter of shutting Magic Johnson down (he didn't) but rather of pressuring him constantly with tight, stifling defense, disrupting his ability to see the court and make his passes. That dropped the flow and efficiency of the Lakers offense. Simply backing off a good distributing point guard is rarely going to work well for the defense.

 

[Further]

The Blazers give up a lot of wide open 3's with Blake still.

I would start by penetrating into Oden, and forcing the refs to call some fouls. Once he is out of the game I would simply drive and dish to open shooters. SA did that, but just missed wide open shots.

On defense I would box and 1 the Blazers. Having the 1 ghost Roy. I would also send in someone to slap Aldridge around early to throw him off of his game. Make Miller shoot.

I like most of your ideas except the box and 1 ghosting Roy. It's too easy for Roy to run his man into congestion and open up huge lanes for anyone else. Also, this makes the boxing team have to decide on either tightening up the box on to hold the bigs, leaving Outlaw, Rudy, Blake et al to zone bust. Or loosening up the box to track the perimeter guys giving LMA and Oden an easy time. I think if any zone is to be used, I would use a 3-2 as long as Oden is in the game, and a 2-3 or the box and 1 when Oden is out.

 

[magnifier661]

Assuming that the Blazers continue to play this new style where so many people are incorporated, and decision making is spread, I would hate to be designing a gameplan against the Blazers. If you try to slow it down, then Roy and perhaps Oden become more of a threat. If you try to stop any particular play like LMA or Oden, then you open tons of holes the other players will take advantage of. If you try to Zone, Blake, Rudy, Outlaw and Rudy will kill you. If you try and guard the perimeter, Oden, LMA, Bayless, Miller and Roy will kill you.

And even on offense, where would you attack. If you stay on the perimeter, you get low quality shots, but if you go inside you face Oden, Joel and LMA.

This is a very balanced team, and that makes it very hard to gameplan.

The way we've been playing now, I think it's hard to stop. Our guards are protecting the perimeter more and not overplaying defensively. That overplaying allows other teams quick penetration, which got our bigs in fouling situations.

The only way I see teams being able to beat us now, would be outside shooting. If they are hitting all their shots, then it causes a huge problem, since Miller isn't necessarily quick enough to keep recovering.

In the end, teams like Cleveland, Denver and others with playmaking SFs that are big and strong will be the only teams I worry about.

 

[andalusian]

This is not as effective as it sounds. If you leave Miller entirely (to go double someone else), he'd going to attack the rim or pull up for a mid-range jumper...something he's been quite at good at hitting in his career.

That's why I said overload the post. To make it harder for him to attack the rim.

 

[Minstrel]

That's why I said overload the post. To make it harder for him to attack the rim.

Then he can pull up for a mid-range shot. His shooting woes are from the perimeter. In his career, he's been a pretty adept mid-range shooter.

 

[Fez Hammersticks]

Double Roy every time he touches the ball. Our offense is a lot of 1-on-1 ISO's and Roy is by far the best at creating his own shot. Let Blake and Marty create and see how that works out for Portland.

Put Greg in a lot of P&R's.

 

[andalusian]

Then he can pull up for a mid-range shot. His shooting woes are from the perimeter. In his career, he's been a pretty adept mid-range shooter.

There is no 100% fool-proof plan in the NBA - that's why we never saw a team go 0-82 and I doubt we ever will. Same goes for what I think I would do, were I a coach of a team that has to go against the Blazers.

This, imho - is the most obvious way to harass the Blazers. It will work less often than it will not - but that would still be my #1 option - overload the post, quickly try to double Roy/Oden and live with whatever Miller does inviting him to shoot - while attacking the paint from the dribble on offense.

 

[Minstrel]

There is no 100% fool-proof plan in the NBA - that's why we never saw a team go 0-82 and I doubt we ever will. Same goes for what I think I would do, were I a coach of a team that has to go against the Blazers.

This, imho - is the most obvious way to harass the Blazers. It will work less often than it will not - but that would still be my #1 option - overload the post, quickly try to double Roy/Oden and live with whatever Miller does inviting him to shoot - while attacking the paint from the dribble on offense.

Well, attacking Miller wouldn't be my #1 strategy as an opposing coach...he's a very good player because he has enough weapons not to be so easily or often turned into a liability. I'd probably attack the Blazers' small forward position. Pressure Roy and Miller, bring quick double-teams from different directions on Oden when he gets the ball and rotate such that the open player tends to be whoever is manning small forward.

I will give McMillan credit that the three-guard lineup makes that strategy problematic...in the three-guard lineup, the "small forward" is Roy...if you then adjust to make it that the shooting guard is the open one, then you're leaving Blake alone for his main source of value: shooting open perimeter shots. Essentially, the three guard lineup is probably the toughest one to game-plan against...the drawback of it will be on defense, against teams with at least two bigger perimeter players.

 

[andalusian]

Well, attacking Miller wouldn't be my #1 strategy as an opposing coach...he's a very good player because he has enough weapons not to be so easily or often turned into a liability. I'd probably attack the Blazers' small forward position. Pressure Roy and Miller, bring quick double-teams from different directions on Oden when he gets the ball and rotate such that the open player tends to be whoever is manning small forward.

How do you attack the Portland SF position if you do not have a freak like 'Melo or 'Bron? Roy can handle many of the small-forwards, Travis and Webster can handle some of the bigger ones that are not dominant ball-handlers. Sure, they will sometimes lose to them - but overall - unless you have someone like Pierce, LeBron or Melo which are big, strong and can handle the ball - you are not going to win by attacking Portland's small-forwards.

I will give McMillan credit that the three-guard lineup makes that strategy problematic...in the three-guard lineup, the "small forward" is Roy...if you then adjust to make it that the shooting guard is the open one, then you're leaving Blake alone for his main source of value: shooting open perimeter shots. Essentially, the three guard lineup is probably the toughest one to game-plan against...the drawback of it will be on defense, against teams with at least two bigger perimeter players.

Of course - but again, the Blazers have coaches too and will change the rotation for these teams if us trying to force our style on them does not work. We have seen it before and I suspect we will see it again.

At the end of the day - the obvious problems where the Blazers have issues are with perimeter defense when people can get to the rim - not only does it give you a shot at easy baskets - it also puts Portland's bigs in foul trouble.

At the other end of the court - Roy is a nightmare for most - and Oden is as well when he gets the ball deep in the post. So - you would like to try and quickly double these two - Oden in the post and Roy everywhere, pretty much. This leaves you see who you leave open most for shooting - Blake is a great shooter, LMA often is as well - this leaves Miller as the one I would dare to shoot.

 

[magnifier661]

At the other end of the court - Roy is a nightmare for most - and Oden is as well when he gets the ball deep in the post. So - you would like to try and quickly double these two - Oden in the post and Roy everywhere, pretty much. This leaves you see who you leave open most for shooting - Blake is a great shooter, LMA often is as well - this leaves Miller as the one I would dare to shoot.

Yeah for the life of me, I don't understand why so many people have given "Roy's SF ability" a big question mark. I always refer to the other end. What SF wants to guard Roy? The dude is impossible to guard one on one, unless you are someone like Artest, and even him had help.

To me, leaving Miller wide open would really be the only option. I think Nate is trying to implement Aldridge to score in the paint more, which is even more crazy for teams. Can you imagine having to double both sides of the paint? Impossible! Then you have a Roy that is freely running through pick after pick, Blake setting up the outside shot and Miller being a good enough decision maker to not fold under pressure. If this thing starts running on all cylinders, it will be almost impossible to counteract. Unless, of course, you get a few in foul trouble.

 

[Minstrel]

How do you attack the Portland SF position if you do not have a freak like 'Melo or 'Bron?

I thought it was clear from my post that I didn't mean attacking Portland's small forwards with offense, I was talking about how you defend Portland. "Attacking the small forward spot" meant applying defensive pressure on the ball to Miller and Roy, bringing quick double teams on Oden when he receives the ball and rotating such that Portland's small forward is the one left open by and large.

In other words, make Portland's small forwards beat you. They can all stick a shot, but they're all very inconsistent. Forcing Portland to depend on its least consistent element seems much better than trying to make their best players beat you.

 

[andalusian]

In other words, make Portland's small forwards beat you. They can all stick a shot, but they're all very inconsistent. Forcing Portland to depend on its least consistent element seems much better than trying to make their best players beat you.

I just can't see how you can double 2 wing players and rotate quick for the post to leave just the small-forwards open. I think the only teams I have seen that were able to do something like that were the last championship years for the Celtics and the Spurs - and these were elite defensive teams with elite post and perimeter defenders (Bowen/Duncan and Rondo/KG).

Most teams just can not do it.

 

[Minstrel]

I just can't see how you can double 2 wing players and rotate quick for the post to leave just the small-forwards open.

You misread my post. I never said to double Miller and Roy. I said to pressure them (in other words, play tight defense) and double quickly on Oden, from different directions, when receives the ball.

You really can't effectively double wing players without fatally compromising your defense unless you are a truly elite trapping defense.

Only if and when Roy or Miller penetrates do you roll another player over to cut them off...and that should generally be the player defending the small forward. If the penetration comes from the other side of the floor from the small forward, you roll and rotate...the closest wing defender rolls over to the penetrator and the small forward defender rotates to cover the player vacated.

 

[Blazer_Hippie]

...just wanted to say that I have enjoyed this discussion! I'm a pretty weak X's and O's spectator, but I find a lot of times I can read something here and then look for it during the game. In the spirit of the other thread, Kudos!

 

[Natebishop3]

The key to beating the Blazers thus far has been getting the bigs in foul trouble. This is easily achieved by guards if they slash, or by big men if they flop. I noticed Jefferson never flopped on Oden. That was a mistake. The refs seem to buy it most of the time. Flynn is too much of a rookie to realize that he can get our front court in trouble by driving into them. Most veteran teams have seen this weakness and exploited it.

 

[magnifier661]

The key to beating the Blazers thus far has been getting the bigs in foul trouble. This is easily achieved by guards if they slash, or by big men if they flop. I noticed Jefferson never flopped on Oden. That was a mistake. The refs seem to buy it most of the time. Flynn is too much of a rookie to realize that he can get our front court in trouble by driving into them. Most veteran teams have seen this weakness and exploited it.

The first 5 games, and most of last season, yes. But with this 3 guard starting core, they are doing a much better job of taking away dribble penetration from the guards. Keep in mind that Tony Parker was playing, one of the best slashing and penetrating guards in the league. Blake, Miller and Roy's help defense made sure that Parker had no "IN" during that game. The Blazers are letting them take those "outside shots" but even still a little contested, but making sure they completely take away any dribble penetration.

So that worked in the past, but if the new line-up protects the penetration like they have the last 2 games, we will be extremely hard to stop.