I'd like to try a little experiment

[maxiep]

The Catholics, Protestants, Jehovah Witnesses, Baptists ...... all subscribe to the same text and its values, but interpretation varies substantially. What Constitutionally Limited Govt, Free Market Principles and Fiscal Responsibility mean to you are not what they mean to me, and not what they mean to others. Interpretation is left up to the individual, and so the tea party has become filled with wing-nuts.

Explain how those principles lead to wing-nut behavior.

 

[maxiep]

I hate you! *slams my door and cries while listening to the Cure*

Emo westnob!

 

[Denny Crane]

Exactly. Everything else is just noise. The Tea Party doesn't have a position on abortion or gay marriage or any other social issue. The individual members may have their own points of view, but not the Tea Party. Most people haven't been able to grasp it.

It's a view of the Constitution as a series of negative rights (i.e., what the government can't do to you) rather than a view of the government as a provider of rights, entitlements and benefits.

It believes that the free market (not unfettered, mind you) is the best and most efficient way to provide the citizenry with wealth and economic growth.

Finally, it believes we should live within our means. That means balancing the budget and eventually paying off the debt or bringing it to a reasonable level.

Given this platform, exactly what is the beef about the Tea Party? Again, not individuals, but the platform of the Party.

Given those three principles

So what happens to this philosophy when they get elected and most if not all submit bills to ban or otherwise severely limit abortion?

I'm not stuck on abortion, it's just one of those agenda items they don't talk about but their actions say it is very high on their list of priorities.

 

[maxiep]

So what happens to this philosophy when they get elected and most if not all submit bills to ban or otherwise severely limit abortion?

I'm not stuck on abortion, it's just one of those agenda items they don't talk about but their actions say it is very high on their list of priorities.

As long as they stick to the three principles, then I don't really care about the rest.

 

[Denny Crane]

As long as they stick to the three principles, then I don't really care about the rest.

They don't stick to the three principles, do they. Abortion, for example, isn't one of the three principles.

If you mean they follow up on those three things as if they mean it, well...

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/20...e-debt-ceiling-despite-not-receiving-demands/

Almost three-quarters of Republicans voted in the affirmative. And even the Tea Party came around in the end. By 32-to-28, members of the Tea Party Caucus voted for the bill, despite earlier claims — which now look like a bluff — that they wouldn’t vote to raise the debt ceiling under any circumstances.

 

[maxiep]

They don't stick to the three principles, do they. Abortion, for example, isn't one of the three principles.

If you mean they follow up on those three things as if they mean it, well...

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/20...e-debt-ceiling-despite-not-receiving-demands/

Almost three-quarters of Republicans voted in the affirmative. And even the Tea Party came around in the end. By 32-to-28, members of the Tea Party Caucus voted for the bill, despite earlier claims — which now look like a bluff — that they wouldn’t vote to raise the debt ceiling under any circumstances.

Then they don't get my vote a second time, do they?

 

[Denny Crane]

Then they don't get my vote a second time, do they?

Which Tea Party are you talking about anyway?

There are a number of them. They're not all the same by any stretch.

http://www.rightwingnews.com/john-hawkins/a-seven-item-tea-party-agenda-for-a-gop-house/

This site suggests the tea party has a 7 item agenda, not 3.

I don't recall in the constitution where it says we should build a wall around the country to keep people out. This country wasn't founded on christian principles - it was founded on free immigration.

 

[maxiep]

Which Tea Party are you talking about anyway?

There are a number of them. They're not all the same by any stretch.

http://www.rightwingnews.com/john-hawkins/a-seven-item-tea-party-agenda-for-a-gop-house/

This site suggests the tea party has a 7 item agenda, not 3.

I don't recall in the constitution where it says we should build a wall around the country to keep people out. This country wasn't founded on christian principles - it was founded on free immigration.

The three are the ones upon which all Tea Parties agree. However, thanks for playing. You're swell.

 

[Denny Crane]

The three are the ones upon which all Tea Parties agree. However, thanks for playing. You're swell.

Where do you get that all tea parties agree to these three things?

 

[Denny Crane]

http://www.teaparty.org/about-us/

These guys list 15 core principles. The top if the page mentions two things that are military or foreign policy related.

 

[Denny Crane]

How about #14 and #15 on their list?

#14 English as our core language is required.
#15 Traditional family values are encouraged.

 

[blazerboy30]

What if the government required you to sire and raise a child on your 21st birthday despite your personal plans for your life?

What if the government legalized you killing your 1-year-old child because you changed your mind?

 

[blazerboy30]

They don't stick to the three principles, do they. Abortion, for example, isn't one of the three principles.

You're arguing that somebody must only care about those three principles, otherwise they can't consider themselves part of the political party. Like all political labels, nobody fits perfectly into any of them. You're arguing that if a person doesn't believe strongly in ONLY those three principles, they can't possibly align more closely with the Tea Party than any other part. And that is ridiculous.

 

[Further]

Explain how those principles lead to wing-nut behavior.

you have to ask the wing-nuts. I have been to both tea party and occupy rallies as an interested onlooker, I saw a lot of wing-nuts. You may not consider the people wing-nuts that i do, but I read the signs, I look at the dress, I listen to the chants, and I hear the message. I dont hear Constitutionally Limited Govt, Free Market Principles and Fiscal Responsibility being the cornerstones, I hear abortion is murder, I hear Obama is illegitimate, I hear the end is coming, I hear fearful talk of what the Democrats want to do (when no mainstream Dem wants to do those things) I hear all sorts of things that may tangentially touch your cornerstones of the tea party, but it veers so far off that it does those core ideals a big disservice. And in some cases, flat out goes against the initial ideals.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

From its inception in February 2009, the Tea Party movement has focused on three core values:

•Constitutionally Limited Government
•Free Market Principles
•Fiscal Responsibility


from http://www.oregonteaparty.org/

In other words, total pipe dreams.

 

[maxiep]

In other words, total pipe dreams.

So, one shouldn't try?

 

[Denny Crane]

You're arguing that somebody must only care about those three principles, otherwise they can't consider themselves part of the political party. Like all political labels, nobody fits perfectly into any of them. You're arguing that if a person doesn't believe strongly in ONLY those three principles, they can't possibly align more closely with the Tea Party than any other part. And that is ridiculous.

Your straw man.

I argue no such thing.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

You do know there are only three principles that represent the Tea Party, don't you?

 

[maxiep]

Excellent point!

 

[blazerboy30]

Your straw man.

I argue no such thing.

Then you've done a great job confusing yourself.

A person can associate themselves with the Tea Party and still not be in favor of abortion. You're the one who brought those up as being mutually exclusive. They aren't.

 

[Denny Crane]

Then you've done a great job confusing yourself.

A person can associate themselves with the Tea Party and still not be in favor of abortion. You're the one who brought those up as being mutually exclusive. They aren't.

Again with the straw man.

I'll concede someone can be a Tea Party supporter and not be in favor of abortion.

See how easy it is when you argue against yourself?