Is Ike Diogu The Roberto Petagine Of The NBA?

[Freshtown]

Interesting read about how maybe Ike isn't being given a fair chance.

http://celticshub.com/2009/06/03/kicking-the-tires-the-roberto-petagine-of-the-nba/

 

[Wheels]

actually a player like Ike would be a perfect backup to LMA imo.. someone who is content with 13-15 mpg and rebounds.. and not inept with the ball. I was kinda sad to see him go.

 

[hasoos]

No everybody is given a fair chance in the NBA. The question is, do they take advantage of it? I haven't seen Ike Diogu come into the league once yet, in completely shredded physical shape and ready to give it his all. That in itself tells me he is not making the effort to get to the highest level of play he can, and if he is not doing that, nobody else is going to do it for him either.

 

[Minstrel]

actually a player like Ike would be a perfect backup to LMA imo.. someone who is content with 13-15 mpg and rebounds.. and not inept with the ball. I was kinda sad to see him go.

Yeah, I think Diogu can be a solid banger backup power forward when given consistent minutes. Even given random scraps, he drew fouls and got offensive rebounds. He looked silly missing some easy shots, but it can't be easy coming in completely rusty and playing against the best players in the world.

 

[Wheels]

And you could always see him getting up and cheering when a big dunk was about to happen.. he was our Ronny Turiaf!

 

[blue32]

replace him w/Frye and I'm down.
I always wanted to give him a shot. Much like Von Wafer...

 

[andalusian]

And you could always see him getting up and cheering when a big dunk was about to happen.. he was our Ronny Turiaf!

I was always under the impression that Turiaf cared a lot more about defense than Ike.

 

[WarriorFan]

The knock on him in GS was that he was not a smort player. He didn't understand where to be on the court on offense or defense (and that's saying something considering that he could be pretty much where ever he wanted on offense there). He had great post up moves and had a couple game where he scored 26 and 28 points in limited minutes. But then he'd follow it up by not passing out of double teams, not realizing that a double wasn't coming and putting up a shot, and not recognizing cutters.

Apparently he was doing these things in practice too which is why he only got minutes in blowouts or if someone was in foul trouble.

Nelson also publicly criticized him for being a "whiner" and having some sort of sense of entitlement.

 

[Wheels]

I was always under the impression that Turiaf cared a lot more about defense than Ike.

based on the 500 minutes that Ike played in the last 2 years?

 

[LittleAlex]

During shoot around while other guys are practicing moves and such, Ike would be at the left corner 3 point line trying to see how many 3's he could make while shooting the ball as high in the air as he could.

I watched him do this nearly every game he was on the team.

Perhaps his lack of a chance has something to do with his overall attitude?

 

[Wheels]

During shoot around while other guys are practicing moves and such, Ike would be at the left corner 3 point line trying to see how many 3's he could make while shooting the ball as high in the air as he could.

I watched him do this nearly every game he was on the team.

Perhaps his lack of a chance has something to do with his overall attitude?

did you even check the article?

"With Diogu, it’s not his work ethic or his attitude. His coaches and teammates have praised his attitude in college and in the pros. So let’s look at some numbers, after the jump."

 

[andalusian]

based on the 500 minutes that Ike played in the last 2 years?

Based on every-time I did see him. Again - I am not an expert on all matters IKE - but he never seemed anything more than a Zach Randolph lightweight to me - and with that category comes the no defense thing.

 

[Minstrel]

Based on every-time I did see him. Again - I am not an expert on all matters IKE - but he never seemed anything more than a Zach Randolph lightweight to me - and with that category comes the no defense thing.

Sounds like a decent backup power forward. A guy who can rebound, score inside and draw fouls. If he could also play defense and pass well, he'd be a good or great starter.

 

[Wheels]

Sounds like a decent backup power forward. A guy who can rebound, score inside and draw fouls. If he could also play defense and pass well, he'd be a good or great starter.

exactly my thoughts.. we arent expecting an all star and a backup all star at every position on this team. but a "Z-bo light" without the headaches would be a perfect backup here.

 

[Ed O]

actually a player like Ike would be a perfect backup to LMA imo.. someone who is content with 13-15 mpg and rebounds.. and not inept with the ball. I was kinda sad to see him go.

I was one of the primary (maybe the only?) Ike fan all season... partly because of how terrible Frye is/was, and partly because I really think his skill set would help the Blazers: getting offensive rebounds and getting to the free throw line.

People on this board bashed him for shooting 31.6% from the field... with only NINETEEN field goal attempts! They ignored that he attempted more free throws than field goals as a Blazer and, instead, criticized him for not having an assist in any of his 73 minutes as a Blazer.

Of course, when he didn't play much for the terrible Kings, I didn't have much new data. At the end of the season? Of course that wasn't his TRUE level of capabilities, but I was pleased to see that he finished strong and I am still pretty confident that he could emerge as, at least, a rotation-level player on a good team.

Ed O.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Ike is a poor defender and a total black hole. Yes, he can score and draw fouls in the low post, but he'll also force up a shot EVERY time he gets the ball. Compared to him, Eddie Curry is a gifted passer with excellent court vision.

Ike couldn't EARN meaningful minutes in GS, Indiana or Portland. As much as Channing Frye sucked this year, Ike couldn't beat him out for PT. That tells you all you need to know about Ike Diogu.

BNM

 

[Wheels]

I was one of the primary (maybe the only?) Ike fan all season... partly because of how terrible Frye is/was, and partly because I really think his skill set would help the Blazers: getting offensive rebounds and getting to the free throw line.

People on this board bashed him for shooting 31.6% from the field... with only NINETEEN field goal attempts! They ignored that he attempted more free throws than field goals as a Blazer and, instead, criticized him for not having an assist in any of his 73 minutes as a Blazer.

Of course, when he didn't play much for the terrible Kings, I didn't have much new data. At the end of the season? Of course that wasn't his TRUE level of capabilities, but I was pleased to see that he finished strong and I am still pretty confident that he could emerge as, at least, a rotation-level player on a good team.

Ed O.

agreed.. while I wasnt around here for most of the season.. over at O-live there were a few of us who wanted to keep him around because he would be a good guy to have in a pinch.. I really dont think that us or any team has really had him around long enough or with enough minutes to guage what he would do for us.. kinda like the article mentioned. Wanna start a Re-Sign Ike Rally?

 

[Wheels]

Ike is a poor defender and a total black hole. Yes, he can score and draw fouls in the low post, but he'll also force up a shot EVERY time he gets the ball. Compared to him, Eddie Curry is a gifted passer with excellent court vision.

Ike couldn't EARN meaningful minutes in GS, Indiana or Portland. As much as Channing Frye sucked this year, Ike couldn't beat him out for PT. That tells you all you need to know about Ike Diogu.

BNM

and Bayless couldnt beat out Sergio for meaningful minutes.. whats your point?

 

[Minstrel]

I was one of the primary (maybe the only?) Ike fan all season...

I was the one who said that I might rather have Diogu than Jack, so Portland potentially won both parts of the deal with Indiana.

Don't try to claim sole credit for the "Ike Diogu band wagon."

 

[Ed O]

I was the one who said that I might rather have Diogu than Jack, so Portland potentially won both parts of the deal with Indiana.

Don't try to claim sole credit for the "Ike Diogu band wagon."

Who are you again? Did you come over as part of the Blazersedge exodus today?

Ed O.

 

[Boob-No-More]

and Bayless couldnt beat out Sergio for meaningful minutes.. whats your point?

And Ike wasn't some raw rookie. He was a 4th year player.

My point? Since you're incaple of figuring it out yourself:

Channing Frye SUCKS. Channing Frye > Ike Diogu.

That simple enough for you?

BNM

 

[Minstrel]

Who are you again? Did you come over as part of the Blazersedge exodus today?

If you want a band wagon entirely to yourself, you still have Dontonio Wingfield.

 

[Ed O]

And Ike wasn't some raw rookie. He was a 4th year player.

My point? Since you're incaple of figuring it out yourself:

Channing Frye SUCKS. Channing Frye > Ike Diogu.

That simple enough for you?

I think that you're stubbornly and inexplicably clinging to 73 minutes worth of data and you're getting a bit emotional about it, personally.

If you still think that Frye is better than Ike... I don't know what to tell you.

Ed O.

 

[Wheels]

And Ike wasn't some raw rookie. He was a 4th year player.

My point? Since you're incaple of figuring it out yourself:

Channing Frye SUCKS. Channing Frye > Ike Diogu.

That simple enough for you?

BNM

thanks for dumbing it down for me.. now I understand. Channing Frye would actually look good in another system.. Channing Frye in this system was basically duplicating what we already had at a lower efficiency. Put him somewhere where he can shoot and not rebound he will do well. so for OUR team.. and our needs as a rebounder Ike Diogu>Channing Frye

 

[Minstrel]

Frye is poor at defense, poor at rebounding, doesn't draw fouls, score inefficiently.

Diogu is poor at defense, good at rebounding, draws a lot of fouls, scores reasonably efficiently.

The numbers bear this out.

Diogu: 14.0 Rebound Rate, .577 TS%, 16.1 PER
Frye: 13.6 Rebound Rate, .504 TS%, 13.6 PER

While the rebounding looks similar, Frye's numbers are inflated a lot by his rookie season, a season he hasn't even approached in the three seasons since then. Diogu's numbers have actually improved over his career. If we looked at this past season's numbers, the differences between the two players would be vast.

 

[andalusian]

Sounds like a decent backup power forward. A guy who can rebound, score inside and draw fouls. If he could also play defense and pass well, he'd be a good or great starter.

Sure, but Turiaf is a much better backup PF because he plays defense - which was what my entire argument was all about...

Let's just say that if KP and Nate chose to send him and stay with Frye as our backup PF down the stretch - there must be a little more to consider and I doubt they would have done that when the team was fighting to get into the playoffs and maybe even win HCA if they would have valued him more.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I think that you're stubbornly and inexplicably clinging to 73 minutes worth of data and you're getting a bit emotional about it, personally.

If you still think that Frye is better than Ike... I don't know what to tell you.

Ed O.

Well then, you think wrong. Disagree with me all you want, but don't belittle my opinion as "getting a bit emotional about it". Coach after coach Ike has had in the NBA has buried him on the bench. He has struggled to get minutes on lottery teams in Golden State and Indiana. Why the hell should he deserve minutes on a 54-win team? Yes, he has an inflated PER. PER largely ignores defense - so does Ike Diogu.

Or maybe, Don Nelson Rick Carlisle, Jim O'Brian and Nate McMillian were all "getting a bit emotional" when they buried Ike's fat, lazy ass on the end of their benches.

BNM

 

[Minstrel]

Yes, he has an inflated PER. PER largely ignores defense - so does Ike Diogu

So does Frye. Frye doesn't bring defensive value. Diogu's PER isn't inflated, because it's a measure of productivity, not defense. Diogu is productive and lacks defense. Frye is unproductive and lacks defense.

 

[VanillaGorilla]

Well then, you think wrong. Disagree with me all you want, but don't belittle my opinion as "getting a bit emotional about it". Coach after coach Ike has had in the NBA has buried him on the bench. He has struggled to get minutes on lottery teams in Golden State and Indiana. Why the hell should he deserve minutes on a 54-win team? Yes, he has an inflated PER. PER largely ignores defense - so does Ike Diogu.

Or maybe, Don Nelson Rick Carlisle, Jim O'Brian and Nate McMillian were all "getting a bit emotional" when they buried Ike's fat, lazy ass on the end of their benches.

BNM

He has suffered multiple injuries in his short career which largely contribute to that.

You are obviously getting emotional about it.. I don't know why you care so much and it is just unnecessary to call him a fat, lazy ass.

 

[B-Roy]

I don't like him. He always seemed to chuck up shots when he was in the game and his defense was terrible.