OT Is LeBron James already the greatest of all time?

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Sorry, but that first tweet in the op is laughable. Jordan never beat any great teams. Is this guy a tweener who was born in 2001 or something and doesn't know how to look up anything from the past?
What a tool...

Just another reminder how short our memories have become....
This was a waste of my time....
 
2 of his titles have been quite fortuitous. The lucky bounce straight out to Ray Allen for a '3' or the Spurs win that series. Bogut gets hurt and Draymond gets suspended or the Warriors win that series. That is part of basketball but without those 'breaks', he is looking like a very good player with a lot of losses in the Finals.
 
TBpup said:
2 of his titles have been quite fortuitous. The lucky bounce straight out to Ray Allen for a '3' or the Spurs win that series. Bogut gets hurt and Draymond gets suspended or the Warriors win that series. That is part of basketball but without those 'breaks', he is looking like a very good player with a lot of losses in the Finals.
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Jordan never lost in the finals. He was 6-0.

LeBron has lost in the finals more times than he's won. He is 3-4.

I agree that it's complete bullshit to say Jordan's Bulls never beat a great team. How many first ballot Hall of Famers and how many of the 50 Greatest Players did Jordan beat? Plus, he had to get past great teams, the Celtics and Pistons just to get to the finals.

Yeah, LeBron has made the finals six, soon to be seven, years in a row, but evey year it's been a cakewalk. I saw a graphic on TV a couple days ago about how LeBron has had at least five days off before the start of a series more than anyone in history, and it's not even close.

With all his hand chosen Super Friends, all that time off between series and the weak competition, his teams dominate in Game 1s, jump out to an early series lead, coast to a sweep, or an occasional 4-1 gentlemen's sweep and then get another 5 or 6 days rest before the next overmatched victim is led to the slaughter.

Shit, Jordan had to duke it out with the Celtics and Pistons just to get to the finals, where he had the Lakers, Sonics or Jazz waiting for him. Much tougher opponents and far few days of rest.

The East has been so weak, and LeBron's teams so stacked, it's pretty much a given he will be in the finals, and very well rested, every year. Jordan probably would have won 10 straight titles if it had been so easy for him.

LeBron is a unique talent and a great player, but anyone who says he is greater than Jordan has forgotten how great Jordan was and how tough the competition was back then. He didn't get to hand select his superstar teammates. He had to go into battle with what he had against the Bird/McHale/Parrish Celtics, the bad Boy Pistons, the Showtime Lakers, the Stockton/Malone Jazz and the Payton/Kemp Sonics.

Jordan was, and still is, the greatest.

BNM
 
Boob-No-More said:
Jordan never lost in the finals. He was 6-0.

LeBron has lost in the finals more times than he's won. He is 3-4.

I agree that it's complete bullshit to say Jordan's Bulls never beat a great team. How many first ballot Hall of Famers and how many of the 50 Greatest Players did Jordan beat? Plus, he had to get past great teams, the Celtics and Pistons just to get to the finals.

Yeah, LeBron has made the finals six, soon to be seven, years in a row, but evey year it's been a cakewalk. I saw a graphic on TV a couple days ago about how LeBron has had at least five days off before the start of a series more than anyone in history, and it's not even close.

With all his hand chosen Super Friends, all that time off between series and the weak competition, his teams dominate in Game 1s, jump out to an early series lead, coast to a sweep, or an occasional 4-1 gentlemen's sweep and then get another 5 or 6 days rest before the next overmatched victim is led to the slaughter.

Shit, Jordan had to duke it out with the Celtics and Pistons just to get to the finals, where he had the Lakers, Sonics or Jazz waiting for him. Much tougher opponents and far few days of rest.

The East has been so weak, and LeBron's teams so stacked, it's pretty much a given he will be in the finals, and very well rested, every year. Jordan probably would have won 10 straight titles if it had been so easy for him.

LeBron is a unique talent and a great player, but anyone who says he is greater than Jordan has forgotten how great Jordan was and how tough the competition was back then. He didn't get to hand select his superstar teammates. He had to go into battle with what he had against the Bird/McHale/Parrish Celtics, the bad Boy Pistons, the Showtime Lakers, the Stockton/Malone Jazz and the Payton/Kemp Sonics.

Jordan was, and still is, the greatest.

BNM
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Couldn't have said it better myself. Can I copy this and plagiarize you? ;)
 
He's one of the best all-around of all time, but I wouldn't say the best. I think Alcindor, Jordan, Bird, Johnson, and Chamberlin are ahead of him. He's on the level of like Charles Barkley.
 
Sinobas said:
He's one of the best all-around of all time, but I wouldn't say the best. I think Alcindor, Jordan, Bird, Johnson, and Chamberlin are ahead of him. He's on the level of like Charles Barkley.
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Forget the fact that you just said LeBron and Barkley are on the same level... You didn't mention Kareem!
 
I'm going to go ahead and say that you can't be the greatest of all time until you've retired....Lebron isn't done yet but he's in the top 5 of great players so far from my view. People forget how great Wilt or Oscar Robertson were...Jordan...Dr J....there have been some amazing greats in the game..Magic and Bird were no slouches....Lebron didn't dominate the finals early in his career. Didn't show loyalty to Cleveland and went ring shopping with his buddies before going back and getting one for the hometown...he's as talented as anybody to play the game, that's for sure.
 
Sinobas said:
Haha. Yes, Barkley is the best PF of all time.
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Better than Duncan?

Hell, at the time they played, Malone was considered better than Barkley. Malone averaged > 25 ppg 11 straight seasons (12 total). Barkley did it 4 straight season (5 total). Barkley was a better rebounder. Passing was about equal. Malone was a much better defender.

Malone:
1st Team All NBA = 11 times
1st Team All Defense = 3 times
MVP = 2

Barkley:
1st Team All NBA = 5 times
1st Team All Defense = 0 times
MVP = 1

BNM
 
Fonzthecpt1 said:
Forget the fact that you just said LeBron and Barkley are on the same level... You didn't mention Kareem!
Click to expand...

Yes, he did, but by his birth name.

Sinobas said:
He's one of the best all-around of all time, but I wouldn't say the best. I think Alcindor, Jordan, Bird, Johnson, and Chamberlin are ahead of him. He's on the level of like Charles Barkley.
Click to expand...

BNM
 
I think Jordan, James, Abdul-Jabbar and Chamberlain are probably my short-list candidates for best ever.

The next tier would probably consist of Russell, Olajuwon, Shaq, Magic, Bird, Robertson
 
Minstrel said:
I think Jordan, James, Abdul-Jabbar and Chamberlain are probably my short-list candidates for best ever.

The next tier would probably consist of Russell, Olajuwon, Shaq, Magic, Bird, Robertson
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Wait, what??? No Westbrook???

But, but, but... TRIPLE DOUBLES!!!

BNM
 
Minstrel said:
All of what I posted was "non-Westbrook/Harden division" obviously. There is no touching those two guys.
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Especially in the post season where none of the guys you mentioned come close matching Harden and Westbrook.

BNM
 
TBpup said:
2 of his titles have been quite fortuitous. The lucky bounce straight out to Ray Allen for a '3' or the Spurs win that series. .
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It wasn't a lucky bounce. Bosh grabbed an offensive rebound and passed it to Ray Allen. People forget that. Bosh made it happen.

Sinobas said:
Haha. Yes, Barkley is the best PF of all time.
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No. Tim Duncan. Then Malone. Then Barkley though don't forget about Dirk and McHale.

Minstrel said:
I think Jordan, James, Abdul-Jabbar and Chamberlain are probably my short-list candidates for best ever.

The next tier would probably consist of Russell, Olajuwon, Shaq, Magic, Bird, Robertson
Click to expand...

Ummm Tim Duncan???
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Garnett deserves mention as well.
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I think Garnett belongs up there with Duncan, honestly. If the Spurs had had Garnett instead of Duncan (assuming KG had begun his NBA career at the same time), I don't think the Spurs would have been less successful.
 
Lebron has something going for him that can't be said about any other player in the league, maybe ever. In his prime you could play lebron at the 1,2,3,4, and at stints at the 5 and he will not only be the best player on the court but he will be the best player in the league at that position on both sides of the court, save center, and he can switch onto any player on D. Lebron can bring it on both sides of the court like he could a few years ago but he is unstoppable when he wants to be.
Lebron is 44-7 all time in the first round of the playoffs, never missing the second round of the playoffs his entire career.
He lead the Cavs, before he left, to the finals with one of the worst rosters I have ever seen in the NBA finals. The Cavs never did a great job of surrounding Lebron with great talent and he still found a way to dominate the east every single year.
No player has ever had the expectations that sports media has put onto Lebrons shoulders and he still finds a way to surpass those expectations on a regular basis.
 
Rhal said:
Lebron has something going for him that can't be said about any other player in the league, maybe ever. In his prime you could play lebron at the 1,2,3,4, and at stints at the 5 and he will not only be the best player on the court but he will be the best player in the league at that position on both sides of the court, save center, and he can switch onto any player on D. Lebron can bring it on both sides of the court like he could a few years ago but he is unstoppable when he wants to be.
Lebron is 44-7 all time in the first round of the playoffs, never missing the second round of the playoffs his entire career.
He lead the Cavs, before he left, to the finals with one of the worst rosters I have ever seen in the NBA finals. The Cavs never did a great job of surrounding Lebron with great talent and he still found a way to dominate the east every single year.
No player has ever had the expectations that sports media has put onto Lebrons shoulders and he still finds a way to surpass those expectations on a regular basis.
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Well said. I like the part about the media pressure, Jordan and players before him never had it like Lebron, social media being a newer trend.
 
KingSpeed said:
It wasn't a lucky bounce. Bosh grabbed an offensive rebound and passed it to Ray Allen. People forget that. Bosh made it happen.



No. Tim Duncan. Then Malone. Then Barkley though don't forget about Dirk and McHale.



Ummm Tim Duncan???
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Second tier.
 
Duncan, Garnett and Moses Malone are just outside my top-ten. It's hard to exclude anyone I put ahead of them.
 
When you do the juice, you're not even a Real Athlete, let alone belonging on some list of greats.
 
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