Is there legitimate reason to fear Utah next season?

[BGrantFan]

You would argue based on... what? That he plays the PG spot at both ends of the floor and leads his team in assists? Or just out of stubbornness?



Those are pretty good for a freshman.

Not compared to Kevin Durant's freshman year or even Greg Oden's.

Again: Turner is TWO YEARS OLDER. Of course his stats are going to be better.

Who had this stat line when he was Wall's age as a freshman?

8.5ppg/2.6apg/2.7TOpg/33% 3pt/47% FG/4.4rpg/69.9% FT.

Evan Turner, of course.

Those a good points, but Turner's stats from last year, as a soph, look better than Wall's to me. I guess I just don't see how Turner's stats can be held against him as a 21 year-old. If the same matrix applied to Brandon Roy, then the Blazers probably would have been better off drafting Rudy Gay, since Gay had much better stats in his freshman/soph seasons at UCONN.

Rebounding as a SG is almost irrelevant, both in the NBA and especially in college. Turner's inability to make three pointers (about .6 a game) is much more relevant. He also doesn't get to the line very much considering how often he shoots.

Ed O.

Perhaps rebounding as a SG is almost irrelevant. Of course, having a starting PG who averages 4 TOs/game with only 6 assists in a run-and-gun offense is somewhat relevant.

I'm not saying Wall won't be a great player; I just wonder why you say you view him as a FAR better prospect, because I don't. Perhaps marginally better? I could buy that, since he will corral his game as he gets to the NBA. As I said, I watched a lot of Ohio State this season, and Turner's game translates very well to the NBA.

 

[Ed O]

I'm not saying Wall won't be a great player; I just wonder why you say you view him as a FAR better prospect, because I don't. Perhaps marginally better? I could buy that, since he will corral his game as he gets to the NBA. As I said, I watched a lot of Ohio State this season, and Turner's game translates very well to the NBA.

Maybe I didn't see him enough, but the guy doesn't get to the line very much, he doesn't shoot many three pointers, and he doesn't (based on what I've read) have a ton of athleticism. He has good size and handles and, seemingly, a good mid-range game (based on the lack of FTs and 3's).

Why does that translate well to the NBA game?

I'm not trying to be a jerk. I'm curious.

Ed O.

 

[BGrantFan]

Maybe I didn't see him enough, but the guy doesn't get to the line very much, he doesn't shoot many three pointers, and he doesn't (based on what I've read) have a ton of athleticism. He has good size and handles and, seemingly, a good mid-range game (based on the lack of FTs and 3's).

Why does that translate well to the NBA game?

I'm not trying to be a jerk. I'm curious.

Ed O.

It's just my opinion after watching him play. I don't think you're wrong in your assessment, I just don't necessarily agree with a large gap between Wall and Turner. I'll throw in a few short Youtube vids that show Turner.

[video=youtube;2MQryGSmmA4]

[video=youtube;SrIlPpGYbak]

[video=youtube;F10BOGLiei4]

 

[andalusian]

I think Turner is going to be a very good NBA player - but my gut feeling is that he is going to be more of a Paul Pierce kind of guy than Brandon Roy - he seems to have the size and wingspan to be a fantastic point-forward and less the agility of a small-guard - the combination of his size and wingspan will, imho, help him slide over to the SF position where his "lack of elite athletic ability" will not be that big of a problem. I think he will fill up and grow a bit larger than Roy - which again, will very likely make him into a SF, long term. That, at least, is my feel for him.

Wall seems like a Derrick Rose kind of PG - with maybe a bit more court vision and less of a scoring mentality - but he seems to be, at least for now, more of a system player - he is going to struggle in half-court sets especially in the NBA. If the pace is not going to be fast - he is going to take time to become a PG - or he will have to play a Wade like SG position - where he is used more in a scoring capacity by using his amazing athletic abilities.

 

[rocketeer]

Rebounding as a SG is almost irrelevant, both in the NBA and especially in college. Turner's inability to make three pointers (about .6 a game) is much more relevant. He also doesn't get to the line very much considering how often he shoots.

Ed O.

if he actually showed an inability to make 3s, that would be a little troubling. but he doesn't. he makes 3s at a pretty decent percentage he just doesn't take many of them.

i don't think questions about his athleticism really have any merit either.

 

[Ed O]

if he actually showed an inability to make 3s, that would be a little troubling. but he doesn't. he makes 3s at a pretty decent percentage he just doesn't take many of them.

He has demonstrated an inability for THREE YEARS to make three pointers. I don't care whether he rarely shoots them or not... except insofar as shooting and missing more would be worse for his team.

Last year he shot a fantastic percentage, but only made 11 in 33 games. This year he's shooting more and shooting worse. I don't think that a guy who is unwilling (or unable) to stretch a defense has a game that will automatically translate to the NBA level.

Ed O.

 

[BGrantFan]

He has demonstrated an inability for THREE YEARS to make three pointers. I don't care whether he rarely shoots them or not... except insofar as shooting and missing more would be worse for his team.

Last year he shot a fantastic percentage, but only made 11 in 33 games. This year he's shooting more and shooting worse. I don't think that a guy who is unwilling (or unable) to stretch a defense has a game that will automatically translate to the NBA level.
Ed O.

Turner has an excellent mid-range game. I guess I don't understand your infatuation with his 3pt shooting, when Wall has proven to be an even worse shooter from outside. You even said you haven't seen him play much. On what are you basing your assessment?

 

[BGrantFan]

He has demonstrated an inability for THREE YEARS to make three pointers.
Ed O.

Actually, he's shown an inability to shoot 3 pointers, for whatever reason. He's actually shown the ability to make them when he shoots them.

 

[rocketeer]

He has demonstrated an inability for THREE YEARS to make three pointers. I don't care whether he rarely shoots them or not... except insofar as shooting and missing more would be worse for his team.

Last year he shot a fantastic percentage, but only made 11 in 33 games. This year he's shooting more and shooting worse. I don't think that a guy who is unwilling (or unable) to stretch a defense has a game that will automatically translate to the NBA level.

Ed O.

i like a guy who knows his strengths and what's best for the team. ohio state has better 3 point shooters. they are better off with turner attacking the basket creating opportunities for the other shooters rather than him shooting from the outside to create space for a post game that they don't have.

if turner was unable to shoot 3s, he wouldn't be shooting a good percentage. not being a volume 3 point shooter in college isn't a bad thing. roy didn't take a lot of 3s. and john wall isn't a good 3 point shooter either.

 

[Ed O]

Turner has an excellent mid-range game. I guess I don't understand your infatuation with his 3pt shooting, when Wall has proven to be an even worse shooter from outside. You even said you haven't seen him play much. On what are you basing your assessment?

Mid-range games don't stretch defenses. Three point shooting does, and especially given the short 3 point line in college, if a player is unable to hit three pointers then I'm not at all convinced he will be able to do so at the next level.

Actually, he's shown an inability to shoot 3 pointers, for whatever reason. He's actually shown the ability to make them when he shoots them.

You can't make them without shooting them. He has shown the ability to shoot reasonably well (37% is no great shakes) with very, very few attempts a game. Presumably he takes the easier-to-make 3 point attempts: the wide-open ones that are much less common at the next level.

Ed O.

 

[Ed O]

if turner was unable to shoot 3s, he wouldn't be shooting a good percentage. not being a volume 3 point shooter in college isn't a bad thing. roy didn't take a lot of 3s. and john wall isn't a good 3 point shooter either.

Roy made twice as many 3 pointers a game in his final year as Turner has, and he shot over 40% from that range. Yes, Roy was inferior in his previous seasons, but I'm thinking that people would be comparing current Turner to final college product Roy.

I don't think that anyone would argue that Wall is a good 3 point shooter.

Ed O.

 

[MickZagger]

What makes Turner special, is that it isn't just his offense game that makes him good. He is a threat for a triple double nearly every game. He just gets it. I think he's about as can't miss as you can find. Him and James Anderson are the 2 best SG's in this draft. Wesley Johnson is a stud too, but disappears often and has been playing SF his entire collegiate career, I think he could easily transition into a SG though. Either way, Jazz will have some options for sure based on their needs. Not a bad year to have a lottery pick coming from NY.

 

[BenDavis503]

I want Bosh lol

 

[J_Ray]

As Ed O keeps bringing up is that Evan Turner doesn't have 3pt range, but it makes Evan Turner a better comparison to Rip Hamilton than Brandon Roy. To tell the truth though, that's more of what Utah needs anyways since Sloan's flex offense gets you more 15-18 footers for the swingmen, and easy lay-ups, than 3pt shots. For a team like Utah, Evan Turner is probably valued higher than Wall @ SG.

 

[rocketeer]

evan turner has 3 point range. if he didn't, he wouldn't be shooting 37% from there(and 44ish% last season). he just doesn't take a lot of shots from there because he can take better shots than that. i don't understand why taking higher percentage shots is a bad thing.