Is Westboro Baptist Church A "Hate Group"?

Welcome to our community

Be a part of something great, join today!

He may have moved to another station, but the truth in his WWW page, along with links to supporting declassified and wikileaks documentation haven't. The New York Times hasn't moved, either, nor have they changed their extremist left tilt.
 
Not sure how this got onto Iraq. Back to original topic, as succinctly as I can:

1. Westboro Baptist Church is a hate group. That is all they do. How this tiny group gets its funding is an interesting question.
2. Saying they are a hate group in no way interferes with their Constitutional rights.
3. Free speech is meaningless if it only applies to nice people. Free speech only has meaning if it covers the most offensive, hateful, despicable, unpopular speech.
4. Defending free speech is not defending the content, let alone applauding it.
5. No one on "the left" supported picketing the funerals of soldiers killed in Iraq or Afghanistan (or anywhere else). Except that Fox News did say the Westboro Baptist Church was part of "the left" and Phelps a Democrat, both bullshit.
6. Free speech is not the same as providing a platform. No one is obligated to provide a platform for these fools. It is entirely consistent to defend their Constitutional rights and at the same time protest major news organizations giving a national platform for this cult of maybe a dozen people to spew hate.
7. Sending young men and women to be killed and wounded in a war based on, at best, misinformation, at a cost of over a trillion dollars, is far more offensive than any speech.
 
News organizations sending reporters, cameramen, and photographers to where these people protest, then giving them a ridiculous amount of press coverage is supporting these people to no ends. The Liberal Media is providing a platform. It is handing them a microphone that would otherwise cost far more than a 40 person organization like this would raise on their own.

This is a 40 person organization. Fringe group. Hate speech, no doubt, but they're no threat other than to disturb the peace. As Sinobas wrote, they could be arrested for disturbing the peace if that's what they're doing.

The liberal media (e.g. not Fox) wanted to disturb the remains of fallen soldiers. They demanded access to their coffins, regardless of the privacy concerns for, or how much additional pain they would cause for the families and loved ones of those soldiers.

Turn a blind eye. Go for it.
 
News organizations sending reporters, cameramen, and photographers to where these people protest, then giving them a ridiculous amount of press coverage is supporting these people to no ends. The Liberal Media is providing a platform. It is handing them a microphone that would otherwise cost far more than a 40 person organization like this would raise on their own.

This is a 40 person organization. Fringe group. Hate speech, no doubt, but they're no threat other than to disturb the peace. As Sinobas wrote, they could be arrested for disturbing the peace if that's what they're doing.

The liberal media (e.g. not Fox) wanted to disturb the remains of fallen soldiers. They demanded access to their coffins, regardless of the privacy concerns for, or how much additional pain they would cause for the families and loved ones of those soldiers.

Turn a blind eye. Go for it.

It would be nice if they would not give them the coverage they seek, but the media is about ratings and profits, and this stuff gets people emotional. A few clips from Fox:

 
I don't see the issue with covering the lawsuits.

But surely there are other 40 person organizations who spew hate speech that could be filmed and given prime time TV air time.
 
Not sure how this got onto Iraq. Back to original topic, as succinctly as I can:

1. Westboro Baptist Church is a hate group. That is all they do. How this tiny group gets its funding is an interesting question.
2. Saying they are a hate group in no way interferes with their Constitutional rights.
3. Free speech is meaningless if it only applies to nice people. Free speech only has meaning if it covers the most offensive, hateful, despicable, unpopular speech.
4. Defending free speech is not defending the content, let alone applauding it.
5. No one on "the left" supported picketing the funerals of soldiers killed in Iraq or Afghanistan (or anywhere else). Except that Fox News did say the Westboro Baptist Church was part of "the left" and Phelps a Democrat, both bullshit.
6. Free speech is not the same as providing a platform. No one is obligated to provide a platform for these fools. It is entirely consistent to defend their Constitutional rights and at the same time protest major news organizations giving a national platform for this cult of maybe a dozen people to spew hate.
7. Sending young men and women to be killed and wounded in a war based on, at best, misinformation, at a cost of over a trillion dollars, is far more offensive than any speech.

repped, nice , well thought out post


If these same people had alligned themselves with occupy..how would they be covered then? I think they would be ignored as a "fringe group" like many of the occupy radicals were..
 
I don't want to spend a lot of time refuting the now long-proven-to-be falsehoods, so here are quickie answers which everyone knows anyway.

If these were “long-proven-to-be falsehoods”, seems like you could provide at least a shred of evidence to support your partisan ranting.

You say that it was a mistake for Big Bush to refrain from starting the giant war which Little Bush later stupidly created.

Would you back up the crap you keep saying, for once? Please quote where I said that. You’re just making shit up.

We were stupid to not negotiate better terms of surrender. It was widely acknowledged at the time that Storm’n Norman was outfoxed by allowing Saddam the use of helicopters when we pulled out. That use of helicopters resulted in the deaths of thousands in Shia-dominated southern Iraq. These were the very same Shia that we encouraged to revolt against the Saddam regime as we pulled out, leaving them twisting in the wind. I don’t understand how anyone could think that we weren’t stupid to accept those terms.

History has proven that War #2 was a monumental error which has permanently destroyed the U.S.

The US is/was destroyed by the Desert Fox? Did I miss the memo that we no longer exist as a nation? Are we not still a world military and economic power? What the hell are you talking about?

Having that stupid war 10 years earlier would have caused the economy to die 10 years earlier.

Again, maybe you could point out where I advocated for this…instead of making up a straw man to kick around. You think the bursting of the housing bubble was because of the wars in Iraq? You seriously put all the blame for our economic woes on the wars in Iraq?

[/QUOTE]History has proven that there was nothing to find that they didn't find. [/QUOTE]

Sorry Bud, but you repeating your same silly mantra over and over doesn’t make it true. Show me proof that Saddam didn’t move his WMD’s out of country before the US invaded. Show me proof that there were no WMD’s at the many sites where he denied access to the UN Inspectors.

[/QUOTE]So who cares if Saddam rebelled against foreigners oversearching for what he knew he didn't have. [/QUOTE]

You complain about MY half-truths? How about you show one shred of evidence that Saddam knew there were no WMD’s in the site that he wouldn’t look the UN look at. (I’d be interested in how you know what Saddam knew, if you would like to enlighten me.)

Your complaint is like whining about how the Blazers win an NBA championship. Who cares how it was done. What matters is that there were no WMDs to find.

Unless you can back up your assertion with something besides your partisan opinion, saying there were no WMD’s to be found is just more made up bs.

Inconceivable because what use are weapons if you make them inaccessible. If Iraq gave them to neighbors, then they didn't have them to use. In effect, they didn't exist.

If I were Saddam, I would rather see my friends in another country (probably Syria) have my WMD’s than to have the US or UN take them. I wouldn’t preclude the possibility that he could strike a deal where he could get the weapon’s back, or part of them back, after things cooled down when the US pulled out. They could then have them to use later.

You thinking that moving them out of country means they effectively didn’t exist is out there where the buses don’t run.

Besides, transporting them was impossible since UN investigators were all over the country watching for exactly that, and watching the few scientists who would have to travel with high tech weapons or they'd get broken, with US satellites looking for such events too.

ARE YOU FREAK’N KIDDING ME??? The UN investigators were all over the country is your best half-truth yet. The UN people were exactly where Saddam allowed them to be, and NOWHERE else. Further, Saddam knew exactly where the inspectors were every minute they were in country.

When did we start talking about high tech weapons? We are talking about drums of chemicals, iirc. I don’t think those are hard to move, and they don’t break when you move them. Do you think that satellites can see the contents of tractor/trailers being driven down the highway?

I'm thinking your statements are are meant to jerk me around, or they are just bone headed, or both.

What do they call you conspiracists again? Tin foil hats? First time I've ever used the term. Face it, history proved you wrong.

What do they call people that make shit up and keep their head in the sand, with their fingers in their ears yelling ‘LALALALALALA I CAN’T HEAR YOU’ to avoid hearing an opinion that upsets their apple cart?

If history has proven me wrong, why can’t you back up a single thing you’ve said with anything but your liberal bias?

Go Blazers
 
Gotta hand it to you warmongers. You are persistent, no matter how few you are, no matter how much you've been proven wrong, no matter how many years you've been rejected by the voters and polls. Maybe I'll read that last post. Maybe I'll respond. I don't have the energy right now to again enter your fantasy world of shining knights vs dragons.
 
Where did I advocate for war? Where is one bit of evidence that I am wrong?

If you can't dazzle 'em with brilliance, baffle 'em with bullshit, right?

Go Blazers
 
The voters think you're wrong. You have quite a mountain to climb.
 
The voters think you're wrong. You have quite a mountain to climb.

The voters think Obama is a muslim and born outside the USA.

If you can't dazzle 'em with brilliance. Indeed.
 
Where did I advocate for war? Where is one bit of evidence that I am wrong?

If you can't dazzle 'em with brilliance, baffle 'em with bullshit, right?

Go Blazers

I'm confused. If you aren't an advocate for the Iraq war......what are you arguing about? Unless Iraq was close to acquiring nukes - and an effective delivery system - the existence of a few barrels of chemical weapons hardly justifies the cost of the war to our country.
 
The voters think Obama is a muslim and born outside the USA.

If you can't dazzle 'em with brilliance. Indeed.

OK, I'll ask you the same question: was the Iraq war worth the cost to the US? If not, what are you arguing about?
 
I'm confused. If you aren't an advocate for the Iraq war......what are you arguing about? Unless Iraq was close to acquiring nukes - and an effective delivery system - the existence of a few barrels of chemical weapons hardly justifies the cost of the war to our country.

To answer your question, this started out with me saying I don't understand how people could believe Saddam didn't have WMD's when we invaded. I didn't defend going to Iraq. I'm not pimping Bush. I'm not tearing down President Obama.

jlprk took offense to what I said apparently, and proceeded to make up a bunch of crap and state his opinion as fact, which I've been disputing.

I must have missed the vote on whether Saddam was hiding WMD's.

Go Blazers
 
OK, I'll ask you the same question: was the Iraq war worth the cost to the US? If not, what are you arguing about?

My view is Saddam needed to be disarmed. He was. We didn't need to nation build. The Iraqis should have sorted things out for themselves.
 
Disarmed of what? He had nothing that could hurt us.

This wasn't some gentlemen's debate over UN measures, which is the impression given in this thread. Bush killed many hundreds of thousands (2 million by a couple of estimates, the estimators apparently not infiltrated enough by Western intelligence) and operated several dozen torture factories.
 
Disarmed of what? He had nothing that could hurt us.

This wasn't some gentlemen's debate over UN measures, which is the impression given in this thread. Bush killed many hundreds of thousands (2 million by a couple of estimates, the estimators apparently not infiltrated enough by Western intelligence) and operated several dozen torture factories.

The internetz is serious bizness, yo!

Go Blazers
 
Yes.

Same with the KKK, the New Black Panthers, and La Raza.

Haters, all of them.
 
http://www.examiner.com/article/calif-limits-picketing-abilities-for-groups-like-westboro

Basically taking away their right of free speech and right of assembly.

A new law in California titled SB 661 makes picketing targeted at funerals a misdemeanor for one hour before till one hour after a funeral service.

Westboro Baptist Church

The new law directly affects the practices of a minuscule church that has received national attention for their obsession with the LGBT community. As part of their campaign, the organization advocates picketing funerals of soldiers or other prominent leaders, and even children, brandishing hateful words against homosexuals and people who condone them.

http://www.aroundthecapitol.com/Bills/SB_661/20112012/

Existing law makes it a crime for a person to disturb, obstruct, detain, or interfere with any person carrying or accompanying human remains to a cemetery or funeral establishment, or engaged in a funeral service or an interment.

This bill would make it a crime, punishable by a fine not exceeding $1,000, imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding 6 months, or by both, for a person to engage in picketing, as defined, except upon private property, which is targeted at a funeral, as defined, during the time period beginning one hour prior to the funeral and ending one hour after the conclusion of the funeral. The bill would set forth related findings and declarations.
Because this bill would create a new crime, the bill would impose a state-mandated local program.

The California Constitution requires the state to reimburse local agencies and school districts for certain costs mandated by the state. Statutory provisions establish procedures for making that reimbursement.

This bill would provide that no reimbursement is required by this act for a specified reason.
 
I like how some people "Maris"; lol. Generalize that a church like this is like all Christian Churches. The myopic mentality in this forum baffles me sometimes.
 
Disarmed of what? He had nothing that could hurt us.

This wasn't some gentlemen's debate over UN measures, which is the impression given in this thread. Bush killed many hundreds of thousands (2 million by a couple of estimates, the estimators apparently not infiltrated enough by Western intelligence) and operated several dozen torture factories.

That's good too. Got a question for you though. So why was he executed by his own people?
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top