Jaynes: Next Blazer trade will be painful....

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ding ding ding... eblazer just said it above

thats the point jaynes is trying to make.... so many fans have different feelings torwards our young guys... that whoever is dealt... tears will be shed.

and from a marketing stand point.... trading rudy would kill merchandise sales big time and dont think for a minute the blazers wont consider that. im saying batum is the odd man out.
wish it was bayless but im betting hes our backup pg next year. also outlaw is also loved by many fans and broy so thats another guy who would be considered painful.
 
MIXUM said:
ding ding ding... eblazer just said it above

thats the point jaynes is trying to make.... so many fans have different feelings torwards our young guys... that whoever is dealt... tears will be shed.

and from a marketing stand point.... trading rudy would kill merchandise sales big time and dont think for a minute the blazers wont consider that. im saying batum is the odd man out.
wish it was bayless but im betting hes our backup pg next year. also outlaw is also loved by many fans and broy so thats another guy who would be considered painful.
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Batum isn't going anywhere. Not a chance in hell. This isn't just me having a man crush on Batum. I'm willing to bet that management values him as just behind Roy, Oden and he's probably about equal with Aldridge in his importance for this team to grow into title contender (which won't be this year).

NO CHANCE IN HELL WE GIVE UP BATUM FOR A STOP GAP CENTER.
 
Well.. people thought there'd be tears shed when we would get rid of Sergio because he was so good with Rudy, as well as Channing because he was so Portland. People will move on. It's a business.
 
alex42083 said:
Well.. people thought there'd be tears shed when we would get rid of Sergio because he was so good with Rudy, as well as Channing because he was so Portland. People will move on. It's a business.
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I think the idea is that the (possible) next trade is "painful" from a talent perspective. Trading away a good guy or a friend of a teammate doesn't keep many fans up at night. Trading away a guy who you can see becoming a really good player someday does.
 
Kaydow said:
I think the idea is that the (possible) next trade is "painful" from a talent perspective. Trading away a good guy or a friend of a teammate doesn't keep many fans up at night. Trading away a guy who you can see becoming a really good player someday does.
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True. I just feel if KP is going to decide to part with one of the young prospects, he's going to make sure we're getting a very good player in return. It's not going to be like a Haywood-for-Batum type swap.
We'll get something good in return for a Bayless or Rudy or whatever, and we'll move on, and cheer him when he comes back with his different team. But we'll be a better team.
 
I think Bayless ability to get to the FT line is more important than anything Rudy can do, whoever is the better player. I would welcome trading Rudy before Bayless.

I think Batums ability to play defense, coupled with his amazing potential (not saying Bayless lacks) is better than Bayless ability to get to the FT line. I would welcome trading Bayless before Batum.

Batum > Bayless > Rudy [IMO]

I would couple Bayless and Rudy for a great big, but not Nic with any other. We need to keep Nic. But I don't really think we need to trade anyone.
 
I don't know why folks are worrying so much about this. My guess is as per normal, KP does nothing.
 
The Batum love is a little ridiculous...

He has shown more than Rudy has? I don't think so......

I wouldn't trade him for a stop gap center like Haywood either.....but out of the three players most likely desired by other teams (Rudy, Batum, Bayless) he is likely the most palatable to trade away....given that you have another young SF named Martell Webster, another young SF prospect named Victor Claver, and Roy's little buddy Travis Outlaw.....ALL at the SF spot still with the team.....

If you could trade him in a package for example to get Haywood AND Jamison or Butler, then certainly you should seriously consider it....

I like Batum, but when he performs like Rudy has in International, Olympic or even NBA play THEN we can have a legitimate discussion about who is the better player.....
 
Blaze01 said:
The Batum love is a little ridiculous...

He has shown more than Rudy has? I don't think so......

I wouldn't trade him for a stop gap center like Haywood either.....but out of the three players most likely desired by other teams (Rudy, Batum, Bayless) he is likely the most palatable to trade away....given that you have another young SF named Martell Webster, another young SF prospect named Victor Claver, and Roy's little buddy Travis Outlaw.....ALL at the SF spot still with the team.....

If you could trade him in a package for example to get Haywood AND Jamison or Butler, then certainly you should seriously consider it....

I like Batum, but when he performs like Rudy has in International, Olympic or even NBA play THEN we can have a legitimate discussion about who is the better player.....
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I think you're right to an extent. The Batum love does get out of hand at times. I really liked his play last year, and his defense is solid, but his offense still needs a lot of work. He was mostly a spot up three point shooter last year. Obviously he's young and he has a lot of time to build on his game. With that said, Rudy was relegated to a spot-up three point shooter as well, and he doesn't have nearly the same defense as Batum.

I love the excitement that Rudy brings to the table, but I also recognize that he will probably be the hardest to keep of the three. My gut tells me that Rudy wants to start. I think Rudy wants to play in a bigger venue. I have a feeling he will never live up to his potential here because of his playing time.

He is a good trade asset because of his excitement, because of his international appeal, and his personality. We need to capitalize on that before his rookie contract is up. We won't have much leverage if people believe we can't keep him.
 
Portland's deep bench Bigs have been a lot better then I'd hoped. Pendergraph and Howard have decent size to guard most other Bigs both bang inside and can also pop a reasonably effective jumper. I've been very impressed with Jeff and amazed that Juwan has turned back the clock like he has. Greg and Joel will probably both be back for the start of next season, so excluding Juwan they'll have 4 Bigs worthy of PT.
BlazersBlood said:
I'm ok with losing Rudy as long as we keep Bayless. We need one of the two to come off the bench as instant offense.

I'd be really torn to lose Batum. I think he has a highest ceiling out of any of our wing players besides Brandon and has a very good chance of getting close to it. He's got swagger and he's still very young.
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you know the old adage buy low sell high? How do moving Batum or Rudy fit with that? I've got to imagine that their relative value would be lower on the curve then it was and might be again shortly but then again beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

I could see Przybilla as part of a package for a decent 4 or 5 making some sense in that his exit avoids a logjam next season. Joel is in a player option year and will either be an expiring or a one year rental with Bird rights attached. Brandon would be about the only wing or guard I wouldn't be open to moving depending on what was coming back. Bayless Rudy and Batum are then one's I'd want to part with the least.

STOMP
 
STOMP said:
Portland's deep bench Bigs have been a lot better then I'd hoped. Pendergraph and Howard have decent size to guard most other Bigs both bang inside and can also pop a reasonably effective jumper. I've been very impressed with Jeff and amazed that Juwan has turned back the clock like he has. Greg and Joel will probably both be back for the start of next season, so excluding Juwan they'll have 4 Bigs worthy of PT.

you know the old adage buy low sell high? How do moving Batum or Rudy fit with that? I've got to imagine that their relative value would be lower on the curve then it was and might be again shortly but then again beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

I could see Przybilla as part of a package for a decent 4 or 5 making some sense in that his exit avoids a logjam next season. Joel is in a player option year and will either be an expiring or a one year rental with Bird rights attached. Brandon would be about the only wing or guard I wouldn't be open to moving depending on what was coming back. Bayless Rudy and Batum are then one's I'd want to part with the least.

STOMP
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I thought that Joels injury takes at least a year to heal. I don't expect him back for the start of next season at all. Remember, this injury is the same one that ended Damon Stoudemires career.
 
thank you hassoos . maybe that will be the wake up call this forum needs on our centers.

pryz wont play until at least 2011... in best case scenario. odens always hurt and will never in his life play an 82 game season. therefore trading for a backup center... is an absolute must now. why wait? we will be right back in this situation nex year. it also means we will have an expirong contract of pryz at the deadline taht combined with miller might get us a pretty nice pg. who knows.

the fact that lots of posters keep saying we have pryz and oden next year are just not getting it.
 
MIXUM said:
thank you hassoos . maybe that will be the wake up call this forum needs on our centers.

pryz wont play until at least 2011... in best case scenario. odens always hurt and will never in his life play an 82 game season. therefore trading for a backup center... is an absolute must now. why wait? we will be right back in this situation nex year. it also means we will have an expirong contract of pryz at the deadline taht combined with miller might get us a pretty nice pg. who knows.

the fact that lots of posters keep saying we have pryz and oden next year are just not getting it.
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Tell us all wise one, what team has a quality center and that is willing to deal them? I'd almost say ZERO. A quality center is the hardest thing to find.
 
Let's just put Lamarcus on Steroids. He may have to serve a 10 game suspension for it, but he will put on mass, and he will get "Roid Rage" to get him over any issues he has in the paint!:ghoti:
 
BlazersBlood said:
Tell us all wise one, what team has a quality center and that is willing to deal them? I'd almost say ZERO. A quality center is the hardest thing to find.
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Brendan Haywood is available but the asking price might be too high.
 
hasoos said:
Brendan Haywood is available but the asking price might be too high.
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Haywood is pretty low on my list for a few reasons:

The asking price seems FAR too high.

His contract ends and we might not even be able to keep him.

He's having a career year, but throughout his career, he's just not that good. Sounds like Jamaal Magloire to me.

--

If Philly is REALLY having a fire sale as some people have suggested and they want to get rid of some salary while clearing room for up and comer Mareese Speights, Sam Dalembert seems like a very attractive option. His contract is big, but ends after next season. He's an outstanding rebounder. He can block some shots. Better scorer than Przybilla. Has played 82 games 4 of the last 7 years.

If we're going to have a painful trade with a lot of tears, I'd MUCH rather rent Dalembert for 1.5 years than Haywood for .5 years.
 
BlazersBlood said:
Tell us all wise one, what team has a quality center and that is willing to deal them? I'd almost say ZERO. A quality center is the hardest thing to find.
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It's not easy, but I don't think we're talking about a young borderline all-star here, we're talking about a decent backup (probably north or thirty) who can start in a pinch assuming Greg goes down again. Using that criteria the kinds of names that pop up are Brendan Haywood, Jeff Foster, Kurt Thomas, etc. I wouldn't categorize any of those guys as "quality" but none of them are complete stiffs either.
 
Cake said:
Haywood is pretty low on my list for a few reasons:

The asking price seems FAR too high.

His contract ends and we might not even be able to keep him.

He's having a career year, but throughout his career, he's just not that good. Sounds like Jamaal Magloire to me.

--

If Philly is REALLY having a fire sale as some people have suggested and they want to get rid of some salary while clearing room for up and comer Mareese Speights, Sam Dalembert seems like a very attractive option. His contract is big, but ends after next season. He's an outstanding rebounder. He can block some shots. Better scorer than Przybilla. Has played 82 games 4 of the last 7 years.

If we're going to have a painful trade with a lot of tears, I'd MUCH rather rent Dalembert for 1.5 years than Haywood for .5 years.
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I don't view him like Magloire at all, because Magloire was 2 years removed from his all star appearance, and we traded for him, not signed him as a free agent. I know what you are saying though, you are saying he is playing hard because it is a contract year. But I would also point out this: It is the first year he hasn't had to split playing time with Etan Thomas. While Samual Dalmbert has been a good rebuonder during his career, much of the rest of his game pretty much blows ass. At least Haywood is not a total retard on offense.
 
hasoos said:
I don't view him like Magloire at all, because Magloire was 2 years removed from his all star appearance, and we traded for him, not signed him as a free agent. I know what you are saying though, you are saying he is playing hard because it is a contract year. But I would also point out this: It is the first year he hasn't had to split playing time with Etan Thomas. While Samual Dalmbert has been a good rebuonder during his career, much of the rest of his game pretty much blows ass. At least Haywood is not a total retard on offense.
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I don't know man. Check their numbers. This season, they score at an almost identical pace. per 36 minutes: 10.3 for Haywood, 10.6 for Dalembert. Dalembert is a much better defensive player, shoots better, passes better. Add to that the fact that Dalembert has played three straight seasons of 82 games and Haywood missed 70+ games last season. Yikes!

PS - Doesn't it say something that a guy couldn't even straight up win the job vs Etan Thomas?

Also, from some things I've read, Philly is looking to straight dump salary. There are other pieces on that team that might make it feel better if we're giving up a couple young prospects.
 
Cake said:
I don't know man. Check their numbers. This season, they score at an almost identical pace. per 36 minutes: 10.3 for Haywood, 10.6 for Dalembert. Dalembert is a much better defensive player, shoots better, passes better. Add to that the fact that Dalembert has played three straight seasons of 82 games and Haywood missed 70+ games last season. Yikes!

PS - Doesn't it say something that a guy couldn't even straight up win the job vs Etan Thomas?

Also, from some things I've read, Philly is looking to straight dump salary. There are other pieces on that team that might make it feel better if we're giving up a couple young prospects.
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This isn't all about numbers. It's about watching them play. Dalmbert has a higher shooting percentage, but you know that doesn't mean he can "Shoot". It means all his points are off of put backs and lobs for dunks. I will give it to you that Dalambert has more shot blocking tools, and is more athletic than Haywood. But Dalambert also has problems defending physical centers, where Haywood does not. Let's face it. The difference between 7.6 points and 9.6 points is one bucket a game, no matter how it is attained. Both average the same amount of blocks per game.

Chances are that if either one of them was actually worth a damn, their teams would be doing a hell of a lot better.

Really what we need is the rebounding/defense. I just don't know if any of them are worth it. Especially for this season.
 
hasoos said:
I thought that Joels injury takes at least a year to heal. I don't expect him back for the start of next season at all. Remember, this injury is the same one that ended Damon Stoudemires career.
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I've heard he should be back for most if not all of next season... I'm pretty sure my source was KP in an interview about a week after he went down. Does anyone have a credible link on his time table?

STOMP
 
so it would seem the time table I laid out is the more accurate speculation... sorry to relay the good news MIXUM ;)

STOMP
 
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I don't know why people are so quick to say that "teams don't just trade their star players for garbage"... financial moves are made quite often that aren't exactly equal in terms of talent. Baron Davis for Dale Davis and change comes to mind. Scottie Pippen for all our scrubs... there are plenty of examples.
 
Jaynes' idea is the result of the fact that we've not only drafted well in terms of talent, but in terms of character. In the Whitsitt and PatterNash days, I could tick off two or three players I freaking HATED on this team. I like every single player on our roster. It will hurt to trade any of them.
 
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