Jimmy Butler wants out? (He does.)

[Boob-No-More]

So the president of basketball ops part of his job is what?

The part of his job he's not doing.

How do you know Taylor even knows the league well enough to make a call on such a major move?

Glen Taylor gave Andrew Wiggins and Karl Anthony Towns both max. extensions. He wants to build around his youth, not the older "Thib's guys". Taylor has owned the Timberwolves since 1994. He isn't some yocal that just fell off the turnip truck. He may not be an excerpt capologist (neither is Thibs). He has Scott Layden to make sure any offered trades meet the requirements of the CBA. He's not operating in a vacuum. He also knows what he doesn't want - Jimmy Butler anywhere around the young players he's invested $300 million in.

BNM

 

[Hoopguru]

BNM - I just don't see Butler coming to the blazers. It would be worth bringing him in if we didn't have to give up CJ and/or Collins.
I then Thibs and the owner would take less to get him out of their division.

 

[Scalma]

The part of his job he's not doing.



Glen Taylor gave Andrew Wiggins and Karl Anthony Towns both max. extensions. He wants to build around his youth, not the older "Thib's guys". Taylor has owned the Timberwolves since 1994. He isn't some yocal that just fell off the turnip truck. He may not be an excerpt capologist (neither is Thibs). He has Scott Layden to make sure any offered trades meet the requirements of the CBA. He's not operating in a vacuum. He also knows what he doesn't want - Jimmy Butler anywhere around the young players he's invested $300 million in.

BNM

Wow didn’t know you were so in tune with the wolves inner workings.

And if he wanted to build around “youth” and not “Thibs guys” why didn’t he stop Thibs from getting his guys?

 

[BBert]

BNM - I just don't see Butler coming to the blazers. It would be worth bringing him in if we didn't have to give up CJ and/or Collins.
I then Thibs and the owner would take less to get him out of their division.

Maybe. But if they aren't in win now mode, maybe it's not such a big deal?

 

[Boob-No-More]

Wow didn’t know you were so in tune with the wolves inner workings.

And if he wanted to build around “youth” and not “Thibs guys” why didn’t he stop Thibs from getting his guys?

He was fine with Thibs bringing in his guys until Butler started clashing with Wiggins and Towns. He gave Thibs the leeway to do things his way and it didn't work. Now he wants Bulter gone and going back to building around Towns and Wiggins.

BNM

 

[Scalma]

He was fine with Thibs bringing in his guys until Butler started clashing with Wiggins and Towns. He gave Thibs the leeway to do things his way and it didn't work. Now he wants Bulter gone and going back to building around Towns and Wiggins.

BNM

Oh is that why he allowed him to sign Deng and Rose? Bet he gets Noah too. He’s got no option but to build around Wiggins and KAT. Butler took care of that himself.

 

[BigGameDamian]

 

[UKRAINEFAN]

I see Miami may be close on a deal; MN wants Richardson and Adabayo, don't know if they will get that. I'd like to say "Jump in there, Neil" but I seem to have lost my hope that this will happen.

 

[Scalma]

I see Miami may be close on a deal; MN wants Richardson and Adabayo, don't know if they will get that. I'd like to say "Jump in there, Neil" but I seem to have lost my hope that this will happen.

There’s nothing Portland could offer that would top Richardson and Bam anyway, short of putting CJ on the table.

 

[Boob-No-More]

There’s nothing Portland could offer that would top Richardson and Bam anyway, short of putting CJ on the table.

What's so special about Josh Richardson? He's 25, a below average NBA player with little, or no, upside?

Bam has future role player/solid starter potential, but will never be close to an NBA all star and plays the same position as the guy they just signed to a max. extension.

They'd basically be getting a below average wing player and KAT's back up.

BNM

 

[hoopsjock]

Miami would have a tough time taking on Dieng. That is still the only chance Portland has.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Miami would have a tough time taking on Dieng. That is still the only chance Portland has.

MIN has said repeatedly unloading Dieng's contract is a requirement for trading Butler.

Plus, adding Bam when they have both KAT and Dieng makes even less sense. Bam would make a nice, much lower cost Dieng replacement. He has the potential to be better and is on a cheap rookie scale contract. But, MIN needs to find a taker for Dieng...

BNM

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

MIN has said repeatedly unloading Dieng's contract is a requirement for trading Butler.

Plus, adding Bam when they have both KAT and Dieng makes even less sense. Bam would make a nice, much lower cost Dieng replacement. He has the potential to be better and is on a cheap rookie scale contract. But, MIN needs to find a taker for Dieng...

BNM

From what I read thibs still plans to try to talk Butler into playing out this year.

 

[Natebishop3]

From what I read thibs still plans to try to talk Butler into playing out this year.

Their owner apparently has no spine.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Their owner apparently has no spine.

Or doesnt want to pay out the cash to get rid of thibs.

 

[Boob-No-More]

This works:



Tyler Johnson makes more than Gorgui Dieng, but his contract is a year shorter. He's owed $38 million over two years, compared to Dieng's $48 million over 3 years.

Still, I would think MIN could do better.

BNM

 

[Natebishop3]

Or doesnt want to pay out the cash to get rid of thibs.

But he supposedly was going to do the negotiating himself.

Reportedly, the Wolves are just ridiculous about their demands.

 

[Boob-No-More]

From what I read thibs still plans to try to talk Butler into playing out this year.

He's just trying to drive up the asking price after the owner undercut any leverage he hoped to have. That locker room would be a disaster. KAT and Wiggins hated Butler before and really HATE him now.

BNM

 

[Boob-No-More]

But he supposedly was going to do the negotiating himself.

Reportedly, the Wolves are just ridiculous about their demands.

They want the best of all worlds. They want to satisfy the owner's desire to build around youth (top prospect and future assets) and Thibs' desire to remain competitive (quality veterans), oh and they also want to save money in the process (cap relief in the form of unloading Dieng's contract). Right now it seems like Taylor and Thibs are playing a game of chicken with each other, and the rest of the entire league, to see who blinks first. No one is going to give them everything they want for a potential 1-year rental of Butler. Few teams could, and none of them are dumb/desperate enough to to so.

BNM

 

[hoopsjock]

Since we most likely aren't getting Butler...

I would seriously entertain trading Turner for Dieng. Even better if they throw in a future pick or Patton or something else.

 

[SharpesTriumph]

Since we most likely aren't getting Butler...

I would seriously entertain trading Turner for Dieng. Even better if they throw in a future pick or Patton or something else.

I'd rather have Dieng the player, but its not worth the extra year at $15 million on his contract. Turner ends one year earlier so we have a year to do something with Dame and CJ before their contracts expire.

Eating that extra year is worth acquiring Butler. Its not worth the upgrade from Turner to Dieng.

 

[hoopsjock]

I'd rather have Dieng the player, but its not worth the extra year at $15 million on his contract. Turner ends one year earlier so we have a year to do something with Dame and CJ before their contracts expire.

Eating that extra year is worth acquiring Butler. Its not worth the upgrade from Turner to Dieng.

You're assuming we'll have cap space to do anything in 2020, which we might not. It's also why I said they could include a pick or Justin Patton.

 

[SharpesTriumph]

You're assuming we'll have cap space to do anything in 2020, which we might not. It's also why I said they could include a pick or Justin Patton.

You can flip that statement too; Your assuming we won't have cap space to do anything, which we might.

Also there are other benefits, Turner contract is more valuable next year in trade. There are benefits besides cap space to lower payroll; luxury tax, MLE, trade restrictions.

All of those factors are more beneficial than the upgrade from Turner to Dieng.

 

[hoopsjock]

You can flip that statement too; Your assuming we won't have cap space to do anything, which we might.

Also there are other benefits, Turner contract is more valuable next year in trade. There are benefits besides cap space to lower payroll; luxury tax, MLE, trade restrictions.

All of those factors are more beneficial than the upgrade from Turner to Dieng.

Which you again ignored the additional asset part.

Also, some believe that Dieng was given a raw deal last year. If he performs well he could possibly have trade value next summer even with two years on his deal.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Which you again ignored the additional asset part.

Also, some believe that Dieng was given a raw deal last year. If he performs well he could possibly have trade value next summer even with two years on his deal.

Not sure about a raw deal, he just lost minutes to better players. His best position is center, where he is obviously not going to steal minutes from KAT. Thibs brought in Taj Gibson, a true PF who deserved to start over Dieng. Sure, Taj is a Thibs guy, but he also is flat out a better fit at PF next to KAT than Dieng is. So, Dieng lost his starting role and saw his minutes drop from 32.4 to 16.9.

Yeah, it sucks for Dieng that they signed a better player, but that's just the way things work sometimes.

Dieng is grotesquely overpaid, but in terms of on court performance, he'd be a better back up center (his best role/position) than either Meyers or Swanigan (at this point). The only question (oiher than do we really want to take on that contract) is, how would he fit next to Collins?

BNM

 

[hoopsjock]

Not sure about a raw deal, he just lost minutes to better players. His best position is center, where he is obviously not going to steal minutes from KAT. Thibs brought in Taj Gibson, a true PF who deserved to start over Dieng. Sure, Taj is a Thibs guy, but he also is flat out a better fit at PF next to KAT than Dieng is. So, Dieng lost his starting role and saw his minutes drop from 32.4 to 16.9.

Yeah, it sucks for Dieng that they signed a better player, but that's just the way things work sometimes.

Dieng is grotesquely overpaid, but in terms of on court performance, he'd be a better back up center (his best role/position) than either Meyers or Swanigan (at this point). The only question (oiher than do we really want to take on that contract) is, how would he fit next to Collins?

BNM

I was on a T-Wolves site and someone posted a big explanation as to the dip in play last year. I forgot the gist of it but basically Thibs was using him incorrectly and his advanced stats in prior years suggest that may be the case. He's definitely not worth that contract but also not bad enough to warrant taking less back for Butler.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I was on a T-Wolves site and someone posted a big explanation as to the dip in play last year. I forgot the gist of it but basically Thibs was using him incorrectly and his advanced stats in prior years suggest that may be the case. He's definitely not worth that contract but also not bad enough to warrant taking less back for Butler.

Actually, his big drop off in advanced stats came a year earlier, when they moved him from back up center to starting PF. Which is probably why they signed Gibson the following summer. As a starting PF, he was playing against better competition and playing out of position. At almost 29, Dieng is what he is - a grotesquely overpaid back up center. Trying to make him into something he is not (a starting PF), just removed any doubt.

BNM

 

[Blazers Roy]

That last answer

 

[Pinwheel1]

Dieng is grotesquely overpaid, but in terms of on court performance, he'd be a better back up center (his best role/position) than either Meyers or Swanigan (at this point). The only question (other than do we really want to take on that contract) is, how would he fit next to Collins?

BNM

Probably not well. My vote in that scenario would be to start Collins at PF where he is the 5th option on offense. Play Dieng at back up Center only.

 

[calvin natt]

I totally missed whatever it was Thibs ever said about loving Evan Turner. That being said you don’t think Neil has offered Evan Freakin Turner and scraps weeks ago and got a hard no immediately? This ain’t happening. Time to turn the page.