Just For Fun...Olshey and the "Whiffed" Lottery Picks

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PtldPlatypus said:
Also true. When calling Meyers a "whiff", the follow should be what the proper pick should have been. One could argue Jeremy Lamb or John Henson, maybe. The intellectually dishonest answer is Draymond Green, but seeing as he was a second-round pick, clearly nobody was taking him in the lottery. But honestly, I don't think he's as bad a pick as people claim. It just wasn't a good draft.
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That's always been my contention that it wasn't a good draft. The top half of the lottery was good, but after that it was a crap shoot and several players in the second round have been proven to be solid players compared to many that were drafted in the first round.
 
CupWizier said:
Only 6 out of 19 players drafted after Leonard in the first round are still in the league.
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Ooh, nice dodge there. You conveniently ignored the fact that, for example, Draymond Green, Khris Middleton, Jae Crowder and Will Barton were drafted in the SECOND round that year.
 
Also, while CJ is a very good player, he was taken 5 picks before Giannis and 17 picks before Rudy Gobert.
 
"Promoted to President of Basketball Operations in 2015, Neil Olshey was named the 10th General Manager in franchise history on June 4, "

"Less than a month after joining the Trail Blazers, Olshey drafted Damian Lillard"

The draft was on June 28th. He had plenty of time to change the pick. Its not like he was not aware of Dame and all the other college players. He was in a similar position with the Clippers.
 
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HAVING SAID THAT: drafting well is incredibly hard, and Olshey is certainly far from the worst at it. But it sure seems like, for example, San Antonio and Utah manage to maximize the value of their picks more often.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
Ooh, nice dodge there. You conveniently ignored the fact that, for example, Draymond Green, Khris Middleton, Jae Crowder and Will Barton were drafted in the SECOND round that year.
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I didn't ignore anything, but the fact that they were drafted in the second round proves they weren't very high on ANY teams radar. Olshey also is the one that drafted Barton so he deserves credit for that then doesn't he?
 
CupWizier said:
I didn't ignore anything, but the fact that they were drafted in the second round proves they weren't very high on ANY teams radar. Olshey also is the one that drafted Barton so he deserves credit for that then doesn't he?
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He only did that because I made such a fuss about Barton. CHECK THE ARCHIVES.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
"Promoted to President of Basketball Operations in 2015, Neil Olshey was named the 10th General Manager in franchise history on June 4, "

Less than a month after joining the Trail Blazers, Olshey drafted Damian Lillard

The draft was on June 28th. He had plenty of time to change the pick. Its not like he was not aware of the Dame and all the other college players. He was in a similar position with the Clippers.
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exactly as every teams GM has tons of info available on any draft prospect regardless of the team they are working for at the time. These same people saying he doesn't deserve credit for the pick would have been blasting him if Lillard was just ok.
 
WesleyMatthews said:
It boggles my mind there are Blazer fans still defending Meyers Leonard. I swear when he's 45 we'll have fans talking about his potential.

If it wasn't for David Vanterpool then would Dame only be a backup?
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If it wasn't for DVP no, I don't think Dame's a Top-10 player two years in a row. I don't think CJ's a borderline all-star and I don't think Allen Crabbe gets paid. Moreover, I don't think Nurk is nearly the defensive force he became and the Blazers don't sniff HCA the last two years.

That said, one can attempt to trash Leonard without bringing DVP up.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
"Promoted to President of Basketball Operations in 2015, Neil Olshey was named the 10th General Manager in franchise history on June 4, "

"Less than a month after joining the Trail Blazers, Olshey drafted Damian Lillard"

The draft was on June 28th. He had plenty of time to change the pick. Its not like he was not aware of Dame and all the other college players. He was in a similar position with the Clippers.
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I find this convincing. It was his job to make the selection, whether or not Paul or anyone else was super enthusiastic.

If you say this wasn't his pick, then maybe Meyers and CJ weren't his picks either - maybe Paul made those too. Maybe Little is Olshey's very first draft pick?

barfo
 
Rastapopoulos said:
He has hogged the spotlight TOO LONG
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Here you go

attaboy.jpg
 
barfo said:
I find this convincing. It was his job to make the selection, whether or not Paul or anyone else was super enthusiastic.

If you say this wasn't his pick, then maybe Meyers and CJ weren't his picks either - maybe Paul made those too. Maybe Little is Olshey's very first draft pick?

barfo
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I dont think Little will count either since we did not have Little in for a workout.
 
I can find a lot of things to complain about with Olshey, but drafting is one of the last things I can find to gripe about.

When you rank the players in each draft after the fact, Olshey's picks consistently outperform than their draft position. That's a win for his drafting ability in my opinion. Even in situations when you say he didn't pick the best player on the board, okay, but if you hold every GM to that type of standard you're basically asking for perfection... In general, I think he's done a consistently good job with the draft.
 
Mediocre Man said:
Dame was, for all intents and purposes, a Blazer before Olshey was hired.

Whiffed on Meyers
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So Neil has nothing to do with the Lillard pick but is responsible for the Meyers pick made 20 minutes after it ? I don't get the logic

Rastapopoulos said:
Ooh, nice dodge there. You conveniently ignored the fact that, for example, Draymond Green, Khris Middleton, Jae Crowder and Will Barton were drafted in the SECOND round that year.
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Which is why it's completely unrealistic to say that we should have drafted one of them with the 11th pick.

Rastapopoulos said:
Also, while CJ is a very good player, he was taken 5 picks before Giannis and 17 picks before Rudy Gobert.
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So every time you don't get the very best player available the draft is a failure ? A lot of GMs must suck at their job then.
 
2012 #6 Damian Lillard
Should've taken: Damian Lillard! Good job Olshey (or WAS it?)
2012 #10 Meyers Leonard
Should've taken: Draymond Green (oops - but then, a lot of people screwed that one up)
2012 #40 Will Barton
Should've taken: Will Barton. But actually should've traded 40 and 41 (Tyshawn Taylor - we traded him) to move up for Khris Middleton.
2013 #10 CJ McCollum
Should've taken: Giannis MVP Antetokounmpo
Yes, sure, a lot of people passed, but the Bucks didn't, and you can always trade down in those circumstances, like the Mavs did when they got Nowitzki
2013 #31 Allen Crabbe
Should've taken: NOBODY. There's nobody good after Crabbe, but we actually had to buy that pick and it wasn't worth it in the end.
2015 #23 Rondae Hollis-Jefferson
I was happy when we drafted him but sad again when we traded him for Plumlee. But as Plumlee got us THE MIGHTY NURK I'm not gonna complain. However:
Should've taken: Josh Richardson (40), Montrezl Harrel (32), Kevon Looney (30)
2015 #41 Pat Connaughton
Should've taken: Norman Powell, or bought a pick a bit higher and taken Richardson.
2015 #54 Dani Diez
Should've taken: NOBODY. Why buy a pick for this schmo? He has stumpy arms and doesn't even look good in Spain. Or, if you like take Quinn Cook or TJ McConnell (both undrafted)
2016 #47 Jake Layman
Should've taken: Georges Niang (50) or FRED VANVLEET (undrafted)
2017 #10 Zach Collins (boy, we're the #10 team, aren't we?)
Should've taken: Donovan Mitchell, Jarrett Allen
2017 #26 Caleb Swanigan
Should've taken: Kuzma, Josh Hart (hey, we could've traded for Anthony Davis!)
Not gonna grade Simons and Trent onward yet.

Overall: not terrible - mostly useful, surprisingly so for second rounders, but could have Giannis, Draymond, Donovan Mitchell, Josh Richardson and Fred VanVleet
 
BonesJones said:
Thats the thing, Ive hated on Olshey a lot, but Ive felt that I've always been fair. I'm not going to ignore things or have bias towards him, like this writer apparently does.
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I don't think calling Olshey a Poor GM is fair.
 
SIeepwalker said:
So every time you don't get the very best player available the draft is a failure ? A lot of GMs must suck at their job then.
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Hey kids, look: a classic example of the false dilemma fallacy! Mixed in with a straw man, too.
 
dviss1 said:
Why do people say this? I've seen this said by more than just you. I saw NO choose Dame.

What evidence do you have to the contrary?
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I am close friends with someone involved with the pick. He was my source for years
 
Rastapopoulos said:
2012 #6 Damian Lillard
Should've taken: Damian Lillard! Good job Olshey (or WAS it?)
2012 #10 Meyers Leonard
Should've taken: Draymond Green (oops - but then, a lot of people screwed that one up)
2012 #40 Will Barton
Should've taken: Will Barton. But actually should've traded 40 and 41 (Tyshawn Taylor - we traded him) to move up for Khris Middleton.
2013 #10 CJ McCollum
Should've taken: Giannis MVP Antetokounmpo
Yes, sure, a lot of people passed, but the Bucks didn't, and you can always trade down in those circumstances, like the Mavs did when they got Nowitzki
2013 #31 Allen Crabbe
Should've taken: NOBODY. There's nobody good after Crabbe, but we actually had to buy that pick and it wasn't worth it in the end.
2015 #23 Rondae Hollis-Jefferson
I was happy when we drafted him but sad again when we traded him for Plumlee. But as Plumlee got us THE MIGHTY NURK I'm not gonna complain. However:
Should've taken: Josh Richardson (40), Montrezl Harrel (32), Kevon Looney (30)
2015 #41 Pat Connaughton
Should've taken: Norman Powell, or bought a pick a bit higher and taken Richardson.
2015 #54 Dani Diez
Should've taken: NOBODY. Why buy a pick for this schmo? He has stumpy arms and doesn't even look good in Spain. Or, if you like take Quinn Cook or TJ McConnell (both undrafted)
2016 #47 Jake Layman
Should've taken: Georges Niang (50) or FRED VANVLEET (undrafted)
2017 #10 Zach Collins (boy, we're the #10 team, aren't we?)
Should've taken: Donovan Mitchell, Jarrett Allen
2017 #26 Caleb Swanigan
Should've taken: Kuzma, Josh Hart (hey, we could've traded for Anthony Davis!)
Not gonna grade Simons and Trent onward yet.

Overall: not terrible - mostly useful, surprisingly so for second rounders, but could have Giannis, Draymond, Donovan Mitchell, Josh Richardson and Fred VanVleet
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This post is asinine. You can do that for every team in the league and end up with a championship caliber team
 
B-Roy said:
I can find a lot of things to complain about with Olshey, but drafting is one of the last things I can find to gripe about.

When you rank the players in each draft after the fact, Olshey's picks consistently outperform than their draft position. That's a win for his drafting ability in my opinion. Even in situations when you say he didn't pick the best player on the board, okay, but if you hold every GM to that type of standard you're basically asking for perfection... In general, I think he's done a consistently good job with the draft.
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In general, that's fair. But he has stubbornly stuck with Meyers, including giving him a contract he didn't deserve, when he might even have bounced out of the league otherwise.
Plus: Olshey has done a lot of low-risk drafting with all those second-rounders, where we count people like Pat Connaughton and Jake Layman as "comparative successes". Yes but you could acquire better than them from the undrafted ranks after the draft. What matters is the higher picks and with his 3 #10s he basically just got an inside-the-park homer with CJ when there was Giannis right there.
 
SIeepwalker said:
This post is asinine. You can do that for every team in the league and end up with a championship caliber team
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So you're saying it's a crap shoot? So maybe we shouldn't credit Olshey when his picks pan out, because he was just lucky.
 
SIeepwalker said:
So Neil has nothing to do with the Lillard pick but is responsible for the Meyers pick made 20 minutes after it ? I don't get the logic



Which is why it's completely unrealistic to say that we should have drafted one of them with the 11th pick.



So every time you don't get the very best player available the draft is a failure ? A lot of GMs must suck at their job then.
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Yes. NO was responsible for the Leonard pick
 
Mediocre Man said:
Yes. NO was responsible for the Leonard pick
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So according to your source, what was the situation with Lillard? Did Paul give him the job only on the condition that he must pick Lillard?
Or is it that on draft day Olshey argued for someone else but was overruled? Or?

barfo
 
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