Politics Kavanaugh Confirmation Hearing, now with New allegations!

[BrianFromWA]

Yeah, she's probably going to lose her seat.

But hey, apparently not everyone is solely motivated by power.

barfo

Or by representing your constituents? But as we’ve agreed on, if her people don’t like her vote they can voice their displeasure at the polls.

 

[Hoopguru]

Not until they solve old style plurality voting. Clinton won the presidency with 42% of the vote. That means 58% of voters voted against him.
Rick Perry won Texas with 39%. 61% against.

That's just terrible. Only this will bring about a viable 3rd party:

Out of fairness to lessor populated area's the electoral vote stills needs to be used. imo
The founders thought about allowing the senate to appoint president and thought about strictly a popular vote but after much though and consideration didn't think either way would be fair.
I agree.

 

[MarAzul]

Or by representing your constituents? But as we’ve agreed on, if her people don’t like her vote they can voice their displeasure at the polls.

So this will be good news for the next confirmation hearing. Likely one more vote for the Constitution.

 

[MarAzul]

Out of fairness to lessor populated area's the electoral vote stills needs to be used. imo
The founders thought about allowing the senate to appoint president and thought about strictly a popular vote but after much though and consideration didn't think either way would be fair.
I agree.

Me too.

Not many States would be in favor of a strictly popular vote. The election would be held in maybe 6 states. The end result could be 6 to 44 by a State count. You could hardly keep 50 states United in one with that sort of election.

 

[barfo]

Or by representing your constituents? But as we’ve agreed on, if her people don’t like her vote they can voice their displeasure at the polls.

Yes. Obviously the job should involve some discretion, not just taking a poll and voting for whatever gets >50%. We could do that with machines rather than senators.

And the job should involve explaining to your constituents why you voted the way you did. I think she did that, but I'm not one of her constituents, so my opinion doesn't count.

And then if they don't like it, there's an election in a month, as you say. All in all, a pretty good system, I think.

barfo

 

[Hoopguru]

If neither party wanted trump why didn't y'all vote him out?

The average Republican wanted Trump.

I think it was more of not wanting a Clinton in that won the election. Wisconsin, Mich, PA, OH,Flor
If the dem's had done a better job of selection someone to represent them other than HRC thing could have been different.

 

[barfo]

Out of fairness to lessor populated area's the electoral vote stills needs to be used. imo

Well, let's examine that opinion. Why is it that you think 'areas' deserve fairness? Is it one acre, one vote - or one person, one vote? Why should the vote of someone in Oregon count less than the vote of someone in Wyoming?

The founders thought about allowing the senate to appoint president and thought about strictly a popular vote but after much though and consideration didn't think either way would be fair.

The founders also thought that women shouldn't vote and that men should be able to own slaves.

barfo

 

[MarAzul]

And then if they don't like it, there's an election in a month, as you say. All in all, a pretty good system, I think.

Well, let's examine that opinion. Why is it that you think 'areas' deserve fairness? Is it one acre, one vote - or one person, one vote? Why should the vote of someone in Oregon count less than the vote of someone in Wyoming?



The founders also thought that women shouldn't vote and that men should be able to own slaves.

barfo

You miss the obvious. The election for President is by the States. It is the Union of States that make up the Combined country.

Each State is entitle to it's state vote of Two, plus the value of it's population.
Seems like a well thought out deal.

 

[barfo]

You miss the obvious. The election for President is by the States. It is the Union of States that make up the Combined country.

Each State is entitle to it's state vote of Two, plus the value of it's population.
Seems like a well thought out deal.

Yes, I went to Jr. High, I know how the system is designed...

And it was a well-thought out compromise at the time. But the country has changed since then, in many many ways.

Might need to revisit that decision at some point, same as with the women and the slaves.

barfo

 

[DaLincolnJones]

Of course not. And of course you don’t.

Well done.

 

[MarAzul]

Yes, I went to Jr. High

Oh, ok. It's hard to tell. Slaves are already gone.

 

[Hoopguru]

Well, let's examine that opinion. Why is it that you think 'areas' deserve fairness? Is it one acre, one vote - or one person, one vote? Why should the vote of someone in Oregon count less than the vote of someone in Wyoming?



The founders also thought that women shouldn't vote and that men should be able to own slaves.

Yes, I went to Jr. High, I know how the system is designed...

And it was a well-thought out compromise at the time. But the country has changed since then, in many many ways.

Might need to revisit that decision at some point, same as with the women and the slaves.

barfo

If you could get congress to ever agree on something or a proposed change maybe it could happen.

 

[MarAzul]

Might need to revisit that decision at some point

Seriously! Why would most of the 50 States want to be part of a country where 5 o 6 of them controlled the election?
It works for you now. But not most.

 

[barfo]

Seriously! Why would most of the 50 States want to be part of a country where 5 o 6 of them controlled the election?
It works for you now. But not most.

In the end, it is people not states that matter. Rule by minority generally doesn't end well. Enjoy it while you can.

barfo

 

[CupWizier]

Of course not. And of course you don’t.

Or it could be the post i responded to wasn't artriculated very well. The fact that you couldn't or won't clarify makes me lean towards my theory

 

[tlongII]

How is this relevant? Are they not humans that are registered to vote and fucking voted?

It’s the way our system works. It keeps the coastal yuppies from completely deciding the fate of the heartland.

 

[MarAzul]

In the end, it is people not states that matter. Rule by minority generally doesn't end well. Enjoy it while you can.

barfo

WTF you talking about? It has been ruled by a Majority of States since the country began. It would take a supper majority to change it,
38 as a matter of fact. Unless you have in mind to ignore that pesky Constitution.

 

[yankeesince59]

Yes, I went to Jr. High, I know how the system is designed...

And it was a well-thought out compromise at the time. But the country has changed since then, in many many ways.

^^^This ! ...and "this" is a point that too many people disregard. The original words to the Constitution were fashioned to suit the times at that time. The US is nothing like it was 240 some odd years ago. We have changed geographically, culturally, demographically, sexually,
ideologically, etc.,...but the Constitution seldom changes in step with the country's conscience...it always seems there must first be an extended struggle to accomplish anything worthwhile.

 

[Chris Craig]

I think it was more of not wanting a Clinton in that won the election. Wisconsin, Mich, PA, OH,Flor
If the dem's had done a better job of selection someone to represent them other than HRC thing could have been different.

I wanted Bernie

 

[CupWizier]

A lot of people working hard, heh!

Yeah, signing a letter is pretty exhausting work.

 

[barfo]

In the end, it is people not states that matter. Rule by minority generally doesn't end well. Enjoy it while you can.

barfo

WTF you talking about? It has been ruled by a Majority of States since the country began.

Yes, I know. I said 'in the end' not 'in the beginning'. I was not describing the current or past situation, I was describing the future situation.
Even today, something like 18% of the people elect 50% of the Senate. Because the states have very different populations.
This demographic trend is increasing. How long do you think people will be willing to let a tiny minority run the country?

It would take a supper majority to change it,

That's no problem, we can get a supper majority by dinnertime tomorrow.

38 as a matter of fact. Unless you have in mind to ignore that pesky Constitution.

Not ignore. Change. It will happen, eventually, if the low-population states insist on steamrolling the high-population states as they are doing now.
That wouldn't be pretty - there would have to be at least a threat to break the country up.

My guess is that people will instead find a way to have a truce, and do what's right for the country at least some of the time. That would involve the senators from East Bumfuck occasionally recognizing that there are many more people that don't raise hogs than those who do.

So as I said: you have minority rule right now. You have control of all three branches of government, despite being the minority. Enjoy it while it lasts.

barfo

 

[MarAzul]

Not ignore. Change. It will happen, eventually, if the low-population states insist on steamrolling the high-population states as they are doing now.
That wouldn't be pretty - there would have to be at least a threat to break the country up.

>>> Yes this is what I thought you meant. It is not hidden.

That's no problem, we can get a supper majority by dinnertime tomorrow.

>>>Well then get it on son! While I have the time to meet and greet you.

My guess is that people will instead find a way to have a truce, and do what's right for the country at least some of the time.

>>> See the above, this will not likely be the discussion when you meet men that like the Constitution.

So as I said: you have minority rule right now. You have control of all three branches of government, despite being the minority. Enjoy it while it lasts.

I enjoy the system and agree with my Grandfather whom came here and told me how grand the place is when I was young. He did in fact use the word "Grand" too. Perhaps you should have heard it. But then I have this sense, we are beyond talk, when we meet.

 

[barfo]

>>> Yes this is what I thought you meant. It is not hidden.

>>>Well then get it on son! While I have the time to meet and greet you.

>>> See the above, this will not likely be the discussion when you meet men that like the Constitution.


I enjoy the system and agree with my Grandfather whom came here and told me how grand the place is when I was young. He did in fact use the word "Grand" too. Perhaps you should have heard it also, but then I have this sense, we are beyond talk, when we meet.

Then war it is boys! Load up the muskets!

barfo

 

[BrianFromWA]

^^^This ! ...and "this" is a point that too many people disregard. The original words to the Constitution were fashioned to suit the times at that time. The US is nothing like it was 240 some odd years ago. We have changed geographically, culturally, demographically, sexually,
ideologically, etc.,...but the Constitution seldom changes in step with the country's conscience...it always seems there must first be an extended struggle to accomplish anything worthwhile.

Here's where I disagree. The American experiment has made us better than just about any other country. Our checks and balances make it so that we can change things as they become necessary (abolition of slavery, the franchise, etc) but make it really hard to fundamentally change the country and who we are. If you don't like it, find a place where you can change to be something that Constitution says we aren't. No one's stopping you, unless it's one of the other 190+ countries around the world with strict entrance laws.

 

[MarAzul]

Load up the muskets

I do not have a musket.

 

[barfo]

Here's where I disagree. The American experiment has made us better than just about any other country. Our checks and balances make it so that we can change things as they become necessary (abolition of slavery, the franchise, etc) but make it really hard to fundamentally change the country and who we are. If you don't like it, find a place where you can change to be something that Constitution says we aren't. No one's stopping you, unless it's one of the other 190+ countries around the world with strict entrance laws.

Yes, it's hard but it can be done when necessary, so maybe instead of take a hike, get to work would be a better piece of advice?

barfo

 

[barfo]

I do not have a musket.

Hah! Then prepare to surrender.

barfo

 

[MarAzul]

Yes, it's hard but it can be done when necessary, so maybe instead of take a hike, get to work would be a better piece of advice?

>>>Well then get it on son! While I have the time to meet and greet you.

barfo

Hah! Then prepare to surrender.

barfo

Nuts!

 

[yankeesince59]

The only reason Trump was elected was because he was the only one on the ballot not named Hillary fucking Clinton.

 

[yankeesince59]

Here's where I disagree. The American experiment has made us better than just about any other country. Our checks and balances make it so that we can change things as they become necessary (abolition of slavery, the franchise, etc) but make it really hard to fundamentally change the country and who we are. If you don't like it, find a place where you can change to be something that Constitution says we aren't. No one's stopping you, unless it's one of the other 190+ countries around the world with strict entrance laws.

...you said you "disagree" but I don't see how what you said/meant differs from what I said/meant.