Knicks considering Stoudamire in off season: Article

[jbbCourtVision]

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">SAN FRANCISCO - Damon Stoudamire will tell you he has a history with Isiah Thomas, one that may be strong enough to lead to a reunion in New York next season with his former boss.

Stoudamire, according to sources, is a free agent the Knicks will strongly consider this summer, even if Thomas selects a guard in the draft. Thomas wants to add quickness, experience and another ball handler to his backcourt. The addition of a player of Stoudamire's caliber would allow Stephon Marbury to play more minutes at shooting guard.

</div> Source

 

[Mr. J]

If it happens, it would give us another scorer and some good experience and a good guard as well. I wouldn't mind having Stoudemire around here., the rookie of the year whom Isiah Thomas drafted.

 

[02civic]

mrj18 clear some space in your pm bin man.....sig bet to discuss.

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting 02civic:</div><div class="quote_post">mrj18 clear some space in your pm bin man.....sig bet to discuss.</div>
It's clear, what are you talking about. I have 118 PM's.

 

[Tribute to H2O]

Great...another guard. Why am I not surprised? So next year we'll have Marbury, Houston, Crawford, Penny and Stoudamire. It's just brilliant! Why do we even need Stoudamire any way? What does he give us that we dont already have? I cant figure Isiah out. I suppose signing him wont be that bad if we have nothing better to do than sign a player who will be practically useless to us.

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Tribute to H2O:</div><div class="quote_post">Great...another guard. Why am I not surprised? So next year we'll have Marbury, Houston, Crawford, Penny and Stoudamire. It's just brilliant! Why do we even need Stoudamire any way? What does he give us that we dont already have? I cant figure Isiah out. I suppose signing him wont be that bad if we have nothing better to do than sign a player who will be practically useless to us.</div>
Well, Jermaine Jackson is a decent back up, but he isn't as good as Stoudamire. Penny will most likely be gone by next year, so I wouldn't worry about him too much. Stoudamire can create and allow Marbury to play SG. Yes, I know Crawford was supposed to do that this year, but Herb doesn't utilize that matchup that well. Stoudamire can give us a huge spark off the bench, and plus we'll more than likely use our MLE or something low priced to get him, so it can't hurt us all that much. Stoudamire dropped 54 points this year I beleive, and him not having to do everything like he has to do in Portland will allow him to be more useful for us. I don't think Damon will be expensive at all and if he isn't what do we have to lose?

 

[JWohl]

stoudamire

I think it would be great if we could pick him up on the cheap

 

[SuperAMB]

Flooding the backcourt. What's wrong with Marbury at the point......aside from a lot. but he can leas the team and handel the ball. we already have many shooting guards, a role that I think Marbury isn't quite fit to play.

 

[Penny]

I doubt this will happen, so I wouldn't get to caught up about it. I doubt Isiah Thomas is that stupid to add another guard to the roster.

But then again .......................

 

[JWohl]

media

I doubt this is a reality. Every year you hear of big-name players that 'want' to go to the knicks even for less money. Than they all get signed by other small-market teams for more money. They use the Knicks as a way to drive up the price and get the money out of smaller market teams. Like Dampier last year. He used the knicks to get the contract he wanted from Dallas via Golden State. It is probably just a rumor and an attempt to get more money

 

[magicdamo23]

Hes a good 6th man considering the back court talent the knicks have (although its alot of vets not many young ones) but is that what the knicks need?

I'd say a solid starter or a big scorer in the post

 

[Gohn]

I think that would be a terrible move. I basically agree with what everyone has siad, about overloading the backcourt with too many guards. Stoudamire isnt that great PG anyways, he's more of a shoot first guard. Not a good thing, since alot of the players on the Knicks need the ball to be effective.

 

[og15]

Yup, their's really no need IMO, already have Marbury and Crawford in the backcourt, and no need wasting money on a backup who won't have too much impact on the team in that role really.

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting og15:</div><div class="quote_post">Yup, their's really no need IMO, already have Marbury and Crawford in the backcourt, and no need wasting money on a backup who won't have too much impact on the team in that role really.</div>
But if we can get Damon at a cheap price, what do we have to lose? The Knicks backcourt is solid and adding another player to it wouldn't be too bad. The Knicks have a solid player in Jermaine Jackson, but a Damon Stoudamire would definitely not hurt imo/

 

[Trip]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">But if we can get Damon at a cheap price, what do we have to lose? The Knicks backcourt is solid and adding another player to it wouldn't be too bad. The Knicks have a solid player in Jermaine Jackson, but a Damon Stoudamire would definitely not hurt imo/</div>
Yeah, wouldn't hurt. Thing is: Knicks have just a $4.9 mil MLE to use. Instead of signing a point guard like Stoudamire with that money, why not bring in a center, one that you guys desperately need, even if you want to continue believing that your frontcourt is fine the way it is? Unless you can work out a sign-n-trade for Stoudamire and lose either Houston or Hardaway in the process, the deal would be unwise. The Blazers did the same thing with Daniels, Stoudamire and McInnis at point a few years back, and that didn't work. How would playing time be doled out in this situation?

 

[B.e.]

It would only be worth it if the Knicks were able to sign him to a cheaper contract. I just have that feeling that Damon still wants big money. The only reason the Knicks would need him would be to add depth to the backcourt which they don't even really need.

 

[og15]

I think Trip explained it for me, when you only have one MLE, why waste it on a player you really don't need? Yea as a last option, okay it's fine, but I'd think the Knicks need a center more than a PG.

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Trip:</div><div class="quote_post">Yeah, wouldn't hurt. Thing is: Knicks have just a $4.9 mil MLE to use. Instead of signing a point guard like Stoudamire with that money, why not bring in a center, one that you guys desperately need, even if you want to continue believing that your frontcourt is fine the way it is? Unless you can work out a sign-n-trade for Stoudamire and lose either Houston or Hardaway in the process, the deal would be unwise. The Blazers did the same thing with Daniels, Stoudamire and McInnis at point a few years back, and that didn't work. How would playing time be doled out in this situation?</div>
I never said the frontcourt was fine, we just need a big man. In the draft, we can get a couple of bigs. Plus I think Isiah will do something about our expiring contracts. If the Knicks can sign at the very least, a decent center, than that would go over Stoudamire. If no center is interested, I have faith in Jackie and the draft so I don't think we will need to sign anyone else for the MLE. For example, if the Knicks can get Big Z, Chandler, Swift, Curry or Kwame for the MLE, than that is what I'd take over Damon.

 

[Trip]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">I never said the frontcourt was fine, we just need a big man. In the draft, we can get a couple of bigs. Plus I think Isiah will do something about our expiring contracts. If the Knicks can sign at the very least, a decent center, than that would go over Stoudamire. If no center is interested, I have faith in Jackie and the draft so I don't think we will need to sign anyone else for the MLE. For example, if the Knicks can get Big Z, Chandler, Swift, Curry or Kwame for the MLE, than that is what I'd take over Damon.</div>
If I were you, I would take any of those guys too. I don't know though...the way the Knicks are shaped, the only way that they would be able to sign a player who is going to get more than the MLE is through sign-n-trade, and the thing is you have no one to be able to trade. Ilgauskas, Swift and Curry would get $50-$60 million deals for sure, and Chandler and Brown might be gettable for the MLE. If you want Ilgauskas, Swift or Curry, I guess you'll have to trade picks or guys like Sweetney or Ariza, which I'm sure won't happen. Even if you don't get anybody who'll help, The Knicks still shouldn't sign Stoudamire if they can't lose one of their backcourt players. If you do get Stoudamire, you'll have five players deserving of minutes and starting spots who will have to share 96 minutes, maybe 110 tops if Hardaway shifts to small forward at times. Why create a jam at the one and two if your backcourt is already pretty strong IMO?

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Trip:</div><div class="quote_post">If I were you, I would take any of those guys too. I don't know though...the way the Knicks are shaped, the only way that they would be able to sign a player who is going to get more than the MLE is through sign-n-trade, and the thing is you have no one to be able to trade. Ilgauskas, Swift and Curry would get $50-$60 million deals for sure, and Chandler and Brown might be gettable for the MLE. If you want Ilgauskas, Swift or Curry, I guess you'll have to trade picks or guys like Sweetney or Ariza, which I'm sure won't happen. Even if you don't get anybody who'll help, The Knicks still shouldn't sign Stoudamire if they can't lose one of their backcourt players. If you do get Stoudamire, you'll have five players deserving of minutes and starting spots who will have to share 96 minutes, maybe 110 tops if Hardaway shifts to small forward at times. Why create a jam at the one and two if your backcourt is already pretty strong IMO?</div>
The Knicks have Tim Thomas and Penny Hardaway who both have expiring contracts. Why can't they use that in a sign and trade deal? Picks and young players for the likes of Ilgauskas, Curry, and Swift? I beg to differ. I doubt the Knicks don't need to, nor should give up young stars for temporary comfort. I don't think Swift and company would get that much money, but if they do, I would not want the Knicks to use their trading pawns on them. Since you suggested getting a center, anyone come to mind who we can use for the MLE?

Well as I said before, Hardaway can be gone after this season, so don?t count on him staying. Even if he?s still around, I think the main goal of the Knicks is to win. If the Knicks are wining, I don?t think that the distribution of minutes will be a huge factor. Adding Stoudamire will give us much depth at that position. Stoudamire can give us energy and a spark off the bench. If the experiment in Portland did not turn out well, what is the guarantee of it happening with the Knicks? Even if it doesn?t turn out well for the Knicks, we can easily trade him with a more than reasonable MLE contract. I see this being a move of depth that can easily be taken care of if it doesn?t turn out well. It seems like a win-win situation for the Knicks.

 

[Tribute to H2O]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">The Knicks have Tim Thomas and Penny Hardaway who both have expiring contracts. Why can't they use that in a sign and trade deal? Picks and young players for the likes of Ilgauskas, Curry, and Swift? I beg to differ. I doubt the Knicks need to, nor should give up young stars for temporary comfort. I don't think Swift and company would get that much money, but if they do, I would not want the Knicks to use their trading pawns on them. Since you suggested getting a center, anyone come to mind who we can use for the MLE?

Well as I said before, Hardaway can be gone after this season, so don?t count on him staying. Even if he?s still around, I think the main goal of the Knicks is to win. If the Knicks are wining, I don?t think that the distribution of minutes will be a huge factor. Adding Stoudamire will give us much depth at that position. Stoudamire can give us energy and a spark off the bench. If the experiment in Portland did not turn out well, what is the guarantee of it happening with the Knicks? Even if it doesn?t turn out well for the Knicks, we can easily trade him with a more than reasonable MLE contract. I see this being a move of depth that can easily be taken care of if it doesn?t turn out well. It seems like a win-win situation for the Knicks.</div>

Ummm...There really is no point to signing Stoudamire. You're right when you say it couldnt hurt but it really wont help either unless of course you want to make sure Ariza gets absolutely no playing time next season. Next season we'll have Marbury, Crawford, Houston and Hardaway at the guard positions. Ariza can play backup to TT and get some minutes there. If we get Stoudamire he'll be the back up point guard or shooting guard, Penny will be the back up small forward and Ariza will be a bench warmer. I'm sure you dont want that. Crawford will be that spark off the bench we need. Signing Stoudamire doesnt really make any sense since were more than solid in the backcourt.

 

[Trip]

If I were the Knicks I would look at Dale Davis, Zeljko Rebraca, Alonzo Mourning, Dan Gadzuric, Zaza Pachulia, Mark Madsen, Sam Dalembert and Jerome James. None of these guys are marquee players but could all be good for 20 minutes of hard work and in the cases of Davis, Rebraca, Mourning and Dalembert, 30 minutes and numbers in the 10/8 range. I'd say their size and defensive abilities would sure beat having 6-8 Kurt Thomas banging with the likes of Shaq and Ilgauskas in the East. Having a true center would somewhat help New York get away with little size at other positions.

And if you think Damon Stoudamire, he of 5 feet 10 inches and 32 years of age, would be a hot trade commodity on a MLE contract, you are seriously overestimating the scale on which trades are balanced in the NBA.

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Trip:</div><div class="quote_post">If I were the Knicks I would look at Dale Davis, Zeljko Rebraca, Alonzo Mourning, Dan Gadzuric, Zaza Pachulia, Mark Madsen, Sam Dalembert and Jerome James. None of these guys are marquee players but could all be good for 20 minutes of hard work and in the cases of Davis, Rebraca, Mourning and Dalembert, 30 minutes and numbers in the 10/8 range. I'd say their size and defensive abilities would sure beat having 6-8 Kurt Thomas banging with the likes of Shaq and Ilgauskas in the East. Having a true center would somewhat help New York get away with little size at other positions.</div>
Madsen is 6'9 just like Kurt Thomas, and why would Mourning not re-sign with the Heat? Dalembert is a nice young player, why can't he get that same contract like Curry? The other guys are decent. Kurt Thomas at 6?9 is undersized, but he is a very good player and is quite solid. As I said before, they should be signed over Stoudamire.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">And if you think Damon Stoudamire, he of 5 feet 10 inches and 32 years of age, would be a hot trade commodity on a MLE contract, you are seriously overestimating the scale on which trades are balanced in the NBA.</div>
If you have a decent point guard for only the MLE, I think it can be useful. This same point guard of 5 feet 10 inches and 32 years of age, managed to score 54 points this season. If you don?t think Damon Stoudamire could not be useful in a potential trade because of him being so inexpensive, than you are serious underrating the scale on which trades are balanced in the NBA.

 

[Trip]

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">
Madsen is 6'9 just like Kurt Thomas, and why would Mourning not re-sign with the Heat? Dalembert is a nice young player, why can't he get that same contract like Curry? The other guys are decent. Kurt Thomas at 6?9 is undersized, but he is a very good player and is quite solid. As I said before, they should be signed over Stoudamire.</div>
I just listed the guys I think could be ideal for the Knicks and could come for around the MLE or less, as per your request. Whether they sign or not is out of my prediction.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">If you have a decent point guard for only the MLE, I think it can be useful. This same point guard of 5 feet 10 inches and 32 years of age, managed to score 54 points this season. If you don?t think Damon Stoudamire could not be useful in a potential trade because of him being so inexpensive, than you are serious underrating the scale on which trades are balanced in the NBA.</div>Let's say Stoudamire receives a three year, $15 million contract. That will be the same as Morris Peterson. Would anyone outside of Rob Babcock trade Mo Pete for Stoudamire?

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Trip:</div><div class="quote_post">I just listed the guys I think could be ideal for the Knicks and could come for around the MLE or less, as per your request. Whether they sign or not is out of my prediction.</div>
Some of them such as Madsen would not be as ideal as you claim. How is Mark Madsen banging with some of the east?s elite any different from Kurt Thomas?

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Let's say Stoudamire receives a three year, $15 million contract. That will be the same as Morris Peterson. Would anyone outside of Rob Babcock trade Mo Pete for Stoudamire?</div>
Let?s say Stoudamire signs a 1 year 4 million dollar contract. Even if he signed a contract like that, who said the trade has to be straight up?

 

[Trip]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting mrj18:</div><div class="quote_post">Some of them such as Madsen would not be as ideal as you claim. How is Mark Madsen banging with some of the east?s elite any different from Kurt Thomas?


Let?s say Stoudamire signs a 1 year 4 million dollar contract. Even if he signed a contract like that, who said the trade has to be straight up?</div>
Mark Madsen would probably come for cheap, and as I said before, could be good for 20 minutes of hard work. You could use the money left over from signing Madsen to sign someone like Pachulia, Gadzuric or James to round out your center position.

As for Stoudamire, I doubt he would settle for a one year contract at his age. Long term security is what players in their 30's go after, and I don't think that Stoudamire would settle for such a pitiful contract even from someone like Thomas when he could probably get longer-term and bigger contracts from teams wanting some experience and shooting at point guard. After all, like you said, he once scored 54 points this season.

 

[Mr. J]

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Trip:</div><div class="quote_post">Mark Madsen would probably come for cheap, and as I said before, could be good for 20 minutes of hard work. You could use the money left over from signing Madsen to sign someone like Pachulia, Gadzuric or James to round out your center position.</div>
How will he help our center position that much. He is undersized and is not even a center in which we need so desperately to quote you. I doubt there would be enough money left over to sign two of these players splitting just a $4.9 million MLE like you said.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">As for Stoudamire, I doubt he would settle for a one year contract at his age. Long term security is what players in their 30's go after, and I don't think that Stoudamire would settle for such a pitiful contract even from someone like Thomas when he could probably get longer-term and bigger contracts from teams wanting some experience and shooting at point guard. After all, like you said, he once scored 54 points this season.</div>
Maybe not one, but maybe two years. I mean he only is 5 feet and 10 inches and 32 years old. The Knicks can get him cheaply and for a short period of time and if it doesn?t work out, what will the problem be? We have absolutely nothing to lose.

 

[Trip]

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">How will he help our center position that much. He is undersized and is not even a center in which we need so desperately to quote you. I doubt there would be enough money left over to sign two of these players splitting just a $4.9 million MLE like you said.
</div>Yeah, Madsen isn't a true center, but he'll do in the East. He's more of a traditional center than Kurt Thomas is. And btw, it isn't likely that someone like Jerome James, Pachulia or Gadzuric would get a contract any bigger than $3 mil per year. They aren't high-profile free agents.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">
Maybe not one, but maybe two years. I mean he only is 5 feet and 10 inches and 32 years old. The Knicks can get him cheaply and for a short period of time and if it doesn?t work out, what will the problem be? We have absolutely nothing to lose.</div>You have a whole season to lose if this "experiment" doesn't work out. You might also lose important development time for young players, especially Ariza whose minutes would be cut if Damon is signed and Hardaway moves to small forward. And it's not very easy to move a guy like Hardaway because no one would want to take on his $12 million even if he has an expiring contract. The Knicks would have to take back a lot in salaries if the other team's motive is a salary dump.

As for Stoudamire's contract, I would be willing to wager a sig bet that he would sign a contract at least three years in length. Willing to take me on?

 

[JWohl]

lets go

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Trip:</div><div class="quote_post">You have a whole season to lose if this "experiment" doesn't work out. You might also lose important development time for young players, especially Ariza whose minutes would be cut if Damon is signed and Hardaway moves to small forward. And it's not very easy to move a guy like Hardaway because no one would want to take on his $12 million even if he has an expiring contract. The Knicks would have to take back a lot in salaries if the other team's motive is a salary dump.</div>
Why not? the point of the potential trade would be for the other team to be able to clear up 12 million dollars. The bigger the contract the better it is for the other team. The knicks could get another huge contract, a talanted problamatic player (Rasheed, Artest) a talented injury prone player (BDiddy) or an aging good player.

 

[LakeTown]

Hell no, why would the knicks want Damon, they got Marbury and Crawford, and common they got to PGs, LEAVE DAMON IN PORTLAND. The thing also i dont see how he can be helpfull to the knicks who have "the best pointguard in the league"

I mean they just gonna fight over minutes odds are the management is gonna grant marbury the benefit of the doubt, and damon is not ready to take a second role just yet.